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Old 10-11-08, 10:45 PM   #1
Mike Mills
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Nuovo Record Rear Deraileur Capacity

Does anyone know the size limit (largest number of teeth) on the freewheel that can be safely handled by a Nuovo Record rear deraileur?

To simplify the question, can it handle a 28 T cog on a freewheel that is 13T or 14T up to 28T? Would that 28T cog hurt the deraileur? Would I be better off (from a rear deraileur performance perspective) to stick with a 13-24T rear?

I'm not yet sure what I will have for chainrings but I suspect it will only be a 3T differential from large to small. If I went (worst case) 13-28 in the rear, is there a limit on front chainring differential due to rear deraileur capacity?

I used to know all this stuff (40 years ago). It just isn't clear any longer and I don't want to hurt (break) anything.
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Old 10-11-08, 11:10 PM   #2
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my understanding is that they were supposed to be able to handle 28 teeth. My opinion is that is a lie.
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Old 10-11-08, 11:23 PM   #3
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The official max tooth capacity is 26t for NR and 28t for SR (I'm guessing that is for the later models since the original SR seems to have been identical to the NR except for the titanium bits. I ran a NR 14-28 in the back and 52-42 in the front with no problems. That seems to be the maximum chain wrap capacity as the chain had to be exactly the right size - I couldn't go one link less or it would lock up and or one link more or the chain would sag in the little/little combination (yeah I know you're not supposed to).
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Old 10-12-08, 12:09 AM   #4
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Good info, guys, this is certainly consistent with what I remember. It is supposed to be able to take a 28T rear and probably will but it will be "happier" if a 26 or 24 T rear is used. Is that correct?

I also used to use a 42-52T front set up but I never found a really "slick" set up using 42-52 front chainrings. Given the above freewheel it should be able to handle a ten tooth differential in the front. Is that correct?

I did find gear ratio Nirvana in a 42-45 front X 13-15-17-21-26-32 rear (Suntour Ultra six speed). The thing is, this required the use of a touring-style deraileur (Shimano DEORE XT). The thing is, I want that Nuovo Record rear deraileur back on this bike.

I think I'll go with my 14-24T rear and 42-47 on the front. I have to sit down and work out a decent set of gear ratios but until then I want to ride this thing - and soon.

Last edited by Mike Mills; 10-12-08 at 12:14 AM.
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Old 10-12-08, 12:31 AM   #5
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Good info, guys, this is certainly consistent with what I remember. It is supposed to be able to take a 28T rear and probably will but it will be "happier" if a 26 or 24 T rear is used. Is that correct?
That has been my experience and that of my friends/rivals. Campy was designed for racing, and the usual freewheels were a pretty tight range. If you were running an 11 - 24 5 spd. a Campy NR would be great and fast-shifting with it's tight, short cage design. While it could handle a 28 if it had to, it was "happier" not. One would generally go find a derailleur that was designed for the wider ranges. Like Huret, Simplex, and, finally, Suntour. The Suntour Honor really took off and the field of rear derailleurs was forever changed.

Last edited by Panthers007; 10-12-08 at 10:54 AM. Reason: Oops...
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Old 10-12-08, 02:41 AM   #6
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Cool!

I'm putting the Suntour ProCompe 14-24 on tomorrow. I have a DuraAce 14-22 on it right now. After I get a chance to look over the gear ratios, I'll buy something put together that's a bit better. I've been looking over the freewheel offerings on ebay.

Regarding wider range derailleurs, I have a Suntour Cyclone and a Suntour LaPreel here at home. I still have the Shimano DEORE XT, too. The Nuovo Record is on the bike and unless it breaks it's staying - probably for the rest of my lifetime.


Thanks for all the help, guys.
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Old 10-12-08, 02:45 AM   #7
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My Campagnoloed Continental: 15-29 in the rear, 42-47 up front. It works but is not always "Happy."
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Old 10-12-08, 07:53 AM   #8
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Derailer cog capacity has to do with not just the derailer itself, but also the offset (drop) of the hanger from the axle centerline. To accommodate a couple more teeth, it might be possible to set up a rear end with a bit more offset, by moving the axle slightly. Tire clearance and chain length would limit your ability to do this, naturally. Of course, with a non-integral hanger, you could always change it for a longer one, if you can find such a thing.
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Old 10-12-08, 08:15 AM   #9
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I put a Rally cage on my NR. It presently has a 14X28, but it looks like it could easily handle more than 28, mayby even 34. It shifts like a NR, which is okay if you're used to them. I know it would shift so much better with a Shimano Deore or any other modern long cage derailer, but it would be wrong on a '74 PX10


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Old 10-12-08, 08:46 AM   #10
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I put a Rally cage on my NR. It presently has a 14X28, but it looks like it could easily handle more than 28, mayby even 34. It shifts like a NR, which is okay if you're used to them. I know it would shift so much better with a Shimano Deore or any other modern long cage derailer, but it would be wrong on a '74 PX10...
Interesting, I didn't realize that was a possibility.

