Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Classic & Vintage This forum is to discuss the many aspects of classic and vintage bicycles, including musclebikes, lightweights, middleweights, hi-wheelers, bone-shakers, safety bikes and much more.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 09-28-13, 08:24 AM   #4701
Gasbag
Senior Member
 
Gasbag's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Illinois
Bikes: 1968 DL-1 / 1963 Rudge Sport / 1955 Raleigh Superbe / 1951 CWS / 1948 CWS
Posts: 194
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by noglider View Post
You may eventually need some Whitworth spanners (wrenches). Metric and SAE wrenches don't fit some Whitworth nuts. Or do you have the wrenches already?

What did you have to do to fix up the Rudge?
Being a truck mechanic, I have a well stocked tool box though I don't have any whitworth. As a last resort, I use Snap On adjustable wrenches when the prospect of buggering a hex looks imminent. Nothing can foul the air of my shop with blue language faster than tools that perform poorly. There may be a whitworth purchase in the future. The Rudge required no tools that I don't already own but a properly fitting lock ring spanner and a better quality 16mm cone wrench would have made the job easier.
Gasbag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-28-13, 08:45 AM   #4702
Gasbag
Senior Member
 
Gasbag's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Illinois
Bikes: 1968 DL-1 / 1963 Rudge Sport / 1955 Raleigh Superbe / 1951 CWS / 1948 CWS
Posts: 194
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
What did you have to do to fix up the Rudge?[/QUOTE]

The Rudge had dead paint which required a careful rub out with Scratch X. I used Wolfgang paint color enhancer followed by two applications of Wolfgang paint sealant to get the color to pop. All of the old battle scars were left intact save straightening a fender stay. I used Fiebings horse saddle conditioner on the Brooks. The front hub was missing a bearing so I bought a bag of 100 grade 25 bearings from a local bearing dealer. All the small parts were hydro-sonically cleaned and then hand polished. I wiped the cable housings with a rag sprayed with carburetor cleaner and then rubbed paint sealer on them. All bearings were greased with Phil Woods finest. I filled the AS hub with Tri-Flow on my truing stand and spun & drained it until it ticked over nicely and the the fluid ran out clean. The chrome was lightly rusty so I hand polished it with chrome cleaner applied with aluminum foil.

A lot of work went into it, but I'm very satisfied with the outcome.
Gasbag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-28-13, 10:19 AM   #4703
crank_addict
Senior Member
 
crank_addict's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Bikes:
Posts: 3,670
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 99 Post(s)
What's the appropriate tire look for a late 50's clubman - gumwall or all black? (Black frame bike with 700C wide polished rims.)
crank_addict is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-28-13, 10:19 AM   #4704
David Newton
Wood
 
David Newton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Beaumont, Tx
Bikes: Raleigh Sports: hers. Vianelli Professional & Bridgestone 300: mine
Posts: 2,301
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Rudge was sold to Raleigh in 1943
David Newton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-28-13, 10:37 AM   #4705
JohnDThompson 
Old fart
 
JohnDThompson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Appleton WI
Bikes: Several, mostly not name brands.
Posts: 16,525
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 125 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gasbag View Post
a better quality 16mm cone wrench would have made the job easier.
Surely the Real Thing would be better:

JohnDThompson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-28-13, 11:00 AM   #4706
Gasbag
Senior Member
 
Gasbag's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Illinois
Bikes: 1968 DL-1 / 1963 Rudge Sport / 1955 Raleigh Superbe / 1951 CWS / 1948 CWS
Posts: 194
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnDThompson View Post
Surely the Real Thing would be better:


The right tool for the job. The search is on!
Gasbag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-28-13, 11:43 AM   #4707
Sixty Fiver
Bicycle Repair Man !!!
Thread Starter
 
Sixty Fiver's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: YEG
Bikes: See my sig...
Posts: 27,264
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnDThompson View Post
Surely the Real Thing would be better:

I bought a number of these a few years ago.
Sixty Fiver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-28-13, 04:28 PM   #4708
JohnDThompson 
Old fart
 
