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-   -   Colnago Titanio (http://www.bikeforums.net/classic-vintage-bicycles-what-s-worth-appraisals-inquiries/936659-colnago-titanio.html)

maki.dm 03-04-14 07:12 AM

Colnago Titanio
 
5 Attachment(s)
Hello,

Please let me know if this is worth $675.

It was just posted today on classifieds in my area.

I believe I might be able to get it down to $400.

http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=367077

http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=367079

http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=367080

http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=367081

http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=367082

Very narrow range of pictures I know, I will be requesting wider shots.

I'm very intrigued by the twin tubes and the fact that it's a titanium frame makes me think this might be very worthwhile.

Does anyone know anything about this bike and history?

Any idea of the size from these pics?

Looking forward to what people think.

Thanks!

digger531 03-04-14 07:42 AM

Can't tell anything from the pics except that the rear mech and brakes seem to be in nice condition. If it is a Colnago, it is easily worth the asking price (not that you should give that) and will be gone fast. If you are interested you should have already contacted the seller and set up a time to view the bike. Don't ask for more pics or size or weight...just go see it in person. If it seems henky when you get there take your own pics and post them here.

RacerNo.7 03-04-14 12:24 PM

Ye, its cool, its titanium but there are several questions hanging...

Who made it for Colnago?
Why is there a Shimano 600 Tricolore ( EX ) group on it?
( dont get me wrong - those are sweet parts, but I would expect highest lvl group on it )
Is STI working?

I would say it's worth the asking price, and you should go and check it out in person.

KonAaron Snake 03-04-14 12:45 PM

My understanding is that Colnago did make their own ti frames - though they may have outsourced at times too. A local shop owner had one and thought it was a POS. It ended up cracking down the TT on him on a climb. My general view of ti is that when buying ti, you stick to the folks who build a lot of ti - moots, Merlin, seven, spectrum and firefly. I'm a fan of staying in a builders speciality - you don't buy a ti frame from someone who doesn't work with it much and who doesn't have a lot of background in what does and doesn't work with ti frames.

My de rosa Titanio is not as nice as my Merlin in ride or build quality - and the De rosa titanios are better regarded by most than the Colnagos. Is it a solid deal? Yes. Would I want it? Not really.

Chombi 03-04-14 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KonAaron Snake (Post 16547747)
My understanding is that Colnago did make their own ti frames - though they may have outsourced at times too. A local shop owner had one and thought it was a POS. It ended up cracking down the TT on him on a climb. My general view of ti is that when buying ti, you stick to the folks who build a lot of ti - moots, Merlin, seven, spectrum and firefly. I'm a fan of staying in a builders speciality - you don't buy a ti frame from someone who doesn't work with it much and who doesn't have a lot of background in what does and doesn't work with ti frames.

My de rosa Titanio is not as nice as my Merlin in ride or build quality - and the De rosa titanios are better regarded by most than the Colnagos. Is it a solid deal? Yes. Would I want it? Not really.

+1 on staying with manufacturers that are "experienced" in building bikes in specific materials.
A good example of a manufacturer not being able to handle a certain bike design format is Peugeot. Peugeot tried to figure out a new design for their own (Not Vitus) aluminum bike in the late 80's and it eventually led to the huge Comete/Galaxie bike debacle for them.....
Not saying that this Colnago Ti bike is a bad design, as I never owned one to know, but there certainly is something to staying with manufacturers that will most likely be best equipped to produce certain types of bikes....

gomango 03-04-14 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KonAaron Snake (Post 16547747)
My understanding is that Colnago did make their own ti frames - though they may have outsourced at times too. A local shop owner had one and thought it was a POS. It ended up cracking down the TT on him on a climb. My general view of ti is that when buying ti, you stick to the folks who build a lot of ti - moots, Merlin, seven, spectrum and firefly. I'm a fan of staying in a builders speciality - you don't buy a ti frame from someone who doesn't work with it much and who doesn't have a lot of background in what does and doesn't work with ti frames.

My de rosa Titanio is not as nice as my Merlin in ride or build quality - and the De rosa titanios are better regarded by most than the Colnagos. Is it a solid deal? Yes. Would I want it? Not really.

I love Colnagos, but not this one.

I have personally cracked one of these babies.

I was highly irritated by this, as I had owned it for a week.

Pro tip: Keep looking. You'll find a nice Colnago or something suitable, but I don't think it should be this one.

