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Old 11-06-09, 05:07 PM   #1
IronFan
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New bikes, vintage quality???

What are some brands making new steel frames of vintage quality? (is that an oxymoron?)
Are these found in LBSs?

Shops Ive been into in my area are all carbon or aluminum.
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Old 11-06-09, 05:09 PM   #2
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And not touring bikes. Lightweights
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Old 11-06-09, 05:30 PM   #3
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Bilenky.

Rich Adams.

There are dozens. Or are you interesed in big name manufacturers like Specialized or Fuji?
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Old 11-06-09, 05:50 PM   #4
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Curious whats good, big name or small (though i would lean more towars the small side).
Didnt even know specialized and fuji still made steel frames. I was on the Specialized website the other day and didnt see any.
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Old 11-06-09, 05:52 PM   #5
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All retrofashion for newbe riders, and some "veteran" steel fans that just want to re-live their cycling past, methinks.....
The bicycling world has pretty much transitioned to mostly CF and Aluminum.
As it is, 99% of the bikes I see sold at Costco and Target have aluminum frames. Even Wallmart and Sportmanrt are selling Schwinn CF framed bikes.
If this is not so, we would be seeing steel frames still ridden in the TDF.
I don't think the bicycle industry just rediscovered how good steel frames really are.
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Old 11-06-09, 06:16 PM   #6
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Curious whats good, big name or small (though i would lean more towars the small side).
Didnt even know specialized and fuji still made steel frames. I was on the Specialized website the other day and didnt see any.
Yeah, the new entry level Allez is steel, with downtube shifters too. The new Raleigh record ace is steel, I think they have a few others too.

Lot's of boutique stuff out there. You can buy a new wizard frame if you have the cash.
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Old 11-06-09, 06:36 PM   #7
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hmm...
Why old road bikes are badass:
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/upgrade.html

Any new ones that stay with the old traditions?
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Old 11-06-09, 06:53 PM   #8
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The Raleigh is a beauty. Are most new ones of good quality well up over a grand$?
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Old 11-06-09, 07:09 PM   #9
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I was going to suggest some of Raleigh's lineup.

I know many of the smaller builders have worked hard to build and promote their "brands," but I think the OP is looking for a mass producer. Soma has a roadish SS/FG frame and a road bike frame with chromed lugs. They look pretty cool to me... Surly also has some appeal to traditionalists, albeit in welded steel, though they have more of a presence in what you might describe as touring, and not necessarily "fast."

You might want to also check out Bob Jackson
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Old 11-06-09, 07:16 PM   #10
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De Rosa, Colnago and Cinelli are still offering lugged steel bikes. LOTS of American handbuilt bikes available as there is a swell of appreciation for the "classics".

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Old 11-06-09, 07:28 PM   #11
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hmm...
Why old road bikes are badass:
http://www.sheldonbrown.com/upgrade.html

Any new ones that stay with the old traditions?
Gios, Mercian, Bob Jackson, Rivendell, Waterford, Richard Sachs......as said, dozens. Hundreds maybe if you include all the small custom builders....

er....it's really not news here that steel is a good frame material, son.

Is this traditional enough for ya?


This?


How 'bout this:

Last edited by GV27; 11-06-09 at 07:34 PM.
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Old 11-06-09, 07:44 PM   #12
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My area too. Aluminum and carbon dominate the market by over 90% total sales.
other than what vip listed; Carerra makes one and Pegoretti, Ciocc and Gios, not many more. Most of these cost between $1,000 & 2 but most closer to two JUST for the frame & fork. These are chromoly steel, most are lugged, some aren't, I suppose one could call them "close" to vintage type, not exactly though, the alloys are different, better really. Custom mades cost close to 3+ in most cases complete.

www.bianchiusa.com www.jamisbikes.com These two have "steel" bikes. Not actually traditional in every sense of the word but as close as you'll come for between $1,000 & 3,200 GO right to the 2009 models, the 2010 model cats. aren't complete.

Fuji, Specialized & Raleigh each have one or two chromoly bikes. Some touring, others "road" . Search under road or specialy in these sites, comfort road too.
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Old 11-06-09, 07:56 PM   #13
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Those pictured in my post can all be had for under $1000 (frame and fork only) as long as you don't go for a lot of options, high-end tubing, etc. Mercian and Bob Jackson custom at no extra charge. Reynolds 631 as base tubing option. 725, 853 and 953 available. As well as perhaps 753 and 531 if they happen to have an old tubing set squirreled away...

