Italian? Japanese? Hand made?
05-19-16, 01:51 PM
#26
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I would consider hand made to be something made by hand versus made by robot. I dont care if it was made due to 50 hands or 2 hands. If one group sets the main tubes up and another group does the dropouts while yet another group does forks...its still handmade.
05-19-16, 01:59 PM
#27
Banned
batches of Hundreds a day can be knocked out, as the have been since the 1900s
feeding parts into a jig de skills the work .
feeding parts into a jig de skills the work .
05-19-16, 02:00 PM
#28
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The tapered seat stays look like my old Nishiki Kokusai.
05-19-16, 11:08 PM
#29
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The serial number format is consistent with the format and location of Centurion manufacturers. Typically we see only four characters but occasionally five surface. A quick check of my database shows one with serial number N6xxx with components having 1975 date codes, so that was used to establish the time frame.
The Sport and LeMans during this period were still using stamped dropouts and top top brake cable stops. It doesn't have the cantilever bosses of the Pro-Tour. The Semi-Pro had much more extensive chroming and different stay caps and lugs. That leaves the Super LeMans and visually it's a good match for known samples seen from this period (see attched [photo of head lugs and cable stops used on circa 1975 Super LeMans).
The serial number format does not match those used by Nishiki and Panasonc during this period.
The Sport and LeMans during this period were still using stamped dropouts and top top brake cable stops. It doesn't have the cantilever bosses of the Pro-Tour. The Semi-Pro had much more extensive chroming and different stay caps and lugs. That leaves the Super LeMans and visually it's a good match for known samples seen from this period (see attched [photo of head lugs and cable stops used on circa 1975 Super LeMans).
The serial number format does not match those used by Nishiki and Panasonc during this period.
05-21-16, 11:02 AM
#30
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IMO, the only requirement for "hand made' is that the tubes be joined using hand held brazing or welding equipment. I don't care how many people were involved, whether jigs were involved or whether automated equipment was used in preparation or finishing stages. The tube joints are the most important operation and as long as this was done manually, then a 'hand made' designation is OK by me. The vast majority of builders exhibiting at NAHBS use jigs and automated machinery to varying degrees and undoubtedly some have helpers doing some of the more menial chores of everyday production.
05-21-16, 11:21 AM
#31
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One thing I recall about the Super Lemans ca. 1974 is some chrome. Reckon this fellow lost his to the respray.
The headplate fastener holes will line right up with a Centurion headplate. They had three sizes of headplate at this epoch depending on frame size.
The headplate fastener holes will line right up with a Centurion headplate. They had three sizes of headplate at this epoch depending on frame size.
05-22-16, 11:28 PM
#32
verktyg
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The serial number format is consistent with the format and location of Centurion manufacturers. Typically we see only four characters but occasionally five surface. A quick check of my database shows one with serial number N6xxx with components having 1975 date codes, so that was used to establish the time frame.
The Sport and LeMans during this period were still using stamped dropouts and top top brake cable stops. It doesn't have the cantilever bosses of the Pro-Tour. The Semi-Pro had much more extensive chroming and different stay caps and lugs. That leaves the Super LeMans and visually it's a good match for known samples seen from this period (see attched [photo of head lugs and cable stops used on circa 1975 Super LeMans).
The Sport and LeMans during this period were still using stamped dropouts and top top brake cable stops. It doesn't have the cantilever bosses of the Pro-Tour. The Semi-Pro had much more extensive chroming and different stay caps and lugs. That leaves the Super LeMans and visually it's a good match for known samples seen from this period (see attched [photo of head lugs and cable stops used on circa 1975 Super LeMans).
You nailed it!The first shop that I worked at in 1973 sold Gitanes (hundreds of them) plus Nishiki, Azuki and Takara bikes. I went to another shop in 1974 . The first shop started selling Centurions about that time.
I never worked on many Centurions but I remembered seeing those lugs back then on some bikes imported by West Coast Cycle (the were the importer for Nishiki, Azuki, Takara Centurion). To me, they were all Japanese IRON! 4 to 6 Lbs. heavier than equivalent European bike from the early 70's.
The cosmetics were much better than the Euro bikes and they didn't have fussy French components which made them an easier sale....
BTW @T-Mar Don't you ever work? 1055 posts since you retired from BF?
I'll never catch up....verktyg
Chas.
__________________
Don't believe everything you think! History is written by those who weren't there....
Chas. ;-)
Don't believe everything you think! History is written by those who weren't there....
Chas. ;-)
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