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Old 05-05-08, 08:48 AM   #1
Citoyen du Monde
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Cool 1987 Masi frame for sale

Has anybody ever seen one of these Masi 3V with Kevlar tubing in the flesh?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=320248126194

The tubes have a great finish to them with a filigrane type finish. I have seen one other Masi with the same finish. In that case it was a model that the seller called a Super Prestige with more traditional lugs (this auction bike has the standard 3V internal lugs.

It would appear that the frame is made with kevlar reinforced steel. How does that work? I read somewhere that the kevlar was used internally, any independent confirmation of that? The paint job is also really nice: it has the retinato or fishnet paint that was popular in Italy in the late 80's and early 90's (Colnago and others also offered it). The paint also appears to have a pearlescent effect. For somebody looking for a 59 cm C/C frame, this looks to be quite a catch.
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Old 05-06-08, 04:10 AM   #2
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Thanks very much.
I had a guy drop off his custom-built decal-less bike today, and it was made of that funky tubing. I had heard of Excell before, but hadn't seen their stuff in real life.
I love it when mysteries get solved like this.
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Old 05-06-08, 07:16 AM   #3
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Have you tried contacting Norris Lockley? He built with Excell, visited the supplier, M. Rezze, and at one point obtained some with the carbon fiber lining. I'll bet he could tell us quite a bit about it.
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Old 05-06-08, 08:52 AM   #4
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Wow.

And it fits me perfectly. Its budget, however, probably won't (not to mention the year of silent hatred I would have to endure from my girlfriend--if we lasted the year).

Any educated guesses as to its value?
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Old 05-06-08, 12:24 PM   #5
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Wow.

And it fits me perfectly. Its budget, however, probably won't (not to mention the year of silent hatred I would have to endure from my girlfriend--if we lasted the year).

Any educated guesses as to its value?
Value is a subjective topic. About all I can say is that it won't remain at $51. My guess is that it will go for something in the range of $500-1500. How is that for a cop-out answer?

BTW, if a girlfriend is capable of making you suffer through a year of silent hatred, it is time to dump her!
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Old 05-06-08, 12:40 PM   #6
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a 1989 example just went on eBay for 767 + shipping. This one, with cooler paint, cool headtube detail, and being two years older, I would guess it will go for about $900. I bought a 1991 "Team 3V" (which turned out to be a 3/Volumetrica painted as a Team 3V) for $150 on Craigslist, and the bike shop guessed I had paid $800 for it on eBay.. so from what I've seen, the value of these frames is all over the map... I definitely lucked out though.
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Old 05-06-08, 01:00 PM   #7
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BTW, if a girlfriend is capable of making you suffer through a year of silent hatred, it is time to dump her!
Exaggerating for drama. What would actually happen is I would lie about how much I paid, she would nonetheless shake her head in disbelief, and I would eat dinner alone that night, celebrating on the inside while doing my best to look adequately chastened on the out.

What will actually happen: I won't even bother bidding...instead I'll wait the 20 years it'll take for me to be in the income bracket that would allow me to build it up, by which time I'll be scouring the back pages for the second owner's estate sale.

EDIT: I'm going to guess $1037. Gentlemen, do I have at least two numbers right?
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Old 05-06-08, 05:33 PM   #8
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My Gardin has Excell tubing but it's steel, not Kevlar. I haven't been able to find out anything else about Excell tubing except that it's good stuff.

Last edited by bbattle; 05-06-08 at 05:48 PM.
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Old 05-06-08, 08:36 PM   #9
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This tubing is steel too. Acier = steel.

I am guessing that the kevlar is like, maybe, reinforcing tape or something, ala the boron tape that Klein used to use on the team super. Anyone know?
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Old 09-03-08, 04:12 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Citoyen du Monde View Post
Has anybody ever seen one of these Masi 3V with Kevlar tubing in the flesh?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=320248126194

The tubes have a great finish to them with a filigrane type finish. I have seen one other Masi with the same finish. In that case it was a model that the seller called a Super Prestige with more traditional lugs (this auction bike has the standard 3V internal lugs.