JohnDThompson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Appleton WI
Bikes: Several, mostly not name brands.
Posts: 16,525
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 125 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sixty Fiver View Post
I bought a number of these a few years ago.
Same here. They seem to turn up in batch lots on eBay occasionally.
JohnDThompson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-13, 05:27 AM   #4709
JBC353 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Northern Neck of Virginia
Bikes: Some Raleighs,some Schwinns and an Azor
Posts: 316
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
+1 on the Whitworth wrenches. Working on the old Raleighs got a lot easier when I finally broke down and bought a set. A mix of metric and SAE had been mostly adequate but I was a lot happier with wrenches that fit correctly.
JBC353 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-13, 06:20 AM   #4710
Gasbag
Senior Member
 
Gasbag's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Illinois
Bikes: 1968 DL-1 / 1963 Rudge Sport / 1955 Raleigh Superbe / 1951 CWS / 1948 CWS
Posts: 194
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by crank_addict View Post
What's the appropriate tire look for a late 50's clubman - gumwall or all black? (Black frame bike with 700C wide polished rims.)
I've seen both. In the videos "Cyclists Special" parts 1 & 2 the bikes are on predominately blackwall. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qyz5d3entBw http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGYng...ature=youtu.be

In catalog scans for Raleigh Lentons and Hercules Kestrels they have both choices.

My 1962 Hercules clubman has old Camel gumwalls that have a real nice orange color but are too dry cracked to ride on. It will get another set of gumwalls when it gets it turn on the repair stand.

So, I guess the answer is either, according to your tastes.
Gasbag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-13, 10:12 AM   #4711
noglider 
aka Tom Reingold
 
noglider's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: West Village, New York City
Bikes: too many
Posts: 27,445
Mentioned: 33 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 397 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Newton View Post
Rudge was sold to Raleigh in 1943
Really! I didn't know that. My Rudge still has the distinctive Rudge fork crown, which I love. Unfortunately, it doesn't have the chainring with the logo.
__________________
Tom Reingold, noglider@pobox.com
New York City and High Falls, NY
Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog

Please email me rather than PM'ing me. Thanks.
noglider is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-13, 10:36 AM   #4712
Gasbag
Senior Member
 
Gasbag's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Illinois
Bikes: 1968 DL-1 / 1963 Rudge Sport / 1955 Raleigh Superbe / 1951 CWS / 1948 CWS
Posts: 194
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
My Rudge doesn't have the hand chainring either. If I ever have the good fortune to locate one in good condition and priced fairly, it will be installed promptly. The hand is a defining feature of the Rudge-Whitworth after all.

Raleigh bought Rudge to avoid living up to their exclusive territory obligations. If a shop in a town already sold Raleigh and another shop wanted to sell them, the second shop was provided with the Rudge brand. This also goes to explain the relative scarcity of Rudge-Whitworth bicycles.

Last edited by Gasbag; 09-29-13 at 10:41 AM. Reason: addendum
Gasbag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-13, 12:33 PM   #4713
gbalke
Senior Member
 
gbalke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: West of St. Louis
Bikes: (3) 1970's Raleigh Sports, (1) 1968 Robin Hood 3 speed, 1974 Raleigh Grand Prix, 1976 Raleigh Grand Prix, 1969 Peugeot UO-18, 1971 Peugeot UO-08, 1980 Giant road bike, 1954 Humber, 1940ish Hercules Popular, 1963 Dunelt, 2007 Trek 3700 mountain bike
Posts: 865
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gasbag View Post
My Rudge doesn't have the hand chainring either. If I ever have the good fortune to locate one in good condition and priced fairly, it will be installed promptly. The hand is a defining feature of the Rudge-Whitworth after all.
There's one on e-Bay UK right now, current bid is only 1.2 Pounds; about $2.50 or so. However, shipping is 16.99 Pounds; $26 more or less. Here's a link:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-Ru...ht_4643wt_1235
gbalke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-13, 02:01 PM   #4714
David Newton
Wood
 
