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Old 03-11-08, 12:07 AM   #1
Bacciagalupe
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Proper Tires for an 80s Bike

Early last year, I picked up an 80s steel road bike. Unfortunately, I've gotten a lot of tire blow-outs (as chronicled in this thread). The evidence indicates that the newer tires are not fitting tight enough on the newer rims.

The tires I've used so far include Specialized All Condition Pro 23c's (folding), Conti UltraSport 23's and 25's. The rims are Araya 700c and do not have a hook bead.

So, any recommendations? The ideal tire would be:
- reasonably fast
- fairly robust (road conditions suck 'round here)
- 25c's are fine

Merci beaucoup....
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Old 03-11-08, 06:39 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bacciagalupe View Post
Early last year, I picked up an 80s steel road bike. Unfortunately, I've gotten a lot of tire blow-outs (as chronicled in this thread). The evidence indicates that the newer tires are not fitting tight enough on the newer rims.

The tires I've used so far include Specialized All Condition Pro 23c's (folding), Conti UltraSport 23's and 25's. The rims are Araya 700c and do not have a hook bead.

So, any recommendations? The ideal tire would be:
- reasonably fast
- fairly robust (road conditions suck 'round here)
- 25c's are fine

Merci beaucoup....
I've had good luck with Nashbar and Performance's cheap tires-Primas, Forte, ect. The Fortes tend to be one size smaller than marked size.
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Old 03-11-08, 07:44 AM   #3
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I am happily and safely using Vittorias on my non-hooked rims, but part of the secret is keeping the tire pressure below 80 PSI, front and rear.
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Old 03-11-08, 08:16 AM   #4
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Not to discount anyone's expertise or specific advice here, but one lesson that several of us have learned the hard way is that there are no hard or fast rules for getting these old rims to work for you.

Don't give up too easily. Maybe try a couple of brands. Maybe try a few different PSI levels. I have managed to nurse along a couple of wheelsets that gave me fits, and I have given up on a couple too. I don't mind endless tinkering on some bikes, but on some I want to be able to actually trust them enough to go beyond walking distance from home.

My only advice (and it will be rebutted vigorously here, probably) is avoid kevlar beads. I do not understand why, but they consistently give me trouble on old rims.

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Old 03-11-08, 08:27 AM   #5
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I have been successful for several years with Vredestein Ricorso, wire bead, 700 x 23 tires at 90-95 pounds pressure on Araya 700c non hooked rims. I had also suffered multiple blow outs with other brands/sizes and slowly raised the pressure after success at the 75-80 pound level. Don
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Old 03-11-08, 08:38 AM   #6
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I am enjoying my (new) Hutchinson kevlar protechs (25s) on my mavic 700c module Es
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Old 03-11-08, 08:50 AM   #7
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[QUOTE=Bacciagalupe;6319709]Early last year, I picked up an 80s steel road bike. Unfortunately, I've gotten a lot of tire blow-outs (as chronicled in this thread). The evidence indicates that the newer tires are not fitting tight enough on the newer rims.

The tires I've used so far include Specialized All Condition Pro 23c's (folding), Conti UltraSport 23's and 25's. The rims are Araya 700c and do not have a hook bead.
QUOTE]

If I were to recommend a tire it would be the Conti UltraSport that you've used or the Performance Forte tires top 506 recommends. If you go with Forte get the cheaper steel bead, not the kevlar (see thread by Cuda2k who had a similiar problem.) Conti's have a reputation for being a tight fit, mine were a bear to mount.
BTW, in your other thread you explained the bead on your rims is a bulge bead, not hooked, not flat. I put 100PSI in similiar rims with no problem. But, I use 80 PSI, like John E recommends, when the inner wall of the rim is flat.
Sorry, not much help.
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Old 03-11-08, 08:54 AM   #8
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Yup, I've recently been dealing with a very similar problem. I have a set of Conti Ultra-Sports now, running them at about 85 psi without any additional problems. Tires feel a bit soft compared to my other bikes running 100-115psi, but for the bike that wheelset is on, I just consider it even more of a 'ride smoothing effect'.
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Old 03-11-08, 09:21 AM   #9
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I have had success with Gatorskins on my 70s and 80s model wheels.
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Old 03-11-08, 06:04 PM   #10
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So, I had a few minutes and wandered into a LBS. As soon as I said "old bike" and "folding tire," the mechanic was already muttering about how those two don't mix, knew exactly which rims I had, and how he's been working on bikes way too long.