Have you considered a Huret Duopar?
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Old 10-12-08, 09:25 AM   #11
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Interesting, I didn't realize that was a possibility.

Have you considered a Huret Duopar?
The setup I have works well enough. Like I said, it shifts like a NR. You have to readjust after each shift because the cage has to go slightly past the cog before the chain will move over. Frank Berto calls it "late Shifting". You get used to it and it becomes automatic. I was perfectly happy with the NR until I tried an Ultegra.
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Old 10-12-08, 09:28 AM   #12
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My Campagnoloed Continental: 15-29 in the rear, 42-47 up front. It works but is not always "Happy."
You'll likely get different results with that setup, Bob. There is something about that dropout that makes your NR RD swing forward, much like an SR. In fact, I dare say it would act identical to a second-gen SR if it had an SR cage on it.

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Old 10-12-08, 09:34 AM   #13
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whats the capacity of gran sport? Ive heard of people putting GS cages on NR derailleurs for touring purposes.
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Old 10-12-08, 09:54 AM   #14
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Nuovo Gran Sport or Gran Sport from the '60s?

Nuovo Gran Sport has the same cage geometry as NR, while Gran Sport spins in the center and has less takeup.

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Old 10-12-08, 09:58 AM   #15
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hm. mustve heard wrong then. ill have to pester the friend who told me that again for more specifics.
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Old 10-12-08, 10:07 AM   #16
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If you were running an 11 - 24 5 spd. a Campy NR would be great and fast-shifting with it's tight, short cage design.
Except for the fact that unless the low limit stop is set slightly outboard of the small cog (which is exaggerated far more so on a NR RD that has been bent slightly out of alignment), NR's will not reliably shift down to the small cog while running in the big ring.

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Old 10-12-08, 10:46 AM   #17
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my understanding is that they were supposed to be able to handle 28 teeth. My opinion is that is a lie.

Been running 28 teeth since 1972; even used a 30 on a tour once...
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Old 10-12-08, 10:59 AM   #18
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I loved my Huret Duopar (titanium). Ran that on 13 - 28 Suntour New Winner 6spd. freewheel. It was flawless. Now I'm running an IRD 7spd. 12 - 28 freewheel on that bike (from 1982) with an Ultegra GS. Smoothest shifting ever. The Dura Ace, like the Campy, doesn't much care for 28+ cogs. You can get an Ultegra for $40 - new - from a shop out in California. Best price going, I bought a couple.
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Old 10-12-08, 01:26 PM   #19
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Been running 28 teeth since 1972; even used a 30 on a tour once...
But your example is also running the same hanger that allows the derailer to sit much farther forward then an ordinary Campagnolo 1010B dropout would.

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Old 10-12-08, 01:44 PM   #20
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But your example is also running the same hanger that allows the derailer to sit much farther forward then an ordinary Campagnolo 1010B dropout would.

-Kurt
Yeah, run a 28 on my 84 Cinelli too... in fact, all the bikes I ride.
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Old 10-12-08, 02:18 PM   #21
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Do you have a photo of the position of the pulley cage when in the large cog?

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Old 10-12-08, 05:00 PM   #22
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The setup I have works well enough. Like I said, it shifts like a NR. You have to readjust after each shift because the cage has to go slightly past the cog before the chain will move over. Frank Berto calls it "late Shifting". You get used to it and it becomes automatic. I was perfectly happy with the NR until I tried an Ultegra.
I noticed "late shifting" with a Duopar and a 14X32 Suntour FW, too. Like you said, you get used to it. Just overshift a little and move the lever back a fraction.

Earlier this year, I bought a Campagnolo SR to replace the Duopar and a Shimano HG 13X28 HG FW. That combination seems to shift very well, but it might be the HG FW making the difference for me.
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Old 10-12-08, 05:04 PM   #23
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I loved my Huret Duopar (titanium). Ran that on 13 - 28 Suntour New Winner 6spd. freewheel. It was flawless. Now I'm running an IRD 7spd. 12 - 28 freewheel on that bike (from 1982) with an Ultegra GS. Smoothest shifting ever. The Dura Ace, like the Campy, doesn't much care for 28+ cogs. You can get an Ultegra for $40 - new - from a shop out in California. Best price going, I bought a couple.
If you don't mind sharing, where did you buy an Ultegra GS for $40?
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Old 10-12-08, 05:31 PM   #24
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Will the Nuovo Record RD handle a 14-28 7spd freewheel?
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Old 10-12-08, 05:37 PM   #25
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Will the Nuovo Record RD handle a 14-28 7spd freewheel?
Yes. See my Cinelli pic. I'll try and shoot one in the 28.
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