David Newton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Beaumont, Tx
Bikes: Raleigh Sports: hers. Vianelli Professional & Bridgestone 300: mine
Posts: 2,301
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Quote:
Rudge was sold to Raleigh in 1943
Really! I didn't know that.
Tom, I didn't know that because I'm any expert, but I read that they were an "early acquisition".
Rudge is usually mentioned along with Hercules, that Raleigh, TI really, absorbed in 1960, which was the last of the other big names.
Rudge was earlier bought by EMI the record company, of all things, and sold when they realized that bicycle making didn't fit them well.
Rudge was always a premier brand, and Raleigh kept them that way until there was only room for one at the top.
What an arcane story the simple 3-speed bike turns out to be.
David Newton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-13, 06:09 PM   #4715
Howard
Chip seal rocks
 
Howard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Bikes:
Posts: 215
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Newton View Post
Tom, I didn't know that because I'm any expert, but I read that they were an "early acquisition".
Rudge is usually mentioned along with Hercules, that Raleigh, TI really, absorbed in 1960, which was the last of the other big names.
Rudge was earlier bought by EMI the record company, of all things, and sold when they realized that bicycle making didn't fit them well.
Rudge was always a premier brand, and Raleigh kept them that way until there was only room for one at the top.
What an arcane story the simple 3-speed bike turns out to be.

I kind of understood it to have been the other way around. TI bought Raleigh, and since Raleigh's Nottingham works were more capable than the Birmingham and other factories of the BCC empire, production was moved to Nottingham.

This is kind of ironic, because (again as I understand it) the pre-merger Hercules used 24TPI for headsets and bb's, but afterward used Raleigh 26TPI parts. The 24TPI standard survives even today.

Of course, I might have all that twisted all the way around two or three times.
Howard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-13, 06:20 PM   #4716
David Newton
Wood
 
David Newton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Beaumont, Tx
Bikes: Raleigh Sports: hers. Vianelli Professional & Bridgestone 300: mine
Posts: 2,301
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
You've got it right Howard, my bad sentence structure shows. TI owned Raleigh, and was doing all the consolidation.
What is hard for us to understand is how Britain had so many threads, and a standard was so late coming. There are some amazing stories of how things had to be done when the war departments were buying out components from diverse shops.
David Newton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-13, 06:32 PM   #4717
Howard
Chip seal rocks
 
Howard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Bikes:
Posts: 215
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Newton View Post
You've got it right Howard, my bad sentence structure shows. TI owned Raleigh, and was doing all the consolidation.
What is hard for us to understand is how Britain had so many threads, and a standard was so late coming. There are some amazing stories of how things had to be done when the war departments were buying out components from diverse shops.
As we sometimes say at work, "the nice thing about standards is that there are so many of them."

I'll bet the stories are indeed amazing.

I once added up how much it cost per mile to operate various bicycles I've had. The (Raleigh Sports - like) Hercules came in at around 4 or 5 cents per mile (tires, tubes, etc. plus fully accounting for the purchase price). Shoes typically cost more than that. Seriously, at that time, it cost me more to walk three miles than to ride the Sports. Bet it still does.
Howard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-13, 08:25 PM   #4718
noglider 
aka Tom Reingold
 
noglider's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: West Village, New York City
Bikes: too many
Posts: 27,445
Mentioned: 33 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 397 Post(s)
I have no doubt a three speed is more economical than most other bikes, but I've never heard the cost of cycling compared with that of walking. Could that possibly be true?
__________________
Tom Reingold, noglider@pobox.com
New York City and High Falls, NY
Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog

Please email me rather than PM'ing me. Thanks.
noglider is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-13, 08:48 PM   #4719
David Newton
Wood
 
David Newton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Beaumont, Tx
Bikes: Raleigh Sports: hers. Vianelli Professional & Bridgestone 300: mine
Posts: 2,301
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Quote:
Seriously, at that time, it cost me more to walk three miles than to ride the Sports. Bet it still does.
It isn't hard to believe. As engineers say "if it looks right, it is right". I have always heard that the bicycle is one of the most efficient machines ever invented. I ride a single speed freewheel bike with rim brakes. It goes so easily, I am fooling myself to claim that I ride for exercise.
David Newton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-13, 08:03 AM   #4720
JohnDThompson 
Old fart
 
