snowfox

Oh no!!! Not another Peugeot ID thread!!!!

Well, I'm not new to this bike, but I am new-ish to the Peugeot history and identification. What I am dealing with here is the road bike that I raced through high school. My enthusiastic cycling and later racing 'career' began on a new 85 or 86 Peugeot 'Tourmalet'. As I wore out or straight destroyed components on that bike, I replaced them with upgraded bits that I could afford or beg for as gifts from family. (Not much $$$ - I was a sophmore in H.S. back then.) After about a year and a half and 12-15k miles, the Tourmalet's HLE frame cracked. (Drive side chainstay at the chainstay bridge.) I went back to the shop where I had gotten the bike and was told that I could return the frame to them for a replacement or credit toward another frame. I chose the latter route and added another $4-500 to my credit to get this Pegeot - but it was not identified as the frame of a particular (then) current model. Based on my research through newly discovered Peugeot sites, I have determined that it is a 1988 frame. (Makes sense, that's when I bought it.) It is a 54cm with Reynolds 531 Professional tubing. What seems odd to me, is that the graphics scheme does not directly match anything I have been able to find on-line. Can I get a little help from the experts? Based on history I have been reading, I have come to suspect that it is a PZ-10 frameset, but I'm not sure.

Pix for evaluation:

In her cobwebbed and dust coated glory, straight out of the shed this weekend:


Frame details:
54 cm
Reynolds 531 Prof. frame and fork
Simplex dropouts
x2 bottle cage mounts, cable guides, head tube pump peg, & chain hanger braze-ons
Hand brazed
Made in France
BB s/n: B 812 38227











Some of the component details:
Ancient Avocet computer
Sugino ALP crankset (52/42, 144 BCD) with Campy Triomphe pedals/clips
32h Wolber Super Champion Alpines on Shimano 105 hubs
105 Brakes
6spd 105 freewheel, 105 Rear deraileur, 600 Ultegra shifters, ofmega front deraileur
600 EX headset, SR drops and seatpost
Brooks Professional saddle (Gift from neighbor's 'old' Peugeot back in 87 when he went to a gel saddle. He estimated it was 14 years old at that time.)









Sorry these are kinda rough- I didn't upload them with very good resolution nor did I get very good pix with the wifey's digi-cam.

So what exactly am I working with for a frame here? late PX, PY, PZ, or ??? I'm not looking to get rid of it - on the contrary, I plan to get it back in shape and use it to get myself back in shape, too. I'm just curious if any of the resident Peugeotphiles can give me some feedback.

Thanks in advance!
Damon

T-Mar

Traditionally, the Peugeot model with Reynolds 531 SL/Professional was the PY10. I believe this is what you have. The serial number indicates 1988 manufacture, so it could be a 1988 or 1989 model. By this time, the US models had dropped the number designation and were going by names, with the 1988 531P model being named Sante, after it's Shimano component group. There was no US 531P model in 1989. Since Sante was not available in white and did not have a chrome fork, I believe that you have a European version, which was still called the PY10.

snowfox

From what I've seen, the Sante also had the 'splash' graphics, as well - but wasn't available in white. Does anyone have a line on 88 or 89 European Peugeot manuals/catalogs?

Information here ( https://cyclespeugeot.com/PX10.html ) indicates that the PY-10 was not available in the US after 80 or Europe after 86, being replaced by the PZ as the custom order steel bike. Then a little further down it says that the PY and PZ contined through 90 with the PX being continued as the PZ. I guess I've got a P-something...

miamijim

Although Peugeot was transitioning to model 'names' vs. model 'numbers' in the late 80's they still had traditional alphanumeric names on the little paper stickers.

I agree, the frameset in question is more than likely a European model as nothing corresponds to what was available in North America (or the French market). If I had to tag a name to it I'd say its a PZ model as steel PY's were history by the late 80's.

T-Mar

1988 European catalog showing PY10 with Reynolds 531 Professional. Very similar to OP's frame except for color and striped decals. Variation may be due to market or model year.

snowfox

Zooming in really close to 'translate' the specs on the above, I discovered that in addition to the wrong decal scheme/format, they did not list my 54cm frame size. It gets curiouser and curiouser...

