oddjob2

Foremost a collector/tinkerer - your profile shows you have a nice collection! But you seem to contradict yourself:

First you say, "People want rideable bikes, no work involved." Then you say, "But maximize profit by not spending money," to refurbish the bike, I assume? So you aren't serving those who want a rideable bike? And you give up the chance to tinker and are just interested in buying low and selling higher?

72Paramount

What I am saying is that there are two different styles to flipping bikes. I do not think it a service to make a "frankenbike" out of a classic steed. What I was saying is it's better to pass the bike along to someone than to make a frankenbike. That being said flip bikes generally sell for 200 or less in my neck of the woods, and the bikes I talk about doing nothing to generally have frames worth 300+. I hope you get what I'm saying rather than assuming I am of no service to the bike community. I just am not in a position to restore bikes and lose money.

wrk101

Unfortunately, it takes a pretty good bike acquired at a very low price to make a decent return as a flip project. The economics can favor a part out instead. Sadly, several of my projects have gone that route. Even a part out takes work, but it does not take $$ for consumables: tires, cables, housings, pedals, saddles, bar tape, bottom bracket, freewheel, brake pads, and chain which are items many neglected bikes need to be fully refurbished. I am not interested in doing a sloppy superficial job.

On one recent bike I had, to fully refurbish it, I would have been anywhere from losing $20 on it, to a best case making $20 on it, without anything for my time. And this is despite buying it cheap (it was missing some parts, needed a lot of work). So I parted it out and made over $250 instead. I have enough projects in the queue, so I do not have to worry about running out of bikes to work on....

On frankenbikes, more often then not, I am un"frankenbiking" them. So they come in a mess of unrelated parts and leave with a consistent, matching set of parts. Some of the frankenbikes I acquire are parted out, as the missing parts unfortunately exceed the value of the finished project. IMHO, part outs are not evil, as they become a source to allow someone else to complete their project. Without part outs, it would be close to impossible to find era correct parts for many vintage bikes.

72Paramount

Totally agree 110%^^^

wrk101

Way too much information in your ad. Most buyers just want to know if it is clean and ready to ride. The pictures should give most of the information. People don't want to wade through a bunch of details. C/L is a LOT different than eBay. Realize on C/L, buyer can stop by, inspect the bike, and find out any detail they may want to know. On eBay, the only information a buyer has access to is in your listing. So eBay ads tend to be very comprehensive.


Learn to test your market by choosing multiple approaches.

Text from one of my recent ads. On this bike, not only was it tore down to the frame and everything serviced, I bought it incomplete, no brake calipers, no front wheel, etc. None of which made the ad:

"This is a 1985 Trek 460 road bike with a very hard to find 48cm frame size. Suitable for riders 5-0 to 5-5 or so.

It has a double butted cromoly frame, top of the line Suntour Cyclone components, and light weight 700c alloy wheels.


The bike was recently serviced and is ready to ride!




To foil the scammers, name and phone number on any replies."

Velocivixen

@wrk101 - Thank You so much for this feedback! I still haven't sold the bike, so I will rework the ad. In Portland, bike ads on CL automatically expire in one week, so you've got to keep going back and "renewing" it. This is great info.!

chrisarnt

Whats the best time of year to sell my recumbent?
Just after tax returns?

curbtender

Probably best when the weather starts getting spring-like in your area. I haven't sold one, but you'd think the market would be best early in the season for people wanting to try something new.

mark2810

If you're shipping bikes through ebay etc.. go to your LBS and ask if they are throwing away bike boxes. Here in my area, if you visit the dumpster they will have tons of bicycle boxes that you can use and recut to fit your frames.

Most of the boxes I find are outside on the concrete piled up, so I don't have to worry about the boxes being soggy, looking unpresentable/unusable.
This also saves you money on having to actually buy bike boxes which can add up I guess.
There's another young kid in my area who does the same thing I do,
Last week I saw him with a Bianchi Celeste Vintage bike on his shoulder that he only paid 70 bucks for and then 5 minutes later he snatched a FELT frame - high end aluminum for only 100.
I wanted to find the nearest cliff and jump off it.

