Help me to find out this bike's frame
08-11-17, 12:14 PM
#1
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Help me to find out this bike's frame
Hi guys , i'm planning to buy this bike. It cost me 39€ (46$) but i had to travel almost 100km for buying it... well thats not a problem for me.
those are the only photos i got , can you help me to figure what kind of frame it is?
The bike had everything original except for the paint because the old owner decided to paint it.
i think for this price is really good even if is not that rare , only the handlebar seems to cost around 20-30 euros (23-35$).
I really hope we can figure almost the brand.
BTW iu already requested other photos , have a good day.
those are the only photos i got , can you help me to figure what kind of frame it is?
The bike had everything original except for the paint because the old owner decided to paint it.
i think for this price is really good even if is not that rare , only the handlebar seems to cost around 20-30 euros (23-35$).
I really hope we can figure almost the brand.
BTW iu already requested other photos , have a good day.
08-11-17, 12:21 PM
#2
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You are going to need much better, and closer photos of the frame. Details of the lugs, dropouts, fork crown, etc. Even then, unless it has some unique features, we will probably only have some guesses.
From what I can see, it's definitely a bicycle. 😀
It looks to have pretty thick lugs, and a cottered crank. That makes it either a fairly low end bike, or older than the early 70s if it's a quality frame.
From what I can see, it's definitely a bicycle. 😀
It looks to have pretty thick lugs, and a cottered crank. That makes it either a fairly low end bike, or older than the early 70s if it's a quality frame.
Last edited by cdmurphy; 08-11-17 at 12:24 PM.
08-11-17, 02:32 PM
#3
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Serial number -- including its location -- and diameters of seat tube and seat post would also be helpful.
__________________
"Far and away the best prize that life offers is the chance to work hard at work worth doing." --Theodore Roosevelt
Capo: 1959 Modell Campagnolo, S/N 40324; 1960 Sieger (2), S/N 42624, 42597
Carlton: 1962 Franco Suisse, S/N K7911
Peugeot: 1970 UO-8, S/N 0010468
Bianchi: 1982 Campione d'Italia, S/N 1.M9914
Schwinn: 1988 Project KOM-10, S/N F804069
"Far and away the best prize that life offers is the chance to work hard at work worth doing." --Theodore Roosevelt
Capo: 1959 Modell Campagnolo, S/N 40324; 1960 Sieger (2), S/N 42624, 42597
Carlton: 1962 Franco Suisse, S/N K7911
Peugeot: 1970 UO-8, S/N 0010468
Bianchi: 1982 Campione d'Italia, S/N 1.M9914
Schwinn: 1988 Project KOM-10, S/N F804069
08-11-17, 02:50 PM
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For €39 I'd get it anyway, if only for the cool condorino bars.
08-11-17, 03:02 PM
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Echo all previous posts but will add that it has pump pegs on the seat tube which is pretty intriguing imo but without seeing more it's hard to say anything for certain. I think for the price it'd be worth picking up and posting more picks of course 
Keep us posted!
Keep us posted!
08-11-17, 03:22 PM
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-----
Frame constructed with Agrati "BRIANZA" pattern lug set, Agrati "SPORT" crown and fork crown cap. Italian style seat binder collar. Plate style bridges suggest a very bottom of the line model.
wrt dating - the Brianza pattern lug set had gone out of production by the late 1960's so it is unlikely to be much later.
Routing the rear brake cable under the tt is something only done by a few makers so that should limit the possibilities a bit.
Whatever it is it is def'nitely a "Bleedin' Oytoy."
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Frame constructed with Agrati "BRIANZA" pattern lug set, Agrati "SPORT" crown and fork crown cap. Italian style seat binder collar. Plate style bridges suggest a very bottom of the line model.
wrt dating - the Brianza pattern lug set had gone out of production by the late 1960's so it is unlikely to be much later.
Routing the rear brake cable under the tt is something only done by a few makers so that should limit the possibilities a bit.
