jonwvara 

I just installed a nice long-cage Super LS derailleur on my Peugeot project, and it seems to shift really well, at least on the work stand.

But (with French bikes there's always a "but") I've got an issue with the Super LJ front derailleur. It's the triple model, since I'm mounting a triplized Stronglight 93 crankset.

One fairly manageable problem is that the SLJ front, unlike the much-reviled Prestige front that was original to the bike, doesn't include a cable stop--it's designed for direct bottom pull, like a lot of more modern fronts.

There would be no problem with the direct-pull front if the frame had an under-the-bottom bracket cable guide. But in the interest of originality, I've been wanting to use the original-style PX-10 cable guides, which clamp to the base of the down tube. (A shout-out here to obrentharris who sent me the cable guide, and also to smontanaro for a binder bolt and rear brake hanger).

One option would be to mount a separate clamp-on cable stop between the front derailleur and the cable guide, so unhoused cable runs from the stop to the cable-mounting bolt on the derailleur. I have a single-cable Huret stop that would work for that application. It's kind of a kludgy solution, but workable.

A bigger problem is the cabling to the rear derailleur. The unhoused cable that emerges from the rear of the cable guide--headed back toward the rear derailleur-- is pretty high above the chainstay, even with the guide mounted as low on the down tube as it will go. The cable is so high, in fact, that the front derailleur cage hangs up on it. If I mount the FD high enough for the cage to clear the cable, there's way too big a gap between the front derailleur cage and the big chainring. That's with a 49-tooth big ring; if I were to switch to a 52-tooth ring I'd have a correct gap and clear the cable. I may do that, but it irks me to not be able to use the gearing I want. I suppose I could run housed cable all the way back to the brazed-on cable stop on the chainstay, but that might look kind of weird.

How have others dealt with this problem? It can't be an uncommon one.

Just composing this post now has me feeling that the cleanest solution might be to give up and install a proper under-the-bracket cable guide (the ol' short-lengths-of-housing-held-in-place-by-cable-pressure method of routing under the BB is too primitive for me, although it does work). That would mean giving up on the original cable guide, but since I'm using non-original (albeit still Simplex) derailleurs anyway, I guess originality is already out the window. (Right, also the Technomic stem, Nitto bars, and Panaracer tires on circa 2005 clincher rims) Maybe I need to relax and accept the cable mounting that goes with the derailleurs I've opted to use? I'm ordinarily not much of a purist, but something about the PX-10--I've wanted one since about 1970--has me wanting to keep things as close to original as I can.

I'll get over it, I guess.

eschlwc

i would try to use this.

JohnDThompson 

I've got a few of these Vitus cable guides -- made in France, even. I hate to see a PX-10 go to waste; you can have one for the cost of postage if you want.

Salamandrine 

I just went through this same issue. I went with the campy chrome BB cable guide.

You cannot use a below bottom bracket guide because the rear derailleur cable stop is on top of the chainstay. You must use the old school above bottom bracket guide. As i said I went with what eschlwc suggests, and it works perfectly. I didn't try to run a triple, but with the campy BB cable guides, you can slam them to nearly flush against the shell, so clearance should be attainable. Swapping out the cable guide to a campy is a period correct mod FWIW.

I personally don't like kludgey solutions, and it's pretty easy to avoid one here.

You pretty much have to give up using the Simplex cable guides unless you use Simplex derailleurs. There were however some other vintage FD that included a cable stop. First generation Campy Record, for example. Probably not worth the hassle of chasing them down since you already have derailleurs you like.

Barrettscv 

I really like the Huret cable guides, like this: VeloBase.com - Component: Huret bottom bracket cable guide


This is positioned above the BB shell by the angle of the seat-tube and down-tube and won't slip. I have it on my PX10 and it fits and performs flawlessly.

jonwvara 

Great point about the chainstay stop being on top of the stay. Too bad it's a braze-on, in a way, since the clamp-on versions could go either on the top or the bottom.

I think I might try a chromed Huret guide, just for its Frenchness, rather than a Campy guide. That ought to net me several mm of clearance--maybe enough to fix the problem.

I just checked my Motobecane, which has one of the chromed above-the-BB guides (a Suntour, though), and found that the cable is even higher above the stay than the one on the Peugot. But I could slide the guide on the Moto down quite a lot further if I wanted to.

Interesting, the Moto has a 46-tooth big ring, and the Cyclone front derailleur cage clears the cable easily. That bike is set up with a 46-30 double, though.

