Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Classic & Vintage This forum is to discuss the many aspects of classic and vintage bicycles, including musclebikes, lightweights, middleweights, hi-wheelers, bone-shakers, safety bikes and much more.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 05-23-07, 04:05 PM   #1
pastorbobnlnh 
Freewheel Medic
Thread Starter
 
pastorbobnlnh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Ascending or Descending the NH Mountains NW of Concord!
Bikes: Snazzy* Schwinns, Classy Cannondales, & a Lonely '83 Santana Tandem (* Ed.)
Posts: 10,237
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Help ID Antique Fixie

Well, first there was the '80 Raleigh Sports. Then there was the '71 Varsity. That was followed by the '40s or '50s Hercules. Now the local dump has deposited upon my doorstep a truly ancient mystery.

I believe this bike might be as old as the late 1890s, but I'm uncertain. This is just a guess based on pictures from the book Bicycle, by David V. Herlihy. This is what I can tell you: It has no saddle nor handlebars. No tires. No brakes. It is a fixed gear. One link in the chain has the number "797" stamped on it. There are no other marks on the bike except the number "101797" (although the 9 might be an 8) in the frame/headtube near the lower headset. Looking at the interesting radial spoke pattern shows most of the nipples on the hub, not at the rim, which I believe are designed for tubular tires (there are a few nipples next to the rim but I imagine these are replacements). Notice the foot rests on the front fork and the broken lacing on the chain guard. Another foot rest is on the frame near the left rear dropout. And finally notice the "drillium" on the BB. I haven't weighed it, but I imagine it tips 50+ lbs.

So, your guess is as good as mine. Any ideas? Know who I should contact? I'll be looking for a caring new home for this mystery so it's up for trade or other deal.








__________________
Bob
Dreaming about riding in NH's summertime!

Visit my websites:
FreeWheelSpa.com orpastorbobnlnh.com
pastorbobnlnh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-23-07, 04:28 PM   #2
Snordalisk
Senior Member
 
Snordalisk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Worcester, MA
Bikes: 1977 Raleigh Professional, 1997 Milano 3v, 2004 Surly Karate Monkey, 2007 Surly Crosscheck, 1984 Hutch Pro Racer
Posts: 129
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I can't tell you anything about it, except that I think it's beautiful.

Awesome find.
Snordalisk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-23-07, 04:33 PM   #3
new_dharma
\,,/(^_^)\,,/
 
new_dharma's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Minneapolis, MN
Bikes: Surly 1x1 Xtracycle, '01 Haro Flair Dave Mirra
Posts: 869
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
the skirt-guard seems to be all there, too!
__________________
You know you're getting old when you look at a beautiful 19-year-old girl and you find yourself thinking, "Gee, I wonder what her mother looks like?"
new_dharma is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-23-07, 04:43 PM   #4
bikerosity57
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Bikes:
Posts: 887
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
It's an early "safety". Many were used by women who couldn't or wouldn't ride high wheelers. Men laughed at them, until the little ladies began out riding them on their vastly superior designed bikes. It's older than late 1890's. Could be from the mid to late 1880's. It's very primitive too, from before bikes were really standardized. In the late 1890's many bikes looked a lot like what we rode just a few years ago.
There were thousands of manufacturers during those years, and it could have been made by anyone. Do not paint it! Do not remove any parts. It's collectable, and possibly valuable.
bikerosity57 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-23-07, 04:46 PM   #5
bikerosity57
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Bikes:
Posts: 887
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Gotta be 1880's because it is built with the same technology used to build high wheek bicycles. In the
90's they began using brazed up tubes and lugs similar to what we all know and love. It's a great find.
bikerosity57 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-23-07, 05:30 PM   #6
repechage
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Bikes:
Posts: 10,775
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 34 Post(s)
quite a find, with as said, possible significant value, any evidence of a missing headbadge? A bike for a proper lady.

I would ask Larry Black, Mt Airy bicycles I think. Could also reference Copake auction history for other examples.
repechage is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-23-07, 05:46 PM   #7
Scooper
Decrepit Member
 
Scooper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: San Francisco California
Bikes: Waterford 953 RS-22
Posts: 10,117
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 14 Post(s)
Bob, I'll bet somebody at the Smithsonian might be able to identify it, or at least narrow it down. The frame details are pretty distinctive.

What a treasure!
__________________
- Stan
I'm with her.
Scooper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-23-07, 06:07 PM   #8
pastorbobnlnh 
Freewheel Medic
Thread Starter
 
pastorbobnlnh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Ascending or Descending the NH Mountains NW of Concord!
Bikes: Snazzy* Schwinns, Classy Cannondales, & a Lonely '83 Santana Tandem (* Ed.)
Posts: 10,237
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by repechage
quite a find, with as said, possible significant value, any evidence of a missing headbadge? A bike for a proper lady.

