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-   -   For the love of English 3 speeds... (http://www.bikeforums.net/classic-vintage/623699-love-english-3-speeds.html)

ahson 04-01-11 08:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gna (Post 12446042)
Wow, looks nice. I will check the recycler for a Raleigh crank for you--no promises, as people have been buying lots of 3-speed parts lately....

Thanks, I really appreciate it. It's a 46t btw. :)

Schwinnsta 04-02-11 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ahson (Post 12446028)


Pretty much that or a Pletchor. I will likely try to snipe it. There looks to be another one perhaps in a little a better condition but not as many pics to tell.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...=STRK:MEWAX:IT

noglider 04-03-11 05:47 AM

I don't remember how those Raleigh racks behave, but I have tons of experience with Pletscher racks. They're durable and reliable, but they wobble a lot. I like the spring clip, but I won't use Pletscher racks any more because of the wobble. They end up adding effort to riding under load. I like the racks with the multiple struts, which are much stiffer.

I'm sure you can stiffen a rack with some wires and turnbuckles, but then it wouldn't be original. I don't know if that matters.

Hey, folks, my calves are sore, and I think it's from riding 22 miles very hard on my three speed on Tuesday. I wore dress shoes and used the original rubber block pedals. I normally use toe clips or cleats, so I had to use a different technique. Does this make sense?

Schwinnsta 04-03-11 06:36 AM

[QUOTE=noglider;12450353]I don't remember how those Raleigh racks behave, but I have tons of experience with Pletscher racks. They're durable and reliable, but they wobble a lot. I like the spring clip, but I won't use Pletscher racks any more because of the wobble. They end up adding effort to riding under load. I like the racks with the multiple struts, which are much stiffer.

I'm sure you can stiffen a rack with some wires and turnbuckles, but then it wouldn't be original. I don't know if that matters.QUOTE]

Thanks for the info. The Superbe rack looks to be small if one has the seat bag. Anyone want to chime in on rack recommendations for a Raleigh Sports? For now I may just go with a front basket?

Amesja 04-03-11 07:26 AM

I would think that an old aluminum pletcher rack that was wore and wobbly could be seriously firmed up by hard-soldering the pivots so they didn't move or have any slop in them. That would look much better than throwing wires on there to stabilize them under a load. Don't a lot of people just paint them black on most of the old bikes?

I Imagine the stamped steel ones would be similarly fixed if you didn't care about scorching the paint or originality as they could be re-spayed.

Just thinking aloud...

noglider 04-04-11 06:29 AM

I don't think by soldering or welding the joints. I think a rack just needs more than two legs.

Long ago, I saw someone solve the problem with that wire-and-turnbuckle solution, but I don't remember how it looked. You're probably right that it was ugly. Maybe it's best to go with something modern, as period-incorrect as it is. I mean, heck, I put modern brake shoes on old bikes, because that's one place I don't enjoy compromising.

Threespeeder 04-04-11 09:47 AM

Front rack
 
5 Attachment(s)
I have a suggestion that might work nicely for you. Although I like baskets up front I think a rack is better since the center of gravity tends to be lower plus a rack is more versatile. I have included a pic of my 73 Sports with the randonneur rack installed. It is a bit pricey at $160 or so, but the top part is removable so currently I need to take a pic of the rack base with the little wooden box cunningly attached with bungee cord!
At the moment the rack sits on the front fender so there is a bit of squeaking sometimes but that would be solved by a nice pair of Velo Orange fendersthat have a flatter configuration, the hammered aluminum ones. These fenders are not original any more than the rack but I think they would make the old boy look pretty nifty!
I also need to replace the brakes and front fork. Maybe the wheels too the newer alloy ones from Harris Cycle perhaps. By the way does anyone know the size of fender I should get from Velo Orange. They have a rather complex way of figuring it out on their site and there is not a specific size for the 26" Raleigh wheel. Maybe it's the same as the 700mm? http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=196388http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=196389http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=196390[QUOTE=Schwinnsta;12450450]
Quote:

Originally Posted by noglider (Post 12450353)
I don't remember how those Raleigh racks behave, but I have tons of experience with Pletscher racks. They're durable and reliable, but they wobble a lot. I like the spring clip, but I won't use Pletscher racks any more because of the wobble. They end up adding effort to riding under load. I like the racks with the multiple struts, which are much stiffer.

I'm sure you can stiffen a rack with some wires and turnbuckles, but then it wouldn't be original. I don't know if that matters.QUOTE]

Thanks for the info. The Superbe rack looks to be small if one has the seat bag. Anyone want to chime in on rack recommendations for a Raleigh Sports? For now I may just go with a front basket?


noglider 04-04-11 12:27 PM

Why do you want to replace the brakes and fork? My Rudge's brakes are excellent, with Kool Stop shoes.

