DPDISXR4Ti

I've had the first bike I ever bought with my own money sitting in the basement for the past ~20 years that I want to update and convert to something sorta representing today's Cyclocross bike. Basically, I want it to be a multipurpose bike that I can use on the road and solid trails.

I was hoping to upgrade it to a 8-speed like my '93 Kestrel, but I'm just now realizing that it's got 120mm drop-outs. What are my options here?

Any overall thoughts/suggestions/questions, please feel free to offer them up. I don't want to spend a lot of money, but I don't mind investing something back into this. It's a Tange 2 frame, so a decent foundation to build from.

DPDISXR4Ti

No love for my idea here?

Someone had suggested that I might not be able to fit larger than a 28mm tire. Does that sound right?

What about cantilever cyclocross brakes? Is that all that might be needed to fit a larger tire?

Rookie questions I realize. I'm new to this idea, but have built bikes before, so I have half a clue.

Classtime 

I think your bike is spaced to 126 in the back and you have 6 speeds. IMO, 8 speeds is not an upgrade. But if you have the 8 speed bits, go ahead. Your LeMans is an all-purpose road bike. Tune it up, put some fresh rubber on it, and take it on these trails you mentioned. To see how wide a tire you put on it, take it to a shop and ask them how big a tire will fit. Probably only a 23 but you will be surprised where these bikes can take you. Ride it. (forget the cantis as its your chain stays that will limit you)

Lazyass

To see how large a tire you can fit just measure the clearance you have left with your current tires on it. I know on my '88 LeMans a 28 will just barely clear the calipers. If it was a 28 that runs big as some do it probably wouldn't even fit.

droppedandlost 

Verify what you currently have, number of gears in the back and tire size. I agree that it should be 6 speed/126mm. The frame can be cold set to 130mm but it's not a requirement. It's easy to stretch the dropouts to get the wider wheel on but check chain clearance on the smallest cog. The other issue is tire clearance. If you drop from 27" to 700c, you should have clearance to run wider gravel tires. I can get 38mm on my old frame. You will probably need longer reach brakes though, and don't mix dual pivots with non-aero levers as it doesn't work very well. (30mm tires in photo)

50voltphantom

Go for it if you think it will work. Old Dia Compe Centerpull brakes work great for sorting out any brake reach and tire clearance issues. I run them on my CX-ified Steamroller to great effect.

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noglider 

You may not need to update anything on it. Old stuff works fine in many cases. You will need to do some maintenance, and in doing it, you may find things that need replacement such as cables, tires, and brake pads.

Lazyass

On the LeMans the tire will hit the bottom of the fork before it hits the front caliper. It's pretty much a road racing geometry frameset with rack mounts.

RobbieTunes

I like the idea. I built an '87 into a gravel bike, 3x7 compact triple (Shimano Exage triple with RSX STI's). It ran 28's no problem, and it appeared I could use 32's. My brother-in-law took it on a 75-mile gravel/path ride in the mountains, running 46/36/26 and 13-32 rear. He liked it a lot, then I put 2/3 x 7 DT shifters on it and he liked it more, put a permanent front bag on it.


I think the clearance depends more on the caliper, depending on what caliper you run, as I've had more issues that way than hitting the frame. The Lemans is a great frame, Tange 2 tubing, and plenty of clearance, plus one set of eyelets each end. Go forth and try it. I found it more relaxed than the Ironman, which didn't mean it was a cruiser. A couple of folks who've emailed me in the past have made cross bikes out of those frames.

Lazyass

Bad pic, but this is a 23c tire. The bottom of the fork is lower than the caliper. Just barely enough room to squeeze a 28 in there.

DPDISXR4Ti

Thanks for all the input. A couple things I'm remembering now that you've got me thinking...

1) I had "converted" to 700 wheels at some point. As best I recall, to do this I simply bought new wheels and moved the brake pads down a bit. It sounds like this may be a very helpful factor in stuffing a bigger tire in there.

