For the love of English 3 speeds...
Senior Member
Is there a way to straighten the threaded (bent) end out a little so I can still use my Park Tool cotter press? I know the threads are toast. I've never been this stuck before.
EDIT: I had this happen on my Phillips. I think I'll use a Dremel to cut the bent part of the cotter off. Then it will be straight and I can use a punch, drill or whatever. Oh joy.
EDIT: I had this happen on my Phillips. I think I'll use a Dremel to cut the bent part of the cotter off. Then it will be straight and I can use a punch, drill or whatever. Oh joy.
Last edited by Velocivixen; 05-05-16 at 02:18 PM.
Senior Member
@Velocivixen, Dremel is a good way of getting rid of the bent over threads. Try a punch first, might work. At least it gives you a divot to put the drill in later.
Lucky me have both pins still fine and usable.
Lucky me have both pins still fine and usable.
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 3,240
Mentioned: 103 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1299 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 103 Times
in
85 Posts
Is there a way to straighten the threaded (bent) end out a little so I can still use my Park Tool cotter press? I know the threads are toast. I've never been this stuck before.
EDIT: I had this happen on my Phillips. I think I'll use a Dremel to cut the bent part of the cotter off. Then it will be straight and I can use a punch, drill or whatever. Oh joy.
EDIT: I had this happen on my Phillips. I think I'll use a Dremel to cut the bent part of the cotter off. Then it will be straight and I can use a punch, drill or whatever. Oh joy.
__________________
Inflate Hard
Inflate Hard
Abuse Magnet
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Colorado
Posts: 1,869
Bikes: '91 Mtn Tek Vertical, '74 Raleigh Sports, '72 Raleigh Twenty, '84 Univega Gran Turismo, '09 Surly Karate Monkey, '92 Burley Rock-n-Roll, '86 Miyata 310, '76 Raleigh Shopper
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 151 Post(s)
Liked 174 Times
in
88 Posts
As many of these as you work on, maybe getting a magnet keeper would be a good investment.
Thanks. I may disassemble & try that.
Right now I've bent both cotters and despite having the non drive side off and lock right and adjustable cup removed I'm afraid to go further with the bent cotter on the drive side. I let penetrating oil work overnight, whacked it with a rubber mallet to help crack up the gunk holding things stuck. I'll have to research how to get that cotter out without having to drill. I have replacement cotters from Mark Stonich, but won't be threaded for the raleigh nuts.
Right now I've bent both cotters and despite having the non drive side off and lock right and adjustable cup removed I'm afraid to go further with the bent cotter on the drive side. I let penetrating oil work overnight, whacked it with a rubber mallet to help crack up the gunk holding things stuck. I'll have to research how to get that cotter out without having to drill. I have replacement cotters from Mark Stonich, but won't be threaded for the raleigh nuts.
Senior Member
Question,
I have a functioning 73 SA hub as a back up that I can build up for the Rudge. If I was to find an earlier hub in my LBS's tub o' hubs, can I slide the guts into the earlier shell as long as it is an AW model ? I believe it is doable but only so far.
Thanks for a reply, 3 speedslow
I have a functioning 73 SA hub as a back up that I can build up for the Rudge. If I was to find an earlier hub in my LBS's tub o' hubs, can I slide the guts into the earlier shell as long as it is an AW model ? I believe it is doable but only so far.
Thanks for a reply, 3 speedslow
Last edited by 3speedslow; 05-05-16 at 02:55 PM. Reason: sp
Senior Member
Question,
I have a functioning 73 SA hub as a back up that I can build up for the Rudge. If I was to find an earlier hub in my LBS's tub o' hubs, can I slide the guts into the earlier shell as long as it is an AW model ? I believe it is doable but only so far.
Thanks for a reply, 3 speedslow
I have a functioning 73 SA hub as a back up that I can build up for the Rudge. If I was to find an earlier hub in my LBS's tub o' hubs, can I slide the guts into the earlier shell as long as it is an AW model ? I believe it is doable but only so far.
Thanks for a reply, 3 speedslow
Drilling - do I start with a smaller diameter bit, then work up to larger ones? I've got the bent/threaded part cut off. Have started drilliing after I made a divot with a punch. More penetrating oil. I can'te believe this thing.