EDIT: Well, it looks like Huret didn't make the Campy-style guide with the open channels for unhoused cables on both sides. All the pictures of Huret guides that I've seen include a cable housing stop on one side. So for my application, I guess it will be a Campagnolo guide after all.

Those things aren't cheap, though, are they? At least not on Ebay.

nlerner

I'm fairly sure I have a Huret cable guide and don't remember if it has a stop for the front. I can check in the parts bin though not for a couple of days (out of town at the moment).

rootboy 

They're not too bad.
I may have one...lemme check.

Or, I wonder if the older, Record era guide would work. The one with the tube to guide the rear cable, and a stop for the front.
I think I have one of those.

As I remember, Huret did make a dual guide without a stop. Maybe for the Jubilee application? I could be wrong. Like so?
https://www.terapeak.com/worth/huret-.../252069966531/

First pic:
https://www.google.com/search?q=Hure...w=1056&bih=847

jonwvara 

With the guide installed, how high above the chainstay is the drive-side cable, where it leaves the guide? The nature of this type of guide, it seems to me, it that its position can't be adjusted upward or downward--it will position itself wherever the angle of the down- and seat-tubes dictate. I'm guessing that the cable is going to be 5-10 mm above the chainstay--probably too high for my application.

rootboy 

Campy N. Record era guide. NOS. No bolt.



Campy Record era guide. Mounts to down tube and requires piece of housing between stop on guide and derailleur. Not sure this would work.





PM me if either one might work...

Barrettscv 

I'm getting about 4mm above the BB shell at the exit point of the guide on the drive side and the cable is 6mm above the chainstay at the rear of the derailleur cage. I measured using hex wrenches as feeler gauges. I'm using a 46, 42 and 30 chainring set with a Suntour ARX front derailleur. The derailleur cage sits tight above the 46t chainring, but still clears the cable easily when above the inner chainring. The middle ring is your Triplitizer for the Stronglight crank. The guide fits the application perfectly.

The derailleur is on the small chainring on the third photo, on the large on the bottom photo.

John E

I faced the same front derailleur cable routing problem when I upgraded the Modell Campagnolo from its defunct original Gran Sport to a much newer stopless Record. I simply routed a length of housing under the BB, leaving the downstream end pointing straight up and unterminated. It looks as though others have solved your rear derailleur cable routing problem.

Salamandrine 

Either the big Huret 2236 guide or the double slotted Campagnolo 626 guide should work. The latter will get the cable a little closer to the chainstay though. I can measure when I get home if you like.

Campy is going to probably cost less since they were made in the gazillions. Huret is certainly more french.


Pardon the dirt...

vtchuck

Same problem with my PX-10. I used the Campy guide, but it didn't look out of place because I used Campy NR components.

Pedalitis

Hello, I'm trying to figure out which rear derailleur you are referring to when you mentioned the 'long-cage Super LS derailleur'? I am working on a pal's PX10 and he wants to install a longer cage derailleur to increase the maximum sprocket size to 30. The unique fixing of the Simplex Prestige RD is making this a challenge, at least without tapping and filing the dropout.

SJX426 

The trick with the Campagnolo guide, likely the other too, is how fragile they are when mounting. They have to open up a lot to get around the tube. Given the large "diamond" shape in the middle of the band, its the narrow sections on either side that will want to bend. To frequent removal/installation, will cause it to break there. Try to distribute the "bending" over the band to minimize the risk of damage.

Grand Bois

I'm using the guide in Rootboy's first picture above on my PX10. It eliminates the need for a FD with a stop, so you can use your SLJ. (I don't think I've ever seen a SLJ FD with a stop) The rear cable runs very close to the chain stay. I'm also running a triple. It's a very common part. I'm sure you'll have no trouble finding one.

Grand Bois

An inelegant solution at best.

Salamandrine 

Pedalitis, reviver of this thread, is asking about the rear derailleur...

I don't know what derailleur jonwara is referring to, Super LJ? There were at least a couple long cage Simplex derailleurs that used the Simplex mounting system. They didn't really sell in huge numbers back in the day, and as a consequence they tend to be rare and expensive now. There's a couple Simplex long cage derailleurs that will work. You just have to find one and be willing to spend the $$.

Simplex Prestige Super LJ derailleur (SLJ6600)

It will send forum members into spasms if you tap and file a Simplex dropout, but it does work, and was a common bike shop task once upon a time. Not really any worse than retapping french cranks IMO. Still, I prefer to avoid doing those things if possible, but it depends.

John E

How so? It really doesn't show unless one is looking for it, and it works beautifully.