JohnDThompson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Appleton WI
Bikes: Several, mostly not name brands.
Posts: 16,525
Mentioned: 4 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 125 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by noglider View Post
I have no doubt a three speed is more economical than most other bikes, but I've never heard the cost of cycling compared with that of walking. Could that possibly be true?
If time is money, sure.
JohnDThompson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-13, 09:38 PM   #4721
gna
Count Orlok Member
 
gna's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: St. Paul, MN
Bikes: Raleigh Sports, Raleigh Twenty, Raleigh Wyoming, Schwinn Le Tour Luxe Frankenbike
Posts: 1,540
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Everyone--bad news. Many of you have bought cotters, cotter presses, or 3-speed parts from Mark Stonich, aka Bikesmith of Bikesmith Designs. Mark was recently in a serious collision--he was hit from behind by an elderly driver--and has multiple fractures and a concussion. He is currently in the hospital recuperating, but seems more concerned by damage to his 1972 Holdsworth Mistral.

Send emails to Mark, who has his iPad at the hospital:

mark@bikesmithdesign.com
gna is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-13, 09:54 PM   #4722
Sixty Fiver
Bicycle Repair Man !!!
Thread Starter
 
Sixty Fiver's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: YEG
Bikes: See my sig...
Posts: 27,264
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnDThompson View Post
Surely the Real Thing would be better:

The things you need when you ride a bike with an SA hub...

Sixty Fiver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-30-13, 09:55 PM   #4723
Sixty Fiver
Bicycle Repair Man !!!
Thread Starter
 
Sixty Fiver's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: YEG
Bikes: See my sig...
Posts: 27,264
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by gna View Post
Everyone--bad news. Many of you have bought cotters, cotter presses, or 3-speed parts from Mark Stonich, aka Bikesmith of Bikesmith Designs. Mark was recently in a serious collision--he was hit from behind by an elderly driver--and has multiple fractures and a concussion. He is currently in the hospital recuperating, but seems more concerned by damage to his 1972 Holdsworth Mistral.

Send emails to Mark, who has his iPad at the hospital:

mark@bikesmithdesign.com
Sounds like he is a real cyclist, worrying about his bike more than himself.
Sixty Fiver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-13, 05:11 AM   #4724
wahoonc
Senior Member
 
wahoonc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: On the road-USA
Bikes: Giant Excursion, Raleigh Sports, Raleigh R.S.W. Compact, Motobecane? and about 20 more! OMG
Posts: 16,687
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sixty Fiver View Post
Sounds like he is a real cyclist, worrying about his bike more than himself.
Mark is a huge asset to the vintage bike community in MSP as well as many other places. I have purchased a lot of odd Sturmey-Archer parts from him. He also has been involved in HPV events in MN. He built a recumbent using a Raleigh Sports frame a while back. He is quite the innovator.

Aaron
__________________
Webshots is bailing out, if you find any of my posts with corrupt picture files and want to see them corrected please let me know. :(

ISO: A late 1980's Giant Iguana MTB frameset (or complete bike) 23" Red with yellow graphics.

"Cycling should be a way of life, not a hobby.
RIDE, YOU FOOL, RIDE!"
_Nicodemus

"Steel: nearly a thousand years of metallurgical development
Aluminum: barely a hundred
Which one would you rather have under your butt at 30mph?"
_krazygluon

Last edited by wahoonc; 10-01-13 at 08:22 AM.
wahoonc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-01-13, 06:49 AM   #4725
Gasbag
Senior Member
 
Gasbag's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Illinois
Bikes: 1968 DL-1 / 1963 Rudge Sport / 1955 Raleigh Superbe / 1951 CWS / 1948 CWS
Posts: 194
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by gbalke View Post
There's one on e-Bay UK right now, current bid is only 1.2 Pounds; about $2.50 or so. However, shipping is 16.99 Pounds; $26 more or less. Here's a link:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-Ru...ht_4643wt_1235
Thanks for the lead. The chrome on the crank arms is too degraded on this one. I saw another one but it was badly scratched up. I'll have to keep waiting & watching.
Gasbag is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:45 AM.