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  1. #1
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    Is it a fake? Peugeot Perthus Reynolds 753

    Dear all, I think I have just bought a fake Peugeot Perthus Reynolds 753 bike. It's in great condition considering it is 25 years old regardless of what it might be BUT someone has just told me that because the decals stating it is a 753 are above the lacquer then it is probably not real. Can anyone let me know how I can check for sure?

    I've attached a few pictures which may help....

    Many thanks. M
    Attached Images Attached Images

  2. #2
    Senior Member miamijim's Avatar
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    How about some full size pictures of better qaulity?
    WWW.CYCLESPEUGEOT.COM 2005 Pinarello Dogma; 1991 Paramount PDG 70 Mtb; 1976? AD Vent Noir; 1989 LeMond Maillot Juane F&F; 1993? Basso GAP F&F; 1989 Terry Symmetry; 2003 Trek 4700 Mtb; 1983 Vitus 979

  3. #3
    If I own it, I ride it CV-6's Avatar
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    +1 on photos, but probably not much help in reality. What is the seat post size? Strip the bike of all components and weigh the frame.
    Lynn Travers

    Photos

    ISO: Lejeune Champion du Monde Ultra Leger Reynolds 753, 53-55cm

  4. #4
    Old fart JohnDThompson's Avatar
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    Peugeot did make 753 frames, so it's not entirely out of the question. Is the tubing decal in English or French? If it's in French, I'd say it's authentically 753.

  5. #5
    Senior Member miamijim's Avatar
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    John,

    My '88 U.K. catalog has English worded 753 decals on the next page the 531SL bike had French worded decals!!!! From what fuzziness I can see it looks like a made in France Perthus Pro from ~'88. The chroming, decal and paint schemes all match up.
    WWW.CYCLESPEUGEOT.COM 2005 Pinarello Dogma; 1991 Paramount PDG 70 Mtb; 1976? AD Vent Noir; 1989 LeMond Maillot Juane F&F; 1993? Basso GAP F&F; 1989 Terry Symmetry; 2003 Trek 4700 Mtb; 1983 Vitus 979

  6. #6
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    My $0.02: stay away!
    That does NOT look anything like a 753 Peugeot - to me, that is.
    I haven't seen a 753 in the chevrons livery yet, only the later blue-white variant, and it's new to me that those existed at the time (I only knew of 531SL, Aluminum and Carbon), but at the very least the TWO 753 stickers on DT AND ST would make me wary.
    And - those heavy lugs don't fit a fine racing machine at that.
    Added to that the seller could very well know about bikes (SS, blue chain), and 753 decals are easier to come by than 753 tubesets.
    I'd say fake, or at least - be VERY alert!
    Give a man a fish and feed him for a day.
    Teach a man to fish and feed him for a lifetime.
    Teach a man to cycle and he will realize fishing is stupid and boring.
    Desmond Tutu

  7. #7
    Senior Member miamijim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by VintageR View Post
    My $0.02: stay away!
    That does NOT look anything like a 753 Peugeot - to me, that is.
    I haven't seen a 753 in the chevrons livery yet, only the later blue-white variant, and it's new to me that those existed at the time (I only knew of 531SL, Aluminum and Carbon), but at the very least the TWO 753 stickers on DT AND ST would make me wary.
    And - those heavy lugs don't fit a fine racing machine at that.
    Added to that the seller could very well know about bikes (SS, blue chain), and 753 decals are easier to come by than 753 tubesets.
    I'd say fake, or at least - be VERY alert!
    Its pretty much spot on for a high end 753 Peugeot. I'm looknig at the catalog from '88 as I type and the only difference is the downtube decal. The op's bike has the typical mid 80's block lettering with checkers while my cataolg has the angled lettering with no checkers. Blue/white fade with a blue/white fade fork was the other color scheme for 1988. Again, I'd like to see better pictures but it looks right.
    WWW.CYCLESPEUGEOT.COM 2005 Pinarello Dogma; 1991 Paramount PDG 70 Mtb; 1976? AD Vent Noir; 1989 LeMond Maillot Juane F&F; 1993? Basso GAP F&F; 1989 Terry Symmetry; 2003 Trek 4700 Mtb; 1983 Vitus 979

  8. #8
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    If anyone would be able to figure it out, Jim out. I gotta say, though, that lug work makes Sparta look like Vienna.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Grand Bois's Avatar
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    What?

  10. #10
    Я люблю суп abarth's Avatar
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    Yeah, Reynolds recommended very short simple lugs for the 753. The idea was to minimize heat exposure to the tubes.

  11. #11
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    Thanks guys! I'll get some pictures uploaded over the weekend.... M

  12. #12
    Senior Member miamijim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by manny-london View Post
    Thanks guys! I'll get some pictures uploaded over the weekend.... M
    I'll need a pic of the fork decal.......
    WWW.CYCLESPEUGEOT.COM 2005 Pinarello Dogma; 1991 Paramount PDG 70 Mtb; 1976? AD Vent Noir; 1989 LeMond Maillot Juane F&F; 1993? Basso GAP F&F; 1989 Terry Symmetry; 2003 Trek 4700 Mtb; 1983 Vitus 979

  13. #13
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    Hi all,

    Finally got a chance to take some pics of the bike. Please following link will take you to the pictures: http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/manish...eat=directlink I hope they are clear and up-close enough. The forks are is excellent condition and have probably been rechromed. Also the rear drop-out also has chrome sections on it which I have tried to capture in the pics.

