new "vintage" IRD crank
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new "vintage" IRD crank
Many of you are probably aware of the new (old school) crankset that IRD is releasing that is "inspired" by the classic Campy NR Strada. (I went looked for a pic on the internet, but can't find one tonight).
it's primarily aimed at the fixie crowd: has 144bcd spider and intended for one chainring (no "ramp" on the inside of spider for an inner ring).
The one pic I saw looked pretty nice, but there was one detail that caught my eye and seemed odd:
it's for a square taper BB, and the square hole in the center has the flats perpendicular to the arm, where nearly every vintage crank I own has the points of the square inline with the arm...rotated 45º to what IRD is doing.
Is there any legitimate engineering principal involved here, or...just style?
it's primarily aimed at the fixie crowd: has 144bcd spider and intended for one chainring (no "ramp" on the inside of spider for an inner ring).
The one pic I saw looked pretty nice, but there was one detail that caught my eye and seemed odd:
it's for a square taper BB, and the square hole in the center has the flats perpendicular to the arm, where nearly every vintage crank I own has the points of the square inline with the arm...rotated 45º to what IRD is doing.
Is there any legitimate engineering principal involved here, or...just style?
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They're not on the IRD website, and I can't find anything about them on the internet. Where did you hear about these?
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Weird. They didn't come up when I googled "IRD track crank".
Hot damn those are nice, though. Any word on a pricetag?
Hot damn those are nice, though. Any word on a pricetag?
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Nice quality I see there, but a big bummer that they didn't bother to follow through with a double. Fixie riders seem to be getting all the attention these days
I don't think it makes a difference that the spindle holes are rotated 45 degrees from what's typical. Must be a way they thought of to make their cranks a bit different enough from the Campy NR to keep people off their backs.
Chombi
I don't think it makes a difference that the spindle holes are rotated 45 degrees from what's typical. Must be a way they thought of to make their cranks a bit different enough from the Campy NR to keep people off their backs.
Chombi
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great looking crankset. if it takes off maybe Electra will make a double
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#8
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I like. With vintage campy cranks having a history of cracking/failing, it's nice to know there is an alternative to buying another campy crank on ebay for ~$300, which may yet fail.
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They look great. A double in a 170 for my son's Super and we would be good to go. I'm patient. It gets old bidding on over-priced "great condition" items on ebay. I could walk into the shop and have the boys order this much easier. Plus, if there is a problem I can bring it back! I'll watch for this, and thanks for sharing.
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WRT to carbon fiber - ugly is in the eye of the beholder, and I've seen plenty of modern bikes that are pretty snappy looking (to my eye). And uncomfortably stiff? My CF bike's best quality is that it has a nice smooth "steel like" ride. It is a joy to ride for long distances, and I've done many centuries on it.
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Good point, Kurt, sounds like yet another "marketing" driven decision...and thanks to kpug505 for finding the pic, it's weird how they seem to be hiding it at IRD.
#14
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I think the Campy NR crank and chainrings is the finest looking crank ever designed. I wonder is these cranks have dustcaps?
Having lived with the 144 bcd on numerous bikes over the last thirty years it is limited when it comes to low gears. I recently took one such bike on a ride with very steep hills and it was brutal. I would need to mate the 42-52 double with a 15-32 rear cluster.
Having lived with the 144 bcd on numerous bikes over the last thirty years it is limited when it comes to low gears. I recently took one such bike on a ride with very steep hills and it was brutal. I would need to mate the 42-52 double with a 15-32 rear cluster.
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The Campy cranks that I have had crack all had cracks propagating from the points of the square taper, in line with the axis of the crank arm. I would guess, but don't have any good evidence for this past intuition, that the stress on the arm is greater at this point. Obviously most of the force rotates about the BB spindle, but there is some force perpendicular to the rotation axis towards the center of the bicycle. It's the same force that you exert when you do the test for a loose crank arm - squeeze the arm towards the chainstay. In a perfect world there should be no motion in this direction, but we all know how well that assumption works in bicycles. When there is movement, the old style would have the point of the square taper in line with the force, essentially concentrating the pressure on the crank arm at that point. Here you have the force against a flat, hopefully spreading out the pressure and reducing the chance for a split arm.