One thing I do suggest though.. always check if the bike is stolen. Not sure if this kid deals with stolen bikes or even bothers to check it.

In big populated cities like mine.... stolen bikes are very common.

I was able to return a very nice Specialized Allez Elite to a guy in SF after purchasing it from some thug. Got a pat on the back from the police and some reward money.

Karma is karma I guess.

miamijim

As Bill said keep it short and sweet.

Give just enough info in the ad to make them want to call My ad titles vary depending on the bike. For example if I'm selling a Schwinn Paramount I simply have "Schwinn Paramount" as the title. If I'm selling some random bike the title will get more descriptive bot not too descriptive. "Vintage steel racing bike" Everyone and their mother will click on that.

For the body I keep is short as well.

Body: "1987 Peugeot Tourmalet. 54cm frame with a 54cm top tube. I completely went through the bike, it's fully serviced and ready to ride. It has new cables, tires and bar tape."

What more does someone really need? It's only CL....not Ebay.

Velocivixen

@miamijim - I like your wording. I changed up my ad wording and sold 3 bikes in about 10 days!

72Paramount

I sold my last bike in about 10 hours from the time of post. Title was "16 inch Schwinnn Sting-Ray $135" only wording in my description section was "price is firm". Had two guys call on it immediately. The first seemed like a tire kicker, so I sold it two the second guy. Remember when you price things fair, they typically move faster. Getting two calls the first day tells me I'm priced right if not a little low. Also, road bikes are harder to sell. Sometimes I won't get a call on a rb for a week or two, but usually the first caller is all I need to make a sell.

eschlwc

i like that we all have different methods of marketing. my agenda is to myself and my own sense of aesthetic over profit. but the things that we should agree on is honesty and safety.

i work a very specific niche and list less than ten bikes each year. i overhaul and refurbish every one, and all are mid-sized and mid-level with integrated derailleur hangers and dt shifters. they all get new fizik tape too. basically, they're all bikes i would ride myself. this offers peace of mind, because only through several rides do i know they're absolutely perfect.

because i'm in a vintage happy market, only those that are priced well over $400 require more than a few weeks to sell.

the benefit i like about giving a lot of information in my craigs ad is i receive no specific email questions about any bike. i know the guy that wants it really wants it. so i need only answer, "when can you meet?" and my answer is "nearly any dry afternoon, 'cause i don't ride these beautiful things in the rain!"

eschlwc

what's a thread without pics? here are a few examples ...

72Paramount

That orange bike is sweet. It is clear that you do a fine job on your refurbs.

vintagerando

I appreciate the quality and beauty of vintage steel bikes. I ran an ad in the local paper, "wanted to buy old bike...". Originally I was looking for bikes I could ride myself. Well, I received a tremendous number of calls. I found I could buy well made, sought-after vintage bikes for very reasonable prices. So, I picked up a few over the past couple months that don't fit me but have get components. Now what to do with them. The consumables do certainly add up. So, as many of you know, the margin is thin. Even if you buy for $25-50, its very hard to make money. So, I thinking of going the route of selling parts. What are the pitfalls of going the route of selling just components?

wrk101

1. Need to buy better bikes. This is the problem with the lower end stuff. The price to rehab is the same whether it is a $200 bike when completed or a $400 bike (in addition, the $400 bike will have part out potential, the $200 ones normally not).

2. Part outs only work when you have a bike with better parts on them and a desirable frame. A quick check of eBay completed items will tell you if anyone wants the parts. Unfortunately, the vast majority of bikes had parts on them that have very little value. Need to be able to spot parts with value when you buy these projects.

3. Focus on the potential value of the bike when FINISHED when you are buying. Will the bike be worth $125? $200? $300? Etc. Don't know how to estimate these values? Stop buying until you do.

