fatigoworld

can anyone tell me of any make/models of 27 inch (wheel size) frames with decent to high end tubing? something comparable to columbus sl or even more current like reynolds 631 would be great. thanks....

oh, and heres the hard part....must have cantilever bosses...

caterham

27" wheel size or frame size?
what kind of use or ride characteristics are you after?

fatigoworld

27 inch wheel size. i am looking to build it up with 700c wheels for a LOT of tire clearance and these older bikes have horizontal drop outs AND derailleur hangers so i can ride single speed and gears. basically i want it for ultimate versatility but on the cheap compared to newer "do it all" frames.....

even the current frames with these specs are basic crmo so if i could find a vintage model with better tubing im pretty sure ill be happy with it...

enjoi

schwinn paramount

dannyg1 

Univega Gran touring
Trek 720 (I think that's the number)
Schwinn Voyageur SP
Raleigh Alyeska ( of which I have a 56cm for sale)
Miyata touring ( can't remember the model name)
Fuji tourer (can't remember the model name)
Nishiki made a couple
Mercian, Bob Jackson, Herse and singer made a bunch.

fatigoworld

have you seen one with cantilever bosses? i would drool if i found one of those...

dannyg1 

Oh yes, can't forget this one, probably the most premium Kuwamura frame ever: Centurian Pro Tour. Bridgestone made a ton as well.

Danny

fatigoworld

JACKPOT, thank you!

halfspeed

Also Trek 520 and 620.

rhenning

I have a Holdworth as you described. Built as a touring frame with half step gearing. 531 Reynolds. Roger

well biked

Sorry to be off topic, but do you know for sure that the Centurion Pro Tours were made by Kuwamura? I have an '83 Pro Tour, but I've not seen any info on who actually manufactured the frames. Thanks for any info-

enjoi

didnt read the cantilever part

unworthy1

spelling patrol:
Kawamura
-or-
Kuwahara
(might help you when you search archives)

hhabca

The beauty of old steel frames is you can braze canti bosses onto them if you want, but don't rule out using center pull brakes either. Also, a 27 inch frame with 700c wheels in it will have lots of tire clearance if older style side pull brakes are used. Modern (like after 1995 or so?) single and dual pivots seem to bend in closer to the tires than older single pivot brakes did.

dannyg1 

There weren't many large scale manufacturers of frames in Japan during the mid-80's and the Japanese were busily trying to dominate the bicycle business much the way that Microsoft later did in the software business. Kuwahara (I really out to check out the proper spelling of this) made frames for Fuji, Panasonic, Miyata, Nishiki, Diamond Back, Univega, Sekai, Centurion and then, as they started to obliterate the competition on price (and closed down venerable factories the world over in one of the earliest examples of outsourcing), for Raleigh, Bianchi, Motobecane, Schwinn and countless others (even Trek).

I'm always surprised at the disparity in pricing between some bikes, like say the Univega Gran touring and the equivalent (in almost every detail) Miyata touring. The Miyata will sell for easily $100 more and it's so close to identical that there really isn't any difference to note.

So, in answer to your question, no. I cannot say that Kuwahara made the Centurion Pro Tour. It could've been Toyo. Looking at the build and comparing it directly with Univega's Gran Premio and Miyata's Team (known Kuwahara) and Specialized Allez's (Known Toyo), it's a no-brainer for me to make that call.

Danny

unworthy1

one of the things that's confusing is that Kawamura built many of the Nishikis up through 1979 (at least), and then there's these Kuwahara built Nishikis in the '80s...keeps you on your toes...
Back to the OP's question: I think you'll find much more in the way of high-grade tubing bikes with cantilever bosses on TOURING rigs from this period, and the Japanese homages to classic French touring rigs are your best value/easiest to find. Probably all will be Tange or Ishiwata tubing. You'll find precious few cyclocross bikes that will be cheap AND have good tubing (but, could happen) and precious few of either built with Columbus tubing...531 touring bikes were far more prevalent in Europe, you might find a cheap one if you're patient and lucky. Don't neglect Treks: many 531 tourists out there with good build quality.