Whatever it is it is def'nitely a "Bleedin' Oytoy."
-----
Last edited by juvela; 08-12-17 at 03:20 PM. Reason: addition
08-12-17, 11:00 AM
#7
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Thanks guys , btw i sended another photo request and probably i'll go to take tomorrow. Have a good day
08-12-17, 12:14 PM
#8
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Here we go. Those are the photo he Gave me right now https://postimg.org/gallery/1gisqem9i/
08-12-17, 01:23 PM
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Thank you for the additional pictures! I'm with juvela here: lower end. Both the pictures and the bike, BTW. But if it's your size, you can't go very far wrong for €39. And the condorino bars are cool.
08-12-17, 02:50 PM
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thanks for yopur reply.
Last edited by CrowSeph; 09-10-17 at 05:58 AM.
08-12-17, 03:29 PM
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Thank you for the additional images. Kitting looks to be all original. Brake calipers may be Pietra Mignon.
Evidently it once wore a chainguard as the mounting bracket can be seen brazed to the RH seat stay.
Possible there may be a name stamped into stem. Also possible that adjustable head race may exhibit a name...
Regarding the suggestion of Atala-ness - Rizzato cottered bottom bracket spindles of this era have a proprietary marking. You could disassemble the bb and read the marking(s) on the spindle. Also check the underside of the shell for markings. If it is an Atala export model it may have the nominal frame size in inches stamped into the shell.
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Thank you for the additional images. Kitting looks to be all original. Brake calipers may be Pietra Mignon.
Evidently it once wore a chainguard as the mounting bracket can be seen brazed to the RH seat stay.
Possible there may be a name stamped into stem. Also possible that adjustable head race may exhibit a name...
Regarding the suggestion of Atala-ness - Rizzato cottered bottom bracket spindles of this era have a proprietary marking. You could disassemble the bb and read the marking(s) on the spindle. Also check the underside of the shell for markings. If it is an Atala export model it may have the nominal frame size in inches stamped into the shell.
-----
Last edited by juvela; 08-12-17 at 03:35 PM. Reason: addition
09-15-17, 03:41 PM
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News: Finally today i took this bike , i'am still looking for the identification of the brand but sadly i can't find any code anywhere (maybe is hiding under this huge layer of paint). The Only thing i found is a "B" inside both crankset's arm (as you can see there https://postimg.org/image/s4sqxa41h/).
Here (Album ? Postimage.org) the new photos from myself with a better quality.
Here (Album ? Postimage.org) the new photos from myself with a better quality.
09-15-17, 04:17 PM
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Well, you need to take it apart anyway, so maybe you'll find some more clues.
The bike clearly needs a lot of love, but it looks as if there might be a decent bike under all that grime and paint.
The bike clearly needs a lot of love, but it looks as if there might be a decent bike under all that grime and paint.
09-15-17, 08:16 PM
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with regard to serial number search -
in this photo it appears there may be something under the paint on the right side of the seat tube at about the level of the pump peg. takes only a moment to sand away the paint layers for a look...
with regard to serial number search -
in this photo it appears there may be something under the paint on the right side of the seat tube at about the level of the pump peg. takes only a moment to sand away the paint layers for a look...
09-15-17, 10:08 PM
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Nice catch! Updates coming soon.
09-16-17, 05:02 AM
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We ahsll have to wait and see...it may be just a scuff in the paint.
The white colour is not original either as we can see it on the edges of the head cups in this image below.
Suspect shift lever and rear mech may not be original. Likely original drive train derailleur three or four speed. Often this type of bike would receive Gian Robert gears at this era.
Are you able to read a marking on the brake calipers? In the photos there is too much overspray and corrosion to read them. They appear they could be a brand such as Super Rapid.
As mentioned in message Nr. 11 above you may find a marking in the centre section of the bottom bracket spindle when you take things apart.