We discussed a few options; non-folding Specialized All Condition may be OK. However, we also discussed rebuilding the wheel, using the old hubs, new spokes, new rims. The mechanic's theory is the older hubs (Suzue "Sealed-Tech") will be equal or better quality than something new. Estimate is around $150 per wheel.

Any thoughts on this? The bike fits and doesn't have much visible rust, just a little at the seat tube bolt. I've had the bike a year, and have already replaced the seat tube bolt, cassette, chainrings, DT shifters, repacked the BB. Is there anything left to swap out?
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Old 03-11-08, 06:20 PM   #11
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I'm surprised an 80's vintage bike doesn't have at least some bit of a rib on the bead. I just changed out the Araya rims on my Nishiki to some slightly newer ones that have a small ridge in them and it makes a huge difference in how well the tire stays put.
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Old 03-11-08, 06:27 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bacciagalupe View Post
So, I had a few minutes and wandered into a LBS. As soon as I said "old bike" and "folding tire," the mechanic was already muttering about how those two don't mix, knew exactly which rims I had, and how he's been working on bikes way too long.

We discussed a few options; non-folding Specialized All Condition may be OK. However, we also discussed rebuilding the wheel, using the old hubs, new spokes, new rims. The mechanic's theory is the older hubs (Suzue "Sealed-Tech") will be equal or better quality than something new. Estimate is around $150 per wheel.

Any thoughts on this? The bike fits and doesn't have much visible rust, just a little at the seat tube bolt. I've had the bike a year, and have already replaced the seat tube bolt, cassette, chainrings, DT shifters, repacked the BB. Is there anything left to swap out?
Ask yourself that seriously, and you'll go from this:



To this:



To this:



To possibly a carbon fork next, not for a longggg time anyway.
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Old 03-11-08, 06:41 PM   #13
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Estimate is around $150 per wheel.
That seems like an awful lot!
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Old 03-11-08, 07:02 PM   #14
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I'm going to second the recommendation for Continental ultra-sports. Those things are a huge pain just to get mounted to most rims so I doubt they would want to pop off too easily. They do tend to get easier to mount the longer you ride them so I don't know how long they would want to stay seated on your rims
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Old 03-11-08, 07:39 PM   #15
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I had both folding ultra sports on my Tesch blow off the rim. I went to wire bead and haven't had a problem since. The Ultras did go on super tight and still blew off, forcing me to walk home twice, and limp home at 2mph once. I don't mind the weight, I just don't want any more sudden deflations at cruising speed.,,,,BD

This was on Wolber TX profil's in nearly NOS condition. At my current weight of 225 bikes feel squirmy at lower pressures.

My tires of choice lately have been Bontrager Race lite hardcase, Serfas Seca, and Bontrager Select K gumwall. I can't do Conti wire beads on all my bikes, the cost would be prohibitive.
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Old 03-11-08, 07:43 PM   #16
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Koala: The rims have a lip but aren't the "hook" type, so a lot of modern tires are too loose, and allow the tube to bulge off the rim.

Cuda / Kinetikx: The UltraSports are ok but don't have enough flat protection.

IIRC the breakdown was $80 for good quality rims, $36 for spokes, $35 for labor, $6 for new rim tape.
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Old 03-11-08, 08:54 PM   #17
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$300 is a lot of attachment to older hubs. I would go for some newer wheels off ebay. But first, I'd try some of the recommendations from this thread. If you've been using Kevlar bead tires, that could contribute to the problem. Maybe some non-folding tires with a reputation for being tight will fix the problem and save quite a few dollars.
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