Senior Member
@ velocivixen, lots of oil as you go!
To answer your question, I used small, medium bits then moved up to the largest you can get in there but not exceeding the diameter of the pin body. I was lucky as at the time I had a machine shop to do my work and had a drill press.
crossing fingers for you. I would also stop at various times and try the punch again. You never know.
To answer your question, I used small, medium bits then moved up to the largest you can get in there but not exceeding the diameter of the pin body. I was lucky as at the time I had a machine shop to do my work and had a drill press.
crossing fingers for you. I would also stop at various times and try the punch again. You never know.
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Ontario
Posts: 2,648
Mentioned: 16 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 478 Post(s)
Liked 634 Times
in
336 Posts
Question,
I have a functioning 73 SA hub as a back up that I can build up for the Rudge. If I was to find an earlier hub in my LBS's tub o' hubs, can I slide the guts into the earlier shell as long as it is an AW model ? I believe it is doable but only so far.
Thanks for a reply, 3 speedslow
I have a functioning 73 SA hub as a back up that I can build up for the Rudge. If I was to find an earlier hub in my LBS's tub o' hubs, can I slide the guts into the earlier shell as long as it is an AW model ? I believe it is doable but only so far.
Thanks for a reply, 3 speedslow
Senior Member
Sorry, it was in a can labeled cutting oil, maybe machinist oil. It's been awhile and I've had my head operated on since then....
Good luck again.
Good luck again.
Senior Member
Thanks, I figured it was possible but wanted to check before I dig through the tub for a older dated hub.
Senior Member
Hello again....um...Is this what it's supposed to look like? Seriously there is oil dripping out the other side but the cotter isn't budging.
drilling cotter by velocivixen, on Flickr
drilling cotter by velocivixen, on Flickr
Phyllo-buster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Nova Scotia
Posts: 8,844
Bikes: roadsters, club bikes, fixed and classic
Mentioned: 133 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2297 Post(s)
Liked 2,047 Times
in
1,253 Posts
Been there...go to a smaller bit and keep drilling
Senior Member
I assumed I'm supposed to drill from the threaded side then decided to start drilling from the other side. What a mess. I keep whacking on it every once in awhile. On the bright side the nds adjustable cup is good. The front wheel spoke nipples are rounded off so that might be interesting. I really need to get to the bottom bracket because if it's shot then I'll need to step away for awhile.
Senior Member
Yes, it's a mess to drill but the destruction is your salvation. Like said, go to a smaller then larger drill. Keep the oil flowing and punch it every once an awhile.
It will come out.
It will come out.
Phyllo-buster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Nova Scotia
Posts: 8,844
Bikes: roadsters, club bikes, fixed and classic
Mentioned: 133 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2297 Post(s)
Liked 2,047 Times
in
1,253 Posts
I'd stay with the threaded side, at least it's forcing the cotter in the direction it would ideally like to come out. Once you get through with a small bit the cotter collapses. Of course you can go through a few bits getting there. It is definitely a job requiring determination, desperation and perspiration in equal measures. Enjoy!
Count Orlok Member
I'd stay with the threaded side, at least it's forcing the cotter in the direction it would ideally like to come out. Once you get through with a small bit the cotter collapses. Of course you can go through a few bits getting there. It is definitely a job requiring determination, desperation and perspiration in equal measures. Enjoy!
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 3,240
Mentioned: 103 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1299 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 103 Times
in
85 Posts
In all my years of 3 speeds, I've never dealt with a cotter that wouldn't drift out with a punch. I've bent a few and had to saw off the threads, but still always got it out with a punch and hammer so I don't know about drilling. It seems to me that there is no force that would cause it to collapse in the center. And you can only drill it open so far because it's a D shaped pin. There's still plenty of steel stuck onto the sides of the hole. I think the idea of moving the crank arms in opposite directions makes sense. Especially if one could be held securely while the other was tapped with a mallet.
__________________
Inflate Hard
Inflate Hard
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Toronto
Posts: 2,571
Bikes: 1971 Hercules, 1978 Raleigh Superbe, 1978 Raleigh Tourist, 1964 Glider 3 Speed, 1967 Raleigh Sprite 5 Speed, 1968 Hercules AMF 3 Speed, 1972 Raleigh Superbe, 1976 Raleigh Superbe, 1957 Flying Pigeon, 1967 Dunelt 3 Speed
Mentioned: 57 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1028 Post(s)
Liked 439 Times
in
287 Posts
Here's a Raleigh built Supercycle for sale on Kijiji Toronto. A 3 speed hub with a coaster brake and caliper brakes as well. Priced at $225.00. .