4. What is your capacity? How many bikes can you rebuild in your spare time in a month? One? Two? Four? As the number goes up, you have a part time J O B on your hands. Once you know your capacity, don't overbuy, or every storage cubby hole, garage, basement, whatever, will be full up with bikes. At that point, you will start passing on all deals. You will probably miss out on some great deals while you are full of mediocre to so so bikes.

vintagerando

I have too many B grade bikes due to over buying before I learned the market. Now what to do with them.? I have learned I need to focus on A grade bikes and get them at the right price. But there are a few that fall into a grey catergory. Here's one: 1982 motobecane grand touring. High end bike at one time . Needs x hours to fix amd maybe $100. Purchase price $60. Part out? Sell as is for small profit? Or rehab? Which way to go.?

wrk101

Have to really manage your costs if you go the rehab route, and know your market. Around here, fully refurbished, it might bring $225. Every market is different. If you want to flip, you need to know your market extremely well. $100 in parts? You really need to work on that aspect. No way I am putting $100 into a bike at that level. I just can't get the money out of it.

What parts are on it? Again, part outs don't work unless the bike has desirable parts on it. Mid level is meaningless, its whats on the bike right now, the condition of those parts, and so on.

Condition of paint and decals? Might be able to get $125 for the frame, fork, and headset alone.

vintagerando

Frame is in good condition: 1982 Motobecane Grand Touring; FD: Huret, RD: Huret Duopar, Cranks: Stronglight 99 Triple, Weinmann Concave wheels; unknown headset and BB. Sugino seat post (I think) ,Weinmann 999 brakes

Bruces

I have read about 2/3 of the posts in this thread ,and for the most part loved every minute of it .I am 49 ,and have been flipping things since I was 4 years old ,bicycles ,my brothers hockey equipment all went out the door when I was 4 and it was me flipping it .I retired when I was 35 and now flip anything and everything from bikes ,to figure skating supplies ,skates ,hockey equipment ,trucks ,cars,trailers boats ,so basically anything I know enough about or am interested enough in ,to get involved with .
Anyways ,I buy bikes at the city dump or off of Kijiji ,I know the real brands and buy them cheap or I don't purchase them .I have a good market for bmx bikes ,and for some reason have been able to get more than the bikes were worth brand new ,for used bikes I bought at the dump for $5.00 .I have had good success with beach cruisers even department store ones ,generally purchasers of them see them as a descent robust bike to cruise the local pot hole riddled roads with ,works for me .Road bikes are kind of a useless item around here ,our roads are crap so the market just isn't there .
I would like to say few general flip things ,doesn't matter what it is .When buying something ,do your homework before purchasing .That means ,watch the local area classifieds and get an idea what bikes are selling for what money .I didn't know bmx bikes were keeping there value so well as I am personally too old to ride them ,butI saw a trend of them being listed and sold quickly for good prices ,so I bought a few redlines ,and gt bikes for $5.00 ,and without much more than tuning the brakes and a tube or two flipped every one in the $300.00 range .Works for me and whenever I see them I buy them .
when you are looking to purchase something ,treat it like a job .I search kijiji (pretty much craigslist in canada ) at least a few times an hour .Being first gets you the deal just about every time .This past long weekend ,somebody listed a 2003 polaris atv for $350.00 ,within two minutes of posting it I told him I would take it .I never heard back from him .Anyways I knew it was the long weekend ,figured he screwed off to camp for the weekend ,so I just waited it out .I saw some people copied his pictures from his add ,and put their own add in saying that they wanted the bike ,please get hold of me etc . .The original ad had over 500 views by the end of the weekend .Anyways ,Monday evening everybody is home after the weekend ,so I sent him another message stating I was first and am still interested in the quad .I was nice about it not snotty or anything ,he called me 5 minutes later to tell me it was mine .He said he looked through the hundreds of emails ,and I Was first and deserved it .I am keeping it for a while to do some work with it ,but it's easily worth $2000.00 in its present condition in my area .I can't tell you how much crap I got for nothing by being first in line with cash in hand .I suggest things like "Sold ,when and where can I pick it up ?" And if it's a hot item I have even spread out the cash on the table ,took a picture of it ,then replied to the add so he knew I was a serious cash buyer ,don't laugh ,it does work .
i sell a lot of Canoes ,usually better models not coleman junk .Before the long weekend I sold out of the canoes I had ,but some guy posted one up for $200 that I knew I could double my cash on at least .I picked it up at 4;30 ,and told him he should take down the add before everybody else starts calling and bothering him .The add was down before I got home ,and I re listed it and had it sold and gone before 7 pm ,for $500.00 !I couldn't of done that if he left his add up without being called out on it as he had nice detailed pictures .
One of the biggest things is having ready cash in your pocket at all times .It all comes with being first ,if you don't have to stop at a bank machine you can get there quicker .I once was driving a half hour to pick up a steal on a 2005 neon ,I had to get gas and a few bucks from the machine on the way and as I was pulling into the driveway ,some ass clown was just driving out with my car .I was not two minutes later than I said I would be ,but the girl thought I was not coming and sold it to the guy in front of her .I always have cash on hand now ,always !
I sell a lot of toys like jet skis ,dirt bikes ,dune buggies ,stuff like that .It seems that for every price increment ,the sell becomes twice as hard .Its easy to pick somebodies pocket for $1000.00 ,$1300.00 is twice as hard ,$1500.00 is twice as hard again etc etc .Because of this I generally try to purchase stuff I can sell for $1000.00 or less .Occasionally I go over my self imposed limit ,but I rather not unless it's a real no brainer .
I generally don't do yard sales ,not interested in your kids broken toys ,generally not my thing .My daughter was a competitive figure skater ,and her dresses and crap was all very expensive .My wife told me someone was having a figure skating yard sale and she wanted to go .It was an old couple ,retired ,had a store that closed ,and had enough stuff to fill a 5 car driveway .My kid picked out about 5 dresses ,paid $25.00 total ,and when we got home I looked at the tags and we had purchased about $600.00 worth of dresses for $25.00 .I went back ,asked what his plans were after the sale ,he said donate to charity ,I asked how much and bought everything for $500.00 .I had an empty apartment ,inventoried it all ,and at sticker price figured out there was $22,000.00 worth of stuff .I sold it to a new shop opening up for $8000.00 and it was gone in a flash .Whenever I see a business closing down ,I now go in and buy it all if I can .Bike store closing up ,get your butt over there and let it be known you might be interested in a bulk purchase .
I should mention I am a licenced mechanic and can generally fix anything and everything ,which is why I typically buy broken or run down stuff for cheap .If your not handy ,you need to pay up and buy better stuff to begin with .What I don't know how to fix ,I find somebody who does know how to fix it ,and can often trade services as I have a lot of skills and abilities .I also need to say that I do this for fun ,a few bucks ,to learn how things work etc.I don't like to sit around and I always loved figuring out how things work .
Sorry for the mega post ,hope you find some info of use to yourselves .If you have any questions please ask ,I enjoy the flipping business and am happy to share my ideas and techniques .