But no, you're not likely to find them - aside from the Gios - in your local LBS. My LBS has Gios, DeRosa and Bianchi lugged steel in stock though. Can't remember price on the Bianchi but the DeRosa is obviously $$$$. Gios is $995 sans fork:

http://www.excelsports.com/new.asp?p...ajor=1&minor=1
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Old 11-06-09, 08:01 PM   #14
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Salsa
surly
Waterford
Soma
... Salsa, Surly, and Soma are all available at your LBS
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Old 11-06-09, 08:04 PM   #15
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Old 11-06-09, 08:08 PM   #16
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Old 11-06-09, 08:12 PM   #17
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Ihave noticed that some high end makers are TIG welding their steel frames. Pegoretti offers both lugged and TIGed frames. Is welding and quality an oxymoron or can you get as good a frame using that process as with lugs or fillet brazing? In the 70s(a decade I am hoplessly stuck in) welding was considered a poor process for making quality bikes. Has the techniqe or material or perception changed since then?
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Old 11-06-09, 08:26 PM   #18
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Ihave noticed that some high end makers are TIG welding their steel frames. Pegoretti offers both lugged and TIGed frames. Is welding and quality an oxymoron or can you get as good a frame using that process as with lugs or fillet brazing? In the 70s(a decade I am hoplessly stuck in) welding was considered a poor process for making quality bikes. Has the techniqe or material or perception changed since then?
well... a couple of points (from historical perspective) :

-TIG welding steel frames really took off when MTBs were massed produced in the mid/late 80s, because (in theory) TIG welded frames were stronger than lugged frames

-Add the aluminum revolution of the 90s, combined with the robotic welding automation that can make aluminum frames in $100 bikes today and the adaption of these robots to weld steel, and you got your answer.

My 1990 cross bike is TIG-welded steel and I have put 20K+ of miles on it since new. It's a great bike and I had never had a problem with it. Does it look as good (IMO) as my lugged steel framed bikes? No. But I would not say that it is lower quality...
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Old 11-06-09, 08:31 PM   #19
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Nah, you can weld them just fine. All the newer steel tube sets are designed to be welded and get stronger with heat. Nothing wrong with welding them at all. They just don't look as good (in my not-so-humble opinion anyhow) and they're not as easily repairable (with lugs you can just take it apart, put a new tube in a braze it back up). The material has been the change - you couldn't weld 531 or 753 or any of the older lightweight steel tubesets for the most part without severely weakening them.
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Old 11-06-09, 08:32 PM   #20
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Percepetion may never change in the minds of some individuals. Materials; Reynolds 853, Columbus Navachromes,Thermachrom & Dedacciai Zero Uno & others are leaps and bounds over older chromoly types. Tig welding has been perfected, lugs are less important.
I can remember retrogrouches over thirty years ago whining that lugs were not as good as fillet brazing which is still used by Moser, Landshark and others.
Don't be hopelessly stuck, set yourself free; they're bikes. I keep 'em all & appreciate....
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Old 11-06-09, 08:36 PM   #21
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A guy at work occasionally rides in on a hunter green Waterford. I drool when I ride past the bike rack by his bldg.
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Old 11-06-09, 08:42 PM   #22
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Percepetion may never change in the minds of some individuals. Materials; Reynolds 853, Columbus Navachromes,Thermachrom & Dedacciai Zero Uno & others are leaps and bounds over older chromoly types.
I was reading an interview of a noteable framebuilder a few months ago and he was talking about that. Can't remember who or where - possibly in a Rivendell Reader back issue? Possibly someone at Waterford? He was talking about aligning a 725 frame and applying forces to it that would've folded a 531 frame right in half and barely even moving the 725 frame. He was dead chuffed about the strength but a bit bummed about how much harder it's made his job in some ways (and easier in others, no need to worry about overheating the tubes). He'd pull the headtube like a full foot off the alignment plate and it would just spring right back. Actually I think it might have been Richard Sachs come to think about it......either him or someone at Waterford.

Quote:
I can remember retrogrouches over thirty years ago whining that lugs were not as good as fillet brazing which is still used by Moser, Landshark and others.
Yeah, Mercian does some fantastic filet brazed frames as well. They don't seem to have an opinion either way about lugged vs. filet.

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