Phyllo-buster
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Nova Scotia
Posts: 8,844
Bikes: roadsters, club bikes, fixed and classic
Mentioned: 133 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2297 Post(s)
Liked 2,047 Times
in
1,253 Posts
In all my years of 3 speeds, I've never dealt with a cotter that wouldn't drift out with a punch. I've bent a few and had to saw off the threads, but still always got it out with a punch and hammer so I don't know about drilling. It seems to me that there is no force that would cause it to collapse in the center. And you can only drill it open so far because it's a D shaped pin. There's still plenty of steel stuck onto the sides of the hole. I think the idea of moving the crank arms in opposite directions makes sense. Especially if one could be held securely while the other was tapped with a mallet.
Abuse Magnet
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Colorado
Posts: 1,869
Bikes: '91 Mtn Tek Vertical, '74 Raleigh Sports, '72 Raleigh Twenty, '84 Univega Gran Turismo, '09 Surly Karate Monkey, '92 Burley Rock-n-Roll, '86 Miyata 310, '76 Raleigh Shopper
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 151 Post(s)
Liked 174 Times
in
88 Posts
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Southern Ontario
Posts: 1,883
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 263 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 9 Times
in
8 Posts
Thanks. I may disassemble & try that.
Right now I've bent both cotters and despite having the non drive side off and lock right and adjustable cup removed I'm afraid to go further with the bent cotter on the drive side. I let penetrating oil work overnight, whacked it with a rubber mallet to help crack up the gunk holding things stuck. I'll have to research how to get that cotter out without having to drill. I have replacement cotters from Mark Stonich, but won't be threaded for the raleigh nuts.
Right now I've bent both cotters and despite having the non drive side off and lock right and adjustable cup removed I'm afraid to go further with the bent cotter on the drive side. I let penetrating oil work overnight, whacked it with a rubber mallet to help crack up the gunk holding things stuck. I'll have to research how to get that cotter out without having to drill. I have replacement cotters from Mark Stonich, but won't be threaded for the raleigh nuts.
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Columbia, SC
Posts: 2,977
Bikes: 2014 Cannondale Synapse Carbon 4 Rival; 2014 Cannondale Trail 7 29; 1972 Schwinn Suburban, 1996 Proflex 756, 1987(?) Peugeot, Dahon Speed P8; 1979 Raleigh Competition GS; 1995 Stumpjumper M2 FS, 1978 Raleigh Sports, Schwinn Prologue
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 213 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times
in
4 Posts
I assumed I'm supposed to drill from the threaded side then decided to start drilling from the other side. What a mess. I keep whacking on it every once in awhile. On the bright side the nds adjustable cup is good. The front wheel spoke nipples are rounded off so that might be interesting. I really need to get to the bottom bracket because if it's shot then I'll need to step away for awhile.
Senior Member
@clubman - I have an official Park Tool Cotter press and, despite being careful to line things up, both cotters bent. The first one came out though. I tried to be very careful about alignment but these threaded ends seemed soft to me.
@arex - the non drive side adjustable cup came out beautifully to reveal bone dry cups with dull brown bearings and tiny bit of rust from the bottom bracket shell. It sounded dry and it was.
As as an aside, my hands and forearms are very sore this morning.
@arex - the non drive side adjustable cup came out beautifully to reveal bone dry cups with dull brown bearings and tiny bit of rust from the bottom bracket shell. It sounded dry and it was.
As as an aside, my hands and forearms are very sore this morning.
Abuse Magnet
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Colorado
Posts: 1,869
Bikes: '91 Mtn Tek Vertical, '74 Raleigh Sports, '72 Raleigh Twenty, '84 Univega Gran Turismo, '09 Surly Karate Monkey, '92 Burley Rock-n-Roll, '86 Miyata 310, '76 Raleigh Shopper
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 151 Post(s)
Liked 174 Times
in
88 Posts
I have spare cups if you need them.