Cannot recall seeing before this pattern of chainstay bridge. Possible someone may recognise it as being used by a particular manufacturer.
Is there any writing on the top surface of the headset locknut? OFMEGA for example.
We ahsll have to wait and see...it may be just a scuff in the paint.
The white colour is not original either as we can see it on the edges of the head cups in this image below.
Suspect shift lever and rear mech may not be original. Likely original drive train derailleur three or four speed. Often this type of bike would receive Gian Robert gears at this era.
Are you able to read a marking on the brake calipers? In the photos there is too much overspray and corrosion to read them. They appear they could be a brand such as Super Rapid.
As mentioned in message Nr. 11 above you may find a marking in the centre section of the bottom bracket spindle when you take things apart.
Cannot recall seeing before this pattern of chainstay bridge. Possible someone may recognise it as being used by a particular manufacturer.
Is there any writing on the top surface of the headset locknut? OFMEGA for example.
Last edited by juvela; 09-16-17 at 05:06 AM. Reason: spelling
09-16-17, 08:07 AM
#17
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both brakes bolts have the main bolt with a text "Bianchi, other text are those "85 Super rapid" and the other one "jollis"
photos:
https://s26.postimg.org/swgszkv7d/Wh...t_15.59.39.jpg
https://s26.postimg.org/b7p27yjg9/Wh...t_15.59.46.jpg
As mentioned in message Nr. 11 above you may find a marking in the centre section of the bottom bracket spindle when you take things apart.
Cannot recall seeing before this pattern of chainstay bridge. Possible someone may recognise it as being used by a particular manufacturer.
Is there any writing on the top surface of the headset locknut? OFMEGA for example.
Cannot recall seeing before this pattern of chainstay bridge. Possible someone may recognise it as being used by a particular manufacturer.
Is there any writing on the top surface of the headset locknut? OFMEGA for example.
OT: whitout those layers of paint , is looking pretty cool!
https://s26.postimg.org/w21epsdtl/Wh...t_15.33.26.jpg
09-16-17, 08:50 AM
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Thank you for the response, information and additional pictures.
If machine was sold as a Bianchi it would likely have been produced in their Chiorda facility.
At least I got a couple items correct.
As mentioned in post nr. 6 above, frame is built with Agrati "BRIANZA" pattern lugset. Set is item nr. 000.8030/U. Bulge-formed head is item nr. 000.8356. Seat lug is item nr. 022.8039. Bottom bracket shell is item nr. 000.8507. Dropouts are item nr. 000.8002. Companion fork ends answer to item nr. 000.8010. Is crown plated or wearing a cap? Appears it may be Agrati "AMERICA" item nr. 000.8528. Cap is Agrati item nr. 202.9110.
Have you found any markings on bottom bracket fittings?
-----
Thank you for the response, information and additional pictures.
If machine was sold as a Bianchi it would likely have been produced in their Chiorda facility.
At least I got a couple items correct.
As mentioned in post nr. 6 above, frame is built with Agrati "BRIANZA" pattern lugset. Set is item nr. 000.8030/U. Bulge-formed head is item nr. 000.8356. Seat lug is item nr. 022.8039. Bottom bracket shell is item nr. 000.8507. Dropouts are item nr. 000.8002. Companion fork ends answer to item nr. 000.8010. Is crown plated or wearing a cap? Appears it may be Agrati "AMERICA" item nr. 000.8528. Cap is Agrati item nr. 202.9110.
Have you found any markings on bottom bracket fittings?
-----
09-16-17, 02:54 PM
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We're making progress!
09-16-17, 03:00 PM
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Paint finish - interesting to see that the person who painted it white evidently took it down to bare metal and then applied the white colour without recourse to primer.
Machine's pedals look to be Union (Tedesco) brand:
Paint finish - interesting to see that the person who painted it white evidently took it down to bare metal and then applied the white colour without recourse to primer.
Machine's pedals look to be Union (Tedesco) brand:
09-16-17, 03:55 PM
#21
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Yessir!