I would ask Larry Black, Mt Airy bicycles I think. Could also reference Copake auction history for other examples.
It's possible it had a headbadge. There is some blemish in that area but no evidence of any threaded holes for screws.

1880s !!!! I can't believe some fool would toss that bike on the scrap metal heap. It was bad enough that I found the Hercules there, but a 120+/- year old bike!
__________________
Bob
Dreaming about riding in NH's summertime!

Visit my websites:
FreeWheelSpa.com orpastorbobnlnh.com
pastorbobnlnh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-23-07, 06:13 PM   #9
cyclotoine
Senior Member
 
cyclotoine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Yukon, Canada
Bikes:
Posts: 8,469
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
I am in awe. Maybe I should put fork pegs on my fixie for coasting....
__________________
1 Super Record bike, 1 Nuovo Record bike, 1 Pista, 1 Road, 1 Cyclocross/Allrounder, 1 MTB, 1 Touring, 1 Fixed gear
cyclotoine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-23-07, 06:31 PM   #10
vpiuva
*
 
vpiuva's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Bikes:
Posts: 3,458
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Wheels offset radial laced? And with hub mounted nipples? That's some modern tech there!
vpiuva is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-23-07, 06:54 PM   #11
clancy98
don't be so angry
 
clancy98's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Bikes:
Posts: 614
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
i know they said dont touch it, but you would be the coolest person evar riding that down the street resto'd.
clancy98 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-23-07, 06:59 PM   #12
pastorbobnlnh 
Freewheel Medic
Thread Starter
 
pastorbobnlnh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Ascending or Descending the NH Mountains NW of Concord!
Bikes: Snazzy* Schwinns, Classy Cannondales, & a Lonely '83 Santana Tandem (* Ed.)
Posts: 10,237
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by clancy98
i know they said dont touch it, but you would be the coolest person evar riding that down the street resto'd.
I am certain--- I wouldn't fit on this bike. It's Easthill's size. But probably a little heavy for her liking.
__________________
Bob
Dreaming about riding in NH's summertime!

Visit my websites:
FreeWheelSpa.com orpastorbobnlnh.com
pastorbobnlnh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-23-07, 07:01 PM   #13
mattface
Senior Member
 
mattface's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Montpeculiar, VT
Bikes: Soma Rush, Fuji Cross, Raleigh Technium Mtn Bike, Ross 10 speed with Shimano 600.
Posts: 3,951
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
wowie zowie!

that's all I have to say
mattface is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-23-07, 07:03 PM   #14
babychris
sharkfin.
 
babychris's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: philllaaaaay.
Bikes: davidson track. landshark
Posts: 1,691
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
oh my, that is an awesome find.
babychris is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-23-07, 07:39 PM   #15
BostonFixed
Banned.
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Bikes:
Posts: 4,418
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
These people might be able to help ID it:
www.oldspokeshome.com
BostonFixed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-23-07, 08:54 PM   #16
jgedwa
surly old man
 
jgedwa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Carlisle, PA
Bikes: IRO Mark V, Karate Monkey half fat, Trek 620 IGH, Cannondale 26/24 MTB, Amp Research B3, and more.
Posts: 3,345
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Total gaspipe. Or whaleoil pipe, as the case may be.

And who would put a BMX chaintensioner on a track end?

jim
jgedwa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-23-07, 09:07 PM   #17
coelcanth
hunter, gatherer
 
coelcanth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Bikes:
Posts: 1,183
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
very cool..

i think the chain among other things would date this safety bike as pretty early, before 1/8" bushing chain (patent 1880) became standarized... also perhaps it was made before pneumatic tires (1888) were de rigueur..

i think safety bikes first started showing up in the mid 1880s so i'd say anywhere from there to the mid 1890s...

try getting in touch with some guys from the wheelmen.. they specialize in the early stuff.. try their message board @
http://www.thewheelmen.org/forum/default.asp
coelcanth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-24-07, 12:05 AM   #18
gnome 
shaken, not stirred.
 
gnome's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: The Shaky Isles.
Bikes: I've lost count.
Posts: 2,960
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by pastorbobnlnh
Well, first there was the '80 Raleigh Sports. Then there was the '71 Varsity. That was followed by the '40s or '50s Hercules. Now the local dump has deposited upon my doorstep a truly ancient mystery.