I can't think of any good reason why the IRD orientation wouldn't be fundamentally stronger or easier to manufacture. If the industry was evolving from cottered cranks, where the orientation does make a difference, to cotterless, then I can see why the original makers put the hole in the orientation that they did. And then this was copied, no one bothered to change it, and so on....
I can't think of any good reason why the IRD orientation wouldn't be fundamentally stronger or easier to manufacture. If the industry was evolving from cottered cranks, where the orientation does make a difference, to cotterless, then I can see why the original makers put the hole in the orientation that they did. And then this was copied, no one bothered to change it, and so on....
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it is called marketing. the fixies are getting attention now because it is "cool" just like it was/is fashionable to have a uncomfortably stiff ugly carbonfiber bike for the last few years. so most companies did not bother making an afordable decent road bike
great looking crankset. if it takes off maybe Electra will make a double
great looking crankset. if it takes off maybe Electra will make a double
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The Campy cranks that I have had crack all had cracks propagating from the points of the square taper, in line with the axis of the crank arm. I would guess, but don't have any good evidence for this past intuition, that the stress on the arm is greater at this point. Obviously most of the force rotates about the BB spindle, but there is some force perpendicular to the rotation axis towards the center of the bicycle. It's the same force that you exert when you do the test for a loose crank arm - squeeze the arm towards the chainstay. In a perfect world there should be no motion in this direction, but we all know how well that assumption works in bicycles. When there is movement, the old style would have the point of the square taper in line with the force, essentially concentrating the pressure on the crank arm at that point. Here you have the force against a flat, hopefully spreading out the pressure and reducing the chance for a split arm.
I can't think of any good reason why the IRD orientation wouldn't be fundamentally stronger or easier to manufacture. If the industry was evolving from cottered cranks, where the orientation does make a difference, to cotterless, then I can see why the original makers put the hole in the orientation that they did. And then this was copied, no one bothered to change it, and so on....
I can't think of any good reason why the IRD orientation wouldn't be fundamentally stronger or easier to manufacture. If the industry was evolving from cottered cranks, where the orientation does make a difference, to cotterless, then I can see why the original makers put the hole in the orientation that they did. And then this was copied, no one bothered to change it, and so on....
Chombi
Chombi
Last edited by Chombi; 01-31-10 at 04:02 PM.
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Chombi
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Yes, it could be made to work with the right spindle legnth and adjustment of the BB (Adjustable cartridge type with lockrings and cups at both ends.) to ge a t good chainline for a double, But I would still like to get the support for the inner ring as proper for a double. In the end, I wouldn't want to put anything on my bike that was designed for a different purpose if I can help it. Anyway. I don't think IRD would endorse using their fixie/SS crank to drive an inner chainring because of liability issues
Chombi
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The original;
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Yes, it could be made to work with the right spindle legnth and adjustment of the BB (Adjustable cartridge type with lockrings and cups at both ends.) to ge a t good chainline for a double, But I would still like to get the support for the inner ring as proper for a double. In the end, I wouldn't want to put anything on my bike that was designed for a different purpose if I can help it. Anyway. I don't think IRD would endorse using their fixie/SS crank to drive an inner chainring because of liability issues
Chombi
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I applaud the "re-issue". Anyone seen the Electra high flange hubs in a box yet, at a bike shop?
Also, does anyone know the spacing of the cogs on IRD freewheels? Narrow? like an ultra 6? Or?
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Well, I went ahead and emailed IRD to see if they perhaps had any plans of producing a double-chainring version of this crankset, perhaps with a 130BCD. I will post here if I hear a reply from them.
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Yes, it could be made to work with the right spindle legnth and adjustment of the BB (Adjustable cartridge type with lockrings and cups at both ends.) to ge a t good chainline for a double, But I would still like to get the support for the inner ring as proper for a double. In the end, I wouldn't want to put anything on my bike that was designed for a different purpose if I can help it. Anyway. I don't think IRD would endorse using their fixie/SS crank to drive an inner chainring because of liability issues
Chombi
Chombi
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I have seen several campy strada cranks crack at the junction between the crankarm and the spider arm. This crank looks to have exactly the same stress riser built in...cool cranks though, and the fix would probably be just as it was with the strada: round the juncture with a rat tail file.