Cool!
But the condition of those pedals are really bad , i was thinkinf to trow them away and replace with one of this models:
Woa! those are interesting info.
Yea the fork is wearing a little cap but there aren't any code.
Right now i took away the axe and bearings but those look too new in my opinion, and also there there zero codes inside.
details. *ignore the dirtyness*
https://s26.postimg.org/apqbs6rcp/image.jpg
https://s26.postimg.org/6545d97nd/image.jpg
https://s26.postimg.org/xi9c80e7t/image.jpg
https://s26.postimg.org/lf40kg35l/image.jpg
But the condition of those pedals are really bad , i was thinkinf to trow them away and replace with one of this models:
-----
Thank you for the response, information and additional pictures.
If machine was sold as a Bianchi it would likely have been produced in their Chiorda facility.
At least I got a couple items correct.
As mentioned in post nr. 6 above, frame is built with Agrati "BRIANZA" pattern lugset. Set is item nr. 000.8030/U. Bulge-formed head is item nr. 000.8356. Seat lug is item nr. 022.8039. Bottom bracket shell is item nr. 000.8507. Dropouts are item nr. 000.8002. Companion fork ends answer to item nr. 000.8010. Is crown plated or wearing a cap? Appears it may be Agrati "AMERICA" item nr. 000.8528. Cap is Agrati item nr. 202.9110.
Have you found any markings on bottom bracket fittings?
-----
Thank you for the response, information and additional pictures.
If machine was sold as a Bianchi it would likely have been produced in their Chiorda facility.
At least I got a couple items correct.
As mentioned in post nr. 6 above, frame is built with Agrati "BRIANZA" pattern lugset. Set is item nr. 000.8030/U. Bulge-formed head is item nr. 000.8356. Seat lug is item nr. 022.8039. Bottom bracket shell is item nr. 000.8507. Dropouts are item nr. 000.8002. Companion fork ends answer to item nr. 000.8010. Is crown plated or wearing a cap? Appears it may be Agrati "AMERICA" item nr. 000.8528. Cap is Agrati item nr. 202.9110.
Have you found any markings on bottom bracket fittings?
-----
Yea the fork is wearing a little cap but there aren't any code.
Right now i took away the axe and bearings but those look too new in my opinion, and also there there zero codes inside.
details. *ignore the dirtyness*
https://s26.postimg.org/apqbs6rcp/image.jpg
https://s26.postimg.org/6545d97nd/image.jpg
https://s26.postimg.org/xi9c80e7t/image.jpg
https://s26.postimg.org/lf40kg35l/image.jpg
09-16-17, 08:15 PM
#22
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Anche moderno!
Como l'originale e solamente VIII Euro:
https://www.subito.it/biciclette/cop...-221151658.htm
"Rolls Royce"
https://www.subito.it/biciclette/she...-214551133.htm
-----
Como l'originale e solamente VIII Euro:
https://www.subito.it/biciclette/cop...-221151658.htm
"Rolls Royce"
https://www.subito.it/biciclette/she...-214551133.htm
-----
09-17-17, 02:37 AM
#23
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Boy, those Sheffields are really nice, but for that price I'd want the rest of the bike too.
Those white rubber pedals would be an excellent choice for this project.
Those white rubber pedals would be an excellent choice for this project.
09-17-17, 06:07 AM
#24
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09-17-17, 11:39 AM
#25
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Anche moderno!
Como l'originale e solamente VIII Euro:
https://www.subito.it/biciclette/cop...-221151658.htm
Anche moderno!
Como l'originale e solamente VIII Euro:
https://www.subito.it/biciclette/cop...-221151658.htm
Updates:
All the paint is goone , still no codes but i noticed someting new for me. The parts seems welded with some gold metal. What kind of welding is this?
Aaaand the brakes start glowing again
https://s26.postimg.org/f2vhfzz7d/Wh...t_19.00.23.jpg