That rack is fantastic, but I still can't see spending that kind of money on a rack. Is there a cheaper way to get something similar?

JohnDThompson 04-04-11 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amesja (Post 12450561)
I would think that an old aluminum pletcher rack that was wore and wobbly could be seriously firmed up by hard-soldering the pivots so they didn't move or have any slop in them. That would look much better than throwing wires on there to stabilize them under a load. Don't a lot of people just paint them black on most of the old bikes?

I Imagine the stamped steel ones would be similarly fixed if you didn't care about scorching the paint or originality as they could be re-spayed.

Just thinking aloud...

I just had an old PresSteel rack powercoated and it turned out well:

http://www.os2.dhs.org/~john/pc-rack.jpg

Amesja 04-04-11 01:08 PM

That looks really nice!

David Newton 04-04-11 01:15 PM

Pletscher racks are aluminum, soldering won't stick.

The rivets can be peened over if they are very loose, but the rack wasn't meant for much load, so as long at the legs are there, they will carry the load they were designed for.

Cetma racks are around $100 for one "like" the Velo-orange porter rack, but it isn't as nice by a long shot.

Amesja 04-04-11 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Newton (Post 12456775)
Pletscher racks are aluminum, soldering won't stick.

The rivets can be peened over if they are very loose, but the rack wasn't meant for much load, so as long at the legs are there, they will carry the load they were designed for.
.

I'm sure if you wrapped the pivot joints tightly and neatly with #12 solid copper wire and used silver solder and a good acidic flux it would firm right up. It's still a 3-point connection to the frame of course so it is going to flex a bit -but it brazing and soldering isn't really rocket science. If that doesn't work then get medieval on that bad boy and bring home a tig welder from work and start stacking dimes on it until it is a bit more solid ;)

Paint to match...

clubman 04-04-11 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HSean (Post 12426310)

That's some nice bike! What year? Raleigh wingnuts and bakelite to boot. But if you don't flip those bars back I'm going to have to buy them off you...cheap!

Fenway 04-05-11 09:27 AM

So I managed to get a (1958? can't read the hub because it's so filthy, but there is an oil port cap) Raleigh Colt in nearly pristine, albeit filthy beyond belief, condition (well the hand grips have mostly disintegrated) with everything original down to the Wood's tubes & Dunlop tires. Aside from an industrial strength cleaning, degreasing (good Lord everything is covered in it...EVERYTHING! Which has made all the dirt, dust, and probably (shudder) rat droppings stick to it), polishing (simichrome fine for this era's plating?), replacing tires/tubes/brake pads, what do you all recommend I service or replace?

I was thinking the brake cables/housing need to be replaced, metallic braid to keep it classy, but after reading about the need for using clamp on replacement cable ends and the special issues about Raleigh cable, I'm not so sure about that now.

Also does anyone have a recommendation for a good cleaners for this type of project. I think my usual standby of Mother's automotive cleaner & polish might not be up to the task alone.

This project is important to me because it's giving the same type of bike back to an elderly family member that they once had. So getting it restored right, safe, and sound is a high priority.

Amesja 04-05-11 11:17 AM

Keep the housings and even the original cables if you can get them moving. Are the cables double-ended on the colt of that era? If so you will have to cut the cables to save the housings and then use cable knarps to make the calipers work with modern single-sided cables. Usually the housings can be saved and they look period correct. Modern housings just don't look right to me on the old Raleighs.

Grease comes right off with degreaser or even simple dish soap. Hopefully it is just old caked-on grease and grunge and not much rust. If the paint is sound it'll clean right up -maybe polish with Scratch-X

I'd pull apart the headset, BB, and the front axle at least and put new bearings in and repack with grease. Most of the bikes of that age that I've torn apart have really pitted races and need to be replaced as well. Hopefully the top most head races are OK as the threading is different and getting a replacement for that is really hard. The bottom can be replaced easily with parts from a modern headset. That's the one that goes bad most of the time anyhow. Many people say the rear hub only needs oil and is good to go most of the time. I'd pull that apart too and regrease the bearings and clean out out the innards of oily goopy mess which will make it run smoother and quieter and shift better.

noglider 04-05-11 11:55 AM

Some bikes have been ridden fewer miles than others, even very old bikes. Sometimes you get lucky and the bearing races are in good shape. My 1961 Rudge had been maintained, so it's in great shape. The cables and housings are original.