oddjob2

+1 ^^ Great post. Right now, for the first time in a few years, having US dollars in your pocket is better than Canadian!

Bruces

The canadian dollar has been doing pretty well the past few years ,it sure helps us poor slobs out when we want something on ebay but has not been a great benefit to us in day to day life .A car for example ,could be made in Canada ,virtually identical in every way to the us model that we might have built ,and it is still $10,000.00 more expensive even when the dollar was pretty much the same ,truly not cool .No reason for that much difference .Not only that ,but the us was getting the lifetime powertrain warranties and buy a truck ,which colour pt cruiser are we giving you free to go with it ? We never got that either .
Gasoline ,currently $1.15 per litre here ,about 4 litres to a us gallon ,you do the math ....not cool .
Having cash in your pocket allows you to sprint out the door at a moments notice to pick up the next deal .

Phattruth

Eschlwc,

I have almost the same bike for sale currently. It's a 75'/76' (Paid $100 back in 93') I used in college after my beloved GT was stolen, but it's not in nearly as nice condition. I put about $40 in parts and lots of cleaning and wrenching to get it working again. I'm curious if you've sold your's and what kind of price you sold it for.

beakersbike

I picked up a badly mangled Schwinn Continental. Frame, fork, headset, handlebars and stem shifters were pretty much toast. I still got about $75 for other parts. On older bikes it doesn't have to be high or mid end, people are often looking for parts that match up even on the entry level stuff. Granted, I had an old Huffy that I didn't even bother with, everything on it was crap. Put it out on the curb for Freebay - I sure hope it was one of the scrappers that scours the area that picked it up, feel bad for whoever thought they got a bike out of the deal.