I believe this bike might be as old as the late 1890s, but I'm uncertain. This is just a guess based on pictures from the book Bicycle, by David V. Herlihy. This is what I can tell you: It has no saddle nor handlebars. No tires. No brakes. It is a fixed gear. One link in the chain has the number "797" stamped on it. There are no other marks on the bike except the number "101797" (although the 9 might be an 8) in the frame/headtube near the lower headset. Looking at the interesting radial spoke pattern shows most of the nipples on the hub, not at the rim, which I believe are designed for tubular tires (there are a few nipples next to the rim but I imagine these are replacements). Notice the foot rests on the front fork and the broken lacing on the chain guard. Another foot rest is on the frame near the left rear dropout. And finally notice the "drillium" on the BB. I haven't weighed it, but I imagine it tips 50+ lbs.

So, your guess is as good as mine. Any ideas? Know who I should contact? I'll be looking for a caring new home for this mystery so it's up for trade or other deal.
I don't know exactly how old it is but what a find. The block chain and radially laced hubs mean that it is a very early saftey bike.

I want it but I live on the wrong side of the world.

Hopefully you find out what type of saddle and handle bars it might have had. It would make a wonderfull restoration. Just imagine turning up to your next ride on it.
__________________
Get a bicycle. You will not regret it if you live. ~Mark Twain, "Taming the Bicycle"
vBulletin: snafu
gnome is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-24-07, 03:11 AM   #19
pastorbobnlnh 
Freewheel Medic
Thread Starter
 
pastorbobnlnh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Ascending or Descending the NH Mountains NW of Concord!
Bikes: Snazzy* Schwinns, Classy Cannondales, & a Lonely '83 Santana Tandem (* Ed.)
Posts: 10,237
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Thanks for all the comments and helpful links. I'll do more research and post what I find and what I end up doing.
__________________
Bob
Dreaming about riding in NH's summertime!

Visit my websites:
FreeWheelSpa.com orpastorbobnlnh.com
pastorbobnlnh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-24-07, 05:29 AM   #20
Bikedued
Senior Member
 
Bikedued's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Bikes:
Posts: 10,624
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 20 Post(s)
That's an eye opener!? Whoa!! I can't imagine where it could have come from, that the owner didn't notice SOMETHING was unusual about it. Like I've said before, to some people, it's just an old bike. No matter how antique, or nicely made, or historic they might be. They see a little rust, or it's unusable, and it gets thrown out. I imagine this one came from a spring cleaning at an old barn, or someplace similar. NICE find!,,,,,BD
Bikedued is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-24-07, 06:04 AM   #21
LWaB
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Auld Blighty
Bikes: Early Cannondale tandem, '99 S&S Frezoni Audax, '65 Moulton Stowaway, '52 Claud Butler, TSR30, Brompton
Posts: 2,240
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Can't tell from the rim profile but there looks to be too much frame clearance for solid tyres, possibly cushion tyres but probably very early pneumatics. I'm not familiar with American cycles though.

It is good to see a bike that actually belongs in a vintage forum.
LWaB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-24-07, 06:12 AM   #22
pastorbobnlnh 
Freewheel Medic
Thread Starter
 
pastorbobnlnh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Ascending or Descending the NH Mountains NW of Concord!
Bikes: Snazzy* Schwinns, Classy Cannondales, & a Lonely '83 Santana Tandem (* Ed.)
Posts: 10,237
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by LWaB
Can't tell from the rim profile but there looks to be too much frame clearance for solid tyres, possibly cushion tyres but probably very early pneumatics. I'm not familiar with American cycles though.

It is good to see a bike that actually belongs in a vintage forum.
Thanks for your observation. My guess is pneumatics because there is a valve stem hole in each rim--- a big valve stem hole. It shows in one picture above, but here is a closeup. Notice the nippleless spokes.
__________________
Bob
Dreaming about riding in NH's summertime!

Visit my websites:
FreeWheelSpa.com orpastorbobnlnh.com
pastorbobnlnh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-24-07, 06:23 AM   #23
old and new
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Bikes:
Posts: 3,134
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
That was a five dollar bike new. It'll make good re-bar for a cement patio,it's new home,back in the ground.
old and new is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-24-07, 06:35 AM   #24
infinityeye
Nut
 
infinityeye's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Tallahassle, FL
Bikes:
Posts: 697
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I'd guess it's worth 15K to 20k in its current condition. Mana from Heaven, and you deserve it!

Dump find of the Century!
infinityeye is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-24-07, 09:06 AM   #25
evwxxx
FalconLvr
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: SW Virginia
Bikes: 62 Falcon, 58 Raleigh Lenton Gran Prix, 74 Raleigh Pro, 75 Raleigh Int, 75 Raleigh Comp, 76 Colnago Super, 75 Crescent, 80 Peugeot PX10, plus others too numerous to mention!
Posts: 1,183
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Could be an Antiques Roadshow item!
evwxxx is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:48 AM.