Start getting the cables moving by spraying WD40 into both ends of the housings. Move the cable back and forth, and repeat the WD40. Then add oil, move the cable, add oil, move the cable, repeatedly. If the housings are not bent, the cables will work, and you can't get cables of this quality any more.

Oil the rear hub and adjust it. It probably doesn't need overhauling. If it does, the oil inside has probably turned to shellac, and you'll have to do a lot of scraping. The last time I did this, I used a scratch awl, along with some solvent. The scratching did more work than the solvent did. It took a while. These hubs have a fair number of small parts, but if you keep a clean bench and keep track of everything, it comes apart and goes back together easily. I think there are exploded views or photos available, along with procedures on the web. There are also youtube videos of this procedure. The one I've seen is done in England, not surprisingly, and it's extremely clear and complete. You will need a punch, hammer, bench vise, and a cone wrench of the right size. The right size cone wrenches may be hard to find, so you may have to make one out of a sacrificial cone wrench.

To be honest, I usually don't take apart the headset or bottom bracket. If they feel good, I figure they are. I often drop oil in the crevices to make sure there's something in there.

Sixty Fiver 04-05-11 02:28 PM

Let me slip this one in for some variety... my friend's Batavus that was a 3 speed until yesterday that is now rocking a new SA 5 speed IGH out back to give it a little more range and climbing power and if that fails it has an electric motor in the front wheel.

My friend lives in the valley so has to be able to bring this bike up about 900 feet on very steep roads with a child trailer behind.

http://www.ravingbikefiend.com/bikep...solddutch1.JPG

That new SA five speed is a really nice hub... shifting is wonderful and range is very good with a 24 tooth cog.

w1gfh 04-05-11 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnDThompson (Post 12456698)
I just had an old PresSteel rack powercoated and it turned out well

Really like the PresSteels but can't abide the heavy auction prices for one. I suspect I'm not alone. If someone like Velo Orange should happen to make a replica I think they'd be very popular.

jrecoi 04-05-11 03:17 PM

Sixty Fiver: Are those 26" mountain bike wheels on the Batavus? What happened to the chaincase?

w1gfh 04-05-11 08:00 PM

That Batavus looks bulletproof. Meanwhile, it's funny to think these guys probably made my bike.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3111/...45fea231fd.jpg
Raleigh Factory, Radford, Nottingham, 1966

Velognome 04-05-11 08:04 PM

sixtyfiver, the Batavus is great. Does your friend use the Hub motor to augment peddaling all the time?

noglider 04-05-11 08:09 PM

That Batavus rocks, especially as you equipped it. And 900 feet, wow. The hill I live on is like 200 or 300 feet.

Sixty Fiver 04-05-11 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jrecoi (Post 12463542)
Sixty Fiver: Are those 26" mountain bike wheels on the Batavus? What happened to the chaincase?

The front wheel is a 635 / 28 inch and the rear is a 700:35.

With the 5 speed SA you can cruise along pretty nicely in 4th while 5th is steep enough and the bike is heavy enough (about 80 pounds) that you'd want a tailwind or a hill... the motor is 36v and 1 hp and with it engaged you can spin out in 5th and drop people in spandex. :)

Edmonton is built along an old river and valley floor is 800-900 feet below the city proper and all the routes coming up are very short and steep with some grades hitting 22% and coming up from my friends place you have to ride a km on a grade that exceeds 12 % and probably is closer to 15% in places.

It would he hard to ride the Batavus up this hill on it's own with no power assist and with a trailer and a two year old it would be a challenge for anyone on any bike... this is what the power assist is for and the AWD it offers is great for plowing through deep snow.

Am thinking that I'd like a power assist like this for my extrabike... :)

Sixty Fiver 04-05-11 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Velognome (Post 12464842)
sixtyfiver, the Batavus is great. Does your friend use the Hub motor to augment peddaling all the time?

The run time on the assist is probably no more than an hour if full power was used and is just used for certain terrain... my friend and his wife (who also uses the bike alot) are very strong cyclists and cycle year round.

The Batavus is a winter bike... they have to two hand built rando bikes for summer and two custom tandems for touring and racing and we are in the process of turning their S&S coupled expedition tandem into a triplet so the little guy will be able to ride with his mom and dad.

My friend rides an 8 speed equipped hybrid in the winter when the Batavus isn't needed and since that 8 speed has been problematic will be building the Batavus' old Sachs 3 speed into a 700c wheel for that as it is a very decent hub gear with a coaster brake.

Sixty Fiver 04-05-11 10:22 PM

I was going to stop by and share a picture I took today which was the first ride of the season for my girls... I was never allowed to ride my bike this early in the year when I was their age.