More ideas? :confused:

unworthy1

T-Mar and miamijim are the best in the business...
I think your only hope now is a time machine

snowfox

Without doubt. Jim's site has been particularly helpful in my early investigations. Without the benefit of a handful of Peugeot-centric forums, I would not have been able to do much more than ask the n00b question of "Can anyone ID this old Peugeot for me?" A little research indicated that it's a P(?)-10 and informed me of what pertinent photos I had better provide if I wanted any help. If anyone else can come up with other alternate European market information or team frame possibilities, I would appreciate it.

Any comments on the 'correct' restoration of my old girl? It's obviously a mish-mash of affordable & 'decent' performing components hung on a (IMHO) very nice frame. I want to at least return it to its previous level of performance, but period correct improvements would be sweet, too. If it were yours to 'resurrect', how would you set it up?

Bikedued

Dura Ace 7400 7 speed, definitely! That's how I would do it. Find some nice NOS grey or black anodized rims for good measure. The paint looks very salvageable, and the saddle is almost perfect considering the age. Looks like an easy project for the most part.,,,,BD

NICE frame, btw. I'm jealous, hehe.

cudak888 

Looks like a small-rivet Brooks Pro though, pre-dating the bike considerably.

-Kurt

Bikedued

Yes, he should send it to me to be properly disposed of, on my Falcon San Remo!,,,,BD

snowfox

Dura Ace would def be sweet, but it was WAY out of my high school budget when it was current. It is prbably more affordable now, than say, a Campy gruppo. New rims would probably be just about required at this point. The Wolbers that are pictured have about 15k miles on them, if memory serves, and are a little the worse for wear. They will be serviceable in the short term though. Getting this old beast road worthy should not be too big a project - getting the rider road worthy is another thing entirely, though.

I'm not savvy to the history or differentiation of Brooks saddles. If I was informed correctly when I received this one, it is circa 1970-75. Definitely predates the frame and other components.

Good input, so far. More comments and feedback are appreciated.

snowfox

In trade for which Dura Ace 7400 components?

miamijim

Your in luck because Peugeot was using Campy, Shimano, Mavic, Stronglight and Scahs parts just to name a few on their high end bikes back in the late 80's. I havent seen Dura Ace but they used Chorus, Triomphe, 600 and 105 groups.

A frameset like yours was used on 5 or so French models which were available with a variety of paint/chrome schems and component groups.

b1g bleu

Nice bike, looks like if you clean it up (especially the aero hoods) you could ride it now!

snowfox

Yeah, those hoods are pretty hammered. They are disintegrating/breaking down pretty bad - kinda tacky feeling. At the very least, I need to tear into the drive and give it a THOROUGH cleaning and relube. I'll have to check out the tires, too. I put new ones on just before it went into 'mothballs' and haven't even scrubbed the center rib/flashing off yet - but they are more than 10 years old. I'm not too sure that I trust that old a tire at high pressure. I wonder if I can wake up the old Avocet computer. Anybody else have one of these old relics? I've forgotten how to calibrate it for wheel size.

b1g bleu

Plastic+glue breakdown sucks, I just now pulled a roll of 15-20 YEAR OLD 3M electrical tape (the best stuff you could get) from a shelf in my garage, the glue was sticking to the outside of the tape! Avocet computer? Is that a regulator you put between the wheel and the pump?

snowfox

Just found and downloaded the owners manual.
https://www.avocet.com/instrpdfs/20.pdf

That's about how powerful and intelligent the ol' Avocet 20 is, yup. I guess if I'm going a bit retro-performance on this, I might as well stick with the original Hi-Tech I had back in the day...

Sirrus Rider

Nothing wrong with that though. It's conceivable that it could have worn an older saddle in it's lifetime. It looks like it goes unlike a brand new "public toilet seat" drop-nose whiz-banger saddle..

snowfox

It is, in fact, the only saddle this bike has worn for its entire lifetime.

n00b question:
Any good links where I can get educated a little on Brooks saddles? (Both from the historical perspective and on the best way for me to soften this one up a tad?)

VPR

[QUOTE=T-Mar;7784223]Traditionally, the Peugeot model with Reynolds 531 SL/Professional was the PY10. I believe this is what you have. The serial number indicates 1988 manufacture, so it could be a 1988 or 1989 model. By this time, the US models had dropped the number designation and were going by names, with the 1988 531P model being named Sante, after it's Shimano component group. There was no US 531P model in 1989. Since Sante was not available in white and did not have a chrome fork, I believe that you have a European version, which was still called the PY10.[/QUOTE

can you tell me how you identified the year from the serial number?

VPR

never mind, i found it on that cyclepeugeot page