It would appear that the frame is made with kevlar reinforced steel. How does that work? I read somewhere that the kevlar was used internally, any independent confirmation of that? The paint job is also really nice: it has the retinato or fishnet paint that was popular in Italy in the late 80's and early 90's (Colnago and others also offered it). The paint also appears to have a pearlescent effect. For somebody looking for a 59 cm C/C frame, this looks to be quite a catch.
Digging up an old thread!

Correct. A mate of mine had one. His father was a framebuilder and built a few frames out of it. One for his son and a couple for some American bloke who lived out here in Australia for about 18 months. IIRC it was the yank who supplied the tubing. Buggered if I know how Excell did it, but it looked like it had a carbon tube inside the steel tube for want of a better explanation. The carbon ended before it got to the point where the lugs would be and where all the heat would be when it was brazed. It may have had to have been silver soldered like 753, but I can't 100% remember. My mate cracked the frame within about 12 month of getting it - good luck with whinging to the framebuilder. It was a gimmick IMHO.
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Old 05-18-17, 10:21 AM   #11
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Gardin Excell (carbon/kevlar)

Hi,

I am sorry for bumping such an old thread, but I recently did a search for the tubing I had specified for a custom-built Gardin frame--put together in the late 1980s (1988, I think). I was in my late teens when I had a frame built of the Excell tubing, the version with the carbon fiber kevlar internal reinforcement. It was a long time ago so I don't remember where I came across the idea of using that tubing, but I guess I must have got caught up in some advertising. I remember spending I'm good chunk of a couple days working out the exact specs for the frame I wanted built.

As is obvious from the picture, I think that it was put together by Joe Gardin, who passed away a few years ago, but from what I gathered in another thread what is a FrameBuilder for good chunk of 1980s and 1990s. Being tall, it is a large frame, and I remember a brief phone call (or two) with Joe as he had a couple questions about the frame specs. My memories of the calls is a little bit faded, but I think he may have some concerns about using carbon reinforce fiber in the seat tube. The brazing or soldering was a bit tricky if I remember correctly. I think that he had a custom order in the tube set, and he may have been the first time he put together a frame with that particular version of the Excell tubing. I remember waiting quite a few weeks to receive it, so it may have even have been a special order. If I remember correctly, bottom bracket height was a tad bit higher than normal, and the down tube and seat tube angles were speced at 74, I think! I really love the frame, so much so, that even though I haven't been on it for over 20 years, I never hesitated to take that bike with me as I moved here and there across Canada during that period. I rode a couple years ago, and even though I was 50 pounds heavier than the 175 pounds I was at 18 years old, it still felt as good as it did 30 years ago!

I think that brazing or soldering the frame was a bit tricky if I remember correctly. The temperature had to be watched carefully, and I can remember feeling inside the frame and noticing that near the joints some of the carbon fiber Kevlar had been "raised" due to the heat. But it doesn't seem to have impacted frame and it certainly was lightweight for its size, and although I had limited experience, it seemed very stiff stiff and responsive. It's showing a bit of its age with a couple small rust spots, but I had tuned up enough put it back on the road a couple years ago, and even at 230 pounds, it felt as good as it did back 30 years ago!

Sorry for the lengthy post!
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Old 05-18-17, 10:47 AM   #12
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@driemar - Welcome! thanks for your contribution! How about a drive side picture and some of the joints?

Do you really feel comfortable with the rack clamped to the ST? I have thought of that with a similar one that was given to me but just couldn't do it with the concern of damaging the tube either with clamping force or weight on the rack with the configuration of a big lever on the ST.
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Old 05-18-17, 03:08 PM   #13
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@driemar - Welcome! thanks for your contribution! How about a drive side picture and some of the joints?

Do you really feel comfortable with the rack clamped to the ST? I have thought of that with a similar one that was given to me but just couldn't do it with the concern of damaging the tube either with clamping force or weight on the rack with the configuration of a big lever on the ST.
Hi,

Thanks for the suggestion regarding the rack. I have to admit I didn't really think about it-it's only really been fender since I put it on. But your question made me think about it, and suddenly I didn't feel very comfortable at all with it being there. So it's been removed. I never really paid attention before just how thin the metal of the frame is. To me it's always been a frame that's been strong and held up well and always seem pretty stiff, but having come across the specs the other day, and actually having given it a bit of a "squeezed test" earlier today, I realize that that rack was a seriously bad idea!

I've attached some additional pictures. Thanks again for the recommendation!
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