2) When I went with 700 wheels I also went with 7-speed 130mm hubs. I recall it takes a little more effort to R&R the wheel, but not too bad.

DPDISXR4Ti

Borrowed the front wheel off my girlfriend's hybrid with a 700x32 tire. With a little effort I was able to squeeze it past the brakes. As you can see, plenty of clearance between the fork and tire. I suppose I could go even bigger if I deflated the tube before installing. That would be annoying, but possible.

If I went with cantilever brakes could I use those with my existing Dia-Compe levers?

Lazyass

The '86 frame is completely different than mine. Especially if it came with 27 inch wheels. You have lots of clearance there.

You don't have the post mounts for canti brakes.

mstateglfr 

you need cantilever studs(little pokey things) on the fork and seat stays to use canti brakes.

DPDISXR4Ti

Ah, yes. Good point. Hence the comment from "50voltphantom" above regarding the center-pull Dia-Compes. I'll look for those as a longer-term solution.

Darth Lefty 

But seeing that it fits, why would you need to?

DPDISXR4Ti

Well, it was a snug fit for sure, and I'd prefer to go a little bigger - maybe a 35 or 38. Plus, it was a snug fit to push the tire by old, worn brake pads. If I had new pads no way would the 32 have fit without deflating it first.

DPDISXR4Ti

Just curious why you say this? I've got a couple good quality 130mm rear cassette hubs in the basement (Ultegra & Ritchey) so my plan was to re-build an older (pre cassette) Campy wheel with one of these.

On a related note, is there any difference between a "MTB" cassette vs. "Road"? Obviously the gearing is taller for the gear-sets specified for MTB, but is that it? I was thinking that 11-28 or 12-32 might be a good choice for this bike.

I realize I'll probably need a medium cage derailleur to go with that gear-set, maybe something like a Claris 2400-GS.

flyfisherbob

I have an '86 Lemans RS, and found "some" 28s will fit, but not all. I tried Paselas which rubbed, and just squeezed in gatorskins. I had trouble rubbing the rear brake, not the frame.

noglider 

The limit on fatter tires in the fork is the length of the fork, not the brakes. Your tire nearly hits the top of the fork crown, and you can't change that. But that tire looks nice and fat, and while it's a tight fit, it's a fit.

DPDISXR4Ti

Right, and in case you missed it above, the bike was designed for a 27" tire, so by going with a 700 I gain some overhead space which can be eaten up by a tire that's fatter all around.

And in case anyone else has the same question as I posed above, Sheldon brown provides the answer...

"Road" vs "Mountain" Cassettes
Cassettes come in various gear ranges, and the ones where the sizes are close together, with no really large sprockets, are commonly referred to in marketing-speak as "road" cassettes. Wide range cassettes, with larger sprockets are commonly called "mountain" or "MTB" cassettes.

DPDISXR4Ti

I may have jumped the gun here, but these were too cheap not to try...

In case the link doesn't work, it's 1970's vintage Balilla center pull brakes with original yolks and rear cable guide. Do you think my stock levers will work okay with these?

Classtime 

I have run 8 speed on an otherwise 6 speed drive train and it was not an improvement. I did it because I couldn't find a replacement wheel. It is now back to original equipment and I am happier with it. . If your 6 speed equipment needs replacing, replace it with something that works -- 6,7,8,9,10 whatever.

jetboy 

mtb and road cassettes are same - so not a problem. I run a 12-34 with a long cage on one of my road bikes, I am not sure a medium cage could handle that - but the good news is that a mtb RD will also bolt directly on and work fine, and you can get a decent one for like $20 if you aren't picky. if you plan on any hills, id shoot for at least 34 in the rear unless you are changing to a triple or mtb/cx crank.

I am also building a cx bike at the moment, just got the cables and chain in the mail today and pretty stoked to try it out.

DPDISXR4Ti

My plan is to stay with a double up front, so appreciate the input on the rear gearing. The 2400-GS is rated to handle up to a 32-tooth, so thinking a 12-32 might be a good choice for me.

Do you have any message thread on your build?