CenturionIM 03-04-14 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gomango (Post 16548489)
I have personally cracked one of these babies.

I was highly irritated by this, as I had owned it for a week.

Wow, your quads can output 500Watt?

Chombi 03-04-14 06:11 PM

I just hope that all this cracking Ti talk will not lead to people thinking that Ti tubes cracks eventually on most or all Ti bikes. Just like all the talk about how many cycles of stress an Al bike can take before it cracks.....:rolleyes:
I always thought that Ti tubing was supposedly the formula for what could be close to a "forever" lasting bike frame??...

gomango 03-04-14 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CenturionIM (Post 16548522)
Wow, your quads can output 500Watt?

Nope, just a crappy build on the frameset.

Fyi There's a history on this frameset and it isn't stellar.

gomango 03-04-14 09:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chombi (Post 16548624)
I just hope that all this cracking Ti talk will not lead to people thinking that Ti tubes cracks eventually on most or all Ti bikes. Just like all the talk about how many cycles of stress an Al bike can take before it cracks.....:rolleyes:
I always thought that Ti tubing was supposedly the formula for what could be close to a "forever" lasting bike frame??...

It's all in the builder and in this case, it was a flop.

zazenzach 03-04-14 11:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RacerNo.7 (Post 16547693)
Ye, its cool, its titanium but there are several questions hanging...

Who made it for Colnago?
Why is there a Shimano 600 Tricolore ( EX ) group on it?
( dont get me wrong - those are sweet parts, but I would expect highest lvl group on it )
Is STI working?

I would say it's worth the asking price, and you should go and check it out in person.

eh... 600 EX (6200 series) is a different generation and completly different from 600 Ultegra (6400 series) "Tricolor"

Many top of the line framesets forgoed Dura Ace and had 600 Ultegra during the late 80's - early 90's (to reserve the DA for the aluminium framesets), whereas that would not have been the case during the EX era

KonAaron Snake 03-05-14 06:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chombi (Post 16548624)
I just hope that all this cracking Ti talk will not lead to people thinking that Ti tubes cracks eventually on most or all Ti bikes. Just like all the talk about how many cycles of stress an Al bike can take before it cracks.....:rolleyes:
I always thought that Ti tubing was supposedly the formula for what could be close to a "forever" lasting bike frame??...

Ti is unforgiving of error, my understanding (and I'm not an expert) is there can be issues if oxygen gets into the welding process. When it's done properly, it's a great frame material - but mistakes are easier to make and the results are more serious. That's why I always advise buying ti from people who work with mostly ti.

You're talking about fatigue - aluminum and ti are different - the cracks that you are talking about don't occur with ti over time. I've heard that aluminum bikes are so over engineered that the limit is laregly hypothetical with them, but it absolutely exists.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatigue_limit

gioscinelli 03-05-14 07:34 AM

Go and buy the Colnago Titanio it's worth the money!

repechage 03-05-14 08:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gioscinelli (Post 16549803)
Go and buy the Colnago Titanio it's worth the money!

I would call it a $400. gamble that you could recoup at least half should it crack.
The problem is the back purging of the weld area (or lack of it actually) unseen problems of as stated oxygen contaminating the weld.
On those narrow down tubes the purge tubes need to be way down near the weld zone, and if you don't run the purge (inert gas) for a decent length of time before the weld... bad things happen.

gioscinelli 03-05-14 08:18 AM

Your right about the construction quality and method. Assuming that the OP has presents of mind, the value is based on condition and manufacture. The parts alone will pay for the frame when parted out.

jet sanchEz 03-05-14 06:22 PM

Colnago Bititans bring in big money on eBay, I would buy it for the asking price without hesitation and would be extremely happy to pay $400.

spokes5678 03-05-14 11:26 PM

All bikes can crack.
My litespeed vortex and plenty of other vortex owners have cracked.
It took ten years to crack, they repaired it and off I go again, such a sweet riding bike, I just can't quit it.

KonAaron Snake 03-06-14 05:45 AM

Notice I didn't include Litespeed in the recommended list ;) I know plenty of people who are happy with theirs and are fans of Litespeed - some who are very knowledgeable - but I think there are a higher percentage of unhappy Litespeed owners. Perhaps you hear more about Litespeed problems simply because there are more Litespeeds. I am VERY fond of my Litespeed obed MTB frame.

I haven't ridden one (I generally am not a Colnago guy), but I didn't find the one I saw especially impressive in build and the owner didn't like the ride at all. To me it looks like a gimmick from a company not known for the material. Would I buy to flip? Sure. As a bike to own? Not so much.

gomango 03-06-14 05:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jet sanchEz (Post 16552054)
Colnago Bititans bring in big money on eBay, I would buy it for the asking price without hesitation and would be extremely happy to pay $400.

To resell it and make some bucks?

Sure, why not.

To ride it?

Not worth the time. Too many others out there.

lowgear45 03-10-14 07:57 AM

I sold these bikes in-the-day and can tell you that most (over 50%) of these Bi Ti frames broke. Said to have been made for Colnago in Russia, they simply were lemons.

Side comment that Litespeeds are crapping out now in large numbers too, not to same degree but enough to have me only recommend titanium from low quantity/high quality specialty frame makers. ABG/Litespeed is not honoring their lifetime warranty either....

KonAaron Snake 03-10-14 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lowgear45 (Post 16564562)
I sold these bikes in-the-day and can tell you that most (over 50%) of these Bi Ti frames broke. Said to have been made for Colnago in Russia, they simply were lemons.

Side comment that Litespeeds are crapping out now in large numbers too, not to same degree but enough to have me only recommend titanium from low quantity/high quality specialty frame makers. ABG/Litespeed is not honoring their lifetime warranty either....

Always nice to see people more knowledgeable than me confirm my mishegas ;)

Belg-Ital Steel 03-11-14 02:40 PM

Don't know much, but I've heard 2nd hand the same as noted above...they were a poor design, broke often, but they seem to bring good money @ the bay for some reason (rarity?).

ciocc_cat 05-07-16 02:38 PM

2 Attachment(s)
I realize that this is an old thread, but I wanted to mention that whoever built the Titanio frames for Colnago must have also built them for Ciocc because my Ciocc Titan appears to be identical to the Colnago. I must have gotten one of the good ones. It probably was Russian-built since the Russians had an abundant supply of titanium to play with and the stuff was scarce in the U.S. until after the fall of the U.S.S.R., so the Russians had more practice building with Ti.
http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=520289http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=520290

CliffordK 05-07-16 03:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ciocc_cat (Post 18748779)
I realize that this is an old thread, but I wanted to mention that whoever built the Titanio frames for Colnago must have also built them for Ciocc because my Ciocc Titan appears to be identical to the Colnago. I must have gotten one of the good ones. It probably was Russian-built since the Russians had an abundant supply of titanium to play with and the stuff was scarce in the U.S. until after the fall of the U.S.S.R., so the Russians had more practice building with Ti.
http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=520289http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=520290

Do you have the bike?

I think they are similar, but different.

Colnago used a square top tube on the BiTitan.

Also, at least the early BiTitan bikes used a steel fork.

Mine has a ring for the seat tube clamp without ears. And the seat stays look a little narrower at the top.

So, I'd suggest convergent technology (copy), but not the same builder. Or if it was the same builder, it would be to different specs.

I'm not sure about the alloy. I bought my Colnago BiTitan frame with a horribly badly cracked seat tube. They have a reputation for a lot of flex. I'm wondering if they might not have adopted the 6Al4V at the time, although Litespeed and others were using 6Al4V, so I don't know. When I'm ready to rebuild my frame, I'll probably reinforce it some.

ciocc_cat 05-07-16 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CliffordK (Post 18748885)
Do you have the bike?

I think they are similar, but different.

Colnago used a square top tube on the BiTitan.

Also, at least the early BiTitan bikes used a steel fork.

Mine has a ring for the seat tube clamp without ears. And the seat stays look a little narrower at the top.

So, I'd suggest convergent technology (copy), but not the same builder. Or if it was the same builder, it would be to different specs.

I'm not sure about the alloy. I bought my Colnago BiTitan frame with a horribly badly cracked seat tube. They have a reputation for a lot of flex. I'm wondering if they might not have adopted the 6Al4V at the time, although Litespeed and others were using 6Al4V, so I don't know. When I'm ready to rebuild my frame, I'll probably reinforce it some.

Yes, I've owned my Ciocc Titan since late November 2012. I found it on eBay and got lucky bidding. The only significant changes I've made were the saddle and handlebar stem. I suspect it was built in the late 1990s. It is a smooth, sweet ride on rough roads and incredibly responsive. I can make tight, fast turns with it like I never could before. It's a rocket on climbs. Awesome bike!


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