hassouni

Hi BikeForums, first post here. After the better part of a decade not cycling, I want to get back at it. This is a longish post, sorry for that. Important stuff will be bolded.

Brief history: my current bike is a late 90s Novara XR hybrid that I got new when I was around 14 or 15 or so. I used that for several years but I eventually stopped biking because of excess pain in the groin, hands, etc. I recently was on vacation and went biking on rented bikes (generic hybrid types) and I found it fairly painless, and it reminded me what fun it is! So in the last week I've read a lot about bike fit, and I've realized my Novara is probably too tall for me. I'm 6'1" (and male), but I have a long torso and short legs for someone of my height. Anyway in the past week I've discovered the mixte frame design and I really like it. I especially like the easy-on-easy-off aspect, as I want a versatile bike primarily for city use (I live in DC).

I checked out a bunch of vintage mixtes, and several other new and used bikes yesterday, and I think I want to go with a large-framed mixte, with upright/city-style handlebars.

To that end, my favorite of all the bikes I saw yesterday was a 76 or so Raleigh Grand Prix Mixte, made in England (by Carlton? Not sure). Specs: 22" frame; 27" steel wheels; Weinmann center pull brakes; Sun Tour downtube shifters; Huret Challenger derailleurs. Appears to be more or less entirely original. Asking price $245.







Here's what I liked: it's the only 22" frame I've seen listed pretty much anywhere, and is noticeably larger than any others I checked out. As someone who's overall on the tall side, I like that. And I like the low stand-over height, and also the fact that it was lighter than any other mixte I saw. There's also just something quite cool about it (maybe the fact that I'm an intense Anglophile and it's made in England, who knows).

It needs new shifters, which the owner said he'd put on, and he also said he might put on a newer derailleur. Otherwise the only thing it NEEDS are modern brake pads because the stock ones are SLOW to brake. The owner is a decent guy and real bike nut - he admitted that the bike was not as clean as he remembered it being before he pulled it from storage (nor as clean as the pictures make it) - the finish is a bit scratched, and there is some surface rust, though nothing too severe. The frame seemed fine.

First of all, is the asking price of $245 a bit high, especially after he admitted that it's not as clean as he remembered? What might a fair price be? Would installation of a new derailleur, new shifters, and new brake pads, all of which he has lying around, bring up fairly to the asking price?

Furthermore, for a city bike, I think I really want to swap the drop handlebars for a North Road-style or similar city setup, and get bar-end shifters. I've never had a bike with drop bars and I could get used to it, but for the urban environment, upright strikes me as better. The downtube shifters for city riding seem dangerous though, and while stem shifters would be an improvement, bar ends strike me as the best option. (In repairing the broken DT shifter, he said he could put new ones on the stem). I figure a new handlebar, new brake levers, and bar end shifters will run ~$100 in parts if I can get a deal on used shifters. Additionally, I want to add fenders. I have a rack on the Novara I can transfer over, so that isn't a huge deal. In any case, I'm looking at at least $150 or so of extra stuff.

Ideally I'd want index shifting w/ a modern derailleur, and alloy wheels, cranks, and stem, but I'm not sure that'd make a huge difference for a city bike and it's probably not worth the money.

I guess what I want to know is: is the bike in current condition worth $245, and more philosophically, is it worth making the at-minimum upgrades of a more upright setup given what it'll cost compared to the cost of the bike? I saw a couple upright-position vintage mixtes in the $200 range, but none were both as big nor as light as this Raleigh, and none were in appreciably better shape.

Thanks for reading and for the help!

eschlwc

in seattle, a high-demand biking community, that bike is at most worth $120. the cottered crank, steel rims and need of consumables (like pads) bring the value down considerably.

with all your interest in a bike unlike the one shown (upright bars, bar end shifters, etc), i would suggest a newer bike with a sloping top tube already outfitted with your needs.

but if you're set on that one, it can be done. for me, the biggest issue is the steel rims. i would change them.

anyway ... good luck to you. finding a bike is hard work, but it pays off exponentially. stick with it.

hassouni

Thanks for the response. At $120, what would be fair if he changed the brake pads and derailleur, in addition to the required work of fixing or replacing a shifter? And I'm not sure how the vintage bike market works. Would offering half the asking price be considered insulting?

As for new bikes, the other thing is I'm on an extremely tight budget. One of those Linux Mixte 8s or similar new designs would be sweet, but I can't manage that. Even REI's Corsa (which I tried and liked) is $500, but there was nothing sporty about it at all, which the Raleigh should hopefully remain at least to an extent.

I understand steel rims don't brake so well in the rain. Any other problems with them?

oddjob2

In condition as shown, I would pay no more than $90 for it, even in the comparable metro NYC market. I probably buy more mixtes than anyone else to refurbish and have handled quite a few Raleigh's, both Grand Prix and Sprites. Fully refurbished, with new tires, cables, housing, brake pads, bearings, tape or grips, cleaned, lubed, polished, and tuned, the bikes I sell would fetch between $200-$300.00, as shown below. These have been sold.

Tall mixtes are available from Raleigh, Motobecane, and Fuji.

While steel rims are less desirable when wet and due to weight, aluminum rims aren't so hot in the rain either.

oddjob2

Vintage Mixte Fuji

Motobecane
https://washingtondc.craigslist.org/n...481877925.html

Fuji
https://washingtondc.craigslist.org/m...499655895.html

Nishiki
https://washingtondc.craigslist.org/n...492759586.html

Windsor tricked out
https://baltimore.craigslist.org/bik/4463971945.html

Panasonic Bargain
https://baltimore.craigslist.org/bik/4494230715.html

eschlwc

^ panasonic! hurry!

hassouni

Thanks. I've seen several of these, except for the Fuji (more than I want to pay) and Baltimore ones (far, but possibly worth it). It seems that these are more than you think they'd be worth too, no? Certainly the Nishiki and Motobécane I saw are not in great condition and are being sold by a HUGE volume flipper who left me with an uneasy feeling (possibly stolen bikes?) Also, what's the deal with Windsor? They're one of the bikesdirect brands, right?

What's special about the Panasonic?

Yeah, I half-agree with you. I have a modern-ish hybrid, and it's relatively heavy and not really what I'm looking for. I tried a new hybrid and that didn't do much for me either. The townie-style (small) mixte I did try really felt good, on the other hand.

hassouni

Can you tell me a bit more about the Panasonic frame? Is it better steel (531, etc)? Some googling reveals the Sport LX to have been Panasonic's entry-level.

ETA, I found some old Panasonic catalogs online and it says the Sport LX was Chromoly, while a 76 Raleigh catalog says "20/30 race tubing"

eschlwc

^ wrk101 answered your question. i'd buy it (and flip it). someone may beat you to it.

hassouni

Reconsidering this. Is $325 fair?

oddjob2

I would start at $250 and be happy at $275. It's nice and clean, but it has chrome rims. Those cheap Fuji saddles are bit of an a$$ hatchet.

hassouni

Cool, thanks. I did some googling and saw the Fuji-branded derailleur is really a Sun Tour. Decent?