    Anything you can tell me to authenticate the bike would be great.

    Much appreciated.

    Manny

  14. #14
    Senior Member miamijim's Avatar
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    Manny,

    It looks like the real deal. I confused your bike with a 2nd 753 Perthus I was contacted about out of Hythe, New Forest in the U.K. What are the odds of that?

    Whats the serial number under the BB? Does it have the paper sticker on the left chainstay near the BB? Your decals pre-date the scheme in my '88 U.K. catalog by a year or so.
    WWW.CYCLESPEUGEOT.COM 2005 Pinarello Dogma; 1991 Paramount PDG 70 Mtb; 1976? AD Vent Noir; 1989 LeMond Maillot Juane F&F; 1993? Basso GAP F&F; 1989 Terry Symmetry; 2003 Trek 4700 Mtb; 1983 Vitus 979

  15. #15
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    Hi Miamijim,

    The serial code which is stamped on the BB says 87 [and then what looks like an upside down J then] 4?02865. It's not on a paper sticker as suggested.

    Also there is writting in french on the top bar which I assume says "Hand Braised" as underneath the french wording is "Hand Braised" in English. This is under the paint lacquer.

    Finally the diameter of the seat post is 26.7mm which I understand could also indicate if it is Reynolds 753 tubing.

    Cheers M

  16. #16
    Senior Member miamijim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by manny-london View Post
    Hi Miamijim,

    The serial code which is stamped on the BB says 87 [and then what looks like an upside down J then] 4?02865. It's not on a paper sticker as suggested.

    Also there is writting in french on the top bar which I assume says "Hand Braised" as underneath the french wording is "Hand Braised" in English. This is under the paint lacquer.

    Finally the diameter of the seat post is 26.7mm which I understand could also indicate if it is Reynolds 753 tubing.

    Cheers M
    M,

    The serial number is actualy B704 02865. Its more than likely and '87 model with an alphanumeric designation of PZ10. If you remove the seatpost it'll be stamped 26.6 or 26.8.

    Jim
    WWW.CYCLESPEUGEOT.COM 2005 Pinarello Dogma; 1991 Paramount PDG 70 Mtb; 1976? AD Vent Noir; 1989 LeMond Maillot Juane F&F; 1993? Basso GAP F&F; 1989 Terry Symmetry; 2003 Trek 4700 Mtb; 1983 Vitus 979

  17. #17
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    So you think it is real?

  18. #18
    Senior Member miamijim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by manny-london View Post
    So you think it is real?
    Yes. Based on the information provided and the pictures along with catalog verification I see no reason why it wouldnt be.
    WWW.CYCLESPEUGEOT.COM 2005 Pinarello Dogma; 1991 Paramount PDG 70 Mtb; 1976? AD Vent Noir; 1989 LeMond Maillot Juane F&F; 1993? Basso GAP F&F; 1989 Terry Symmetry; 2003 Trek 4700 Mtb; 1983 Vitus 979

  19. #19
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    I just thought I would share what I have done to the Peugeot. Even if it is fake I'm really enjoying riding it. http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/manish...eat=directlink

    Thanks all

    Manish

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by manny-london View Post

    Also there is writting in french on the top bar which I assume says "Hand Braised" as underneath the french wording is "Hand Braised" in English.
    This may be a give away, though it sounds juicy and delicious. It should say "hand brazed".

  21. #21
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    I was not aware of bike forgeries. I could see it maybe for something like a Cinelli (high value/simple lug work) but to fake something like a Paramount or Hetchins would cost more than it would be worth. To copy a Peugot even if it is a 753 would not be too lucrative. I have experience evaluating firearms forgeries where the value difference between a pedestrian example and a collectable is huge.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wulf View Post
    I was not aware of bike forgeries. I could see it maybe for something like a Cinelli (high value/simple lug work) but to fake something like a Paramount or Hetchins would cost more than it would be worth. To copy a Peugot even if it is a 753 would not be too lucrative. I have experience evaluating firearms forgeries where the value difference between a pedestrian example and a collectable is huge.
    The incremental payoff of the increase in a bike's value (if believed to be 735) compared to the price of a (735) decal may be rather high, no?

  23. #23
    juneeaa memba!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dirtdrop View Post
    What?
    Picchio said, "...Janet Reno look like Angelina Jolie..."

  24. #24
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    I would have figured that a buyer with the knowlege to appreciate a 753 frame would also be able to determine whether he was looking at one or not. A high end frame usually has workmanship evident over cheaper frames from the same marque. For someone to put in the additional work to convincingly fake a high end Peugot using a cheap one as the base would probably take more labor than the $100-$200 difference in price. I recently saw a faked Colt SAA that started out life as an Italian Copy but was overstamped with Cavalry markings and cartouches. The price difference between what the forger started with and an authentic martial Colt is $8000.

  25. #25
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    I do not doubt that your frame was built as a 753 frame somebody may have added the seat tube 753 decal as standard the decal was fitted to the top of the down tube. This frame would appear to be pretty much identical to a Peugeot 753 frame that I had through my hands a few years ago:




    To answer Wulf it is quite common to find incorrect transfers fitted to a frame - there are huge numbers of frames masquerading as Colnagos, many are not deliberate forgeries, often the owners/sellers just liked the decals and it is quite common for framebuilders to use their own decals on frames from other builders when a frame is refinished... A frame tubing decal costs next to nothing so is easily added to a frame to confuse a buyer I have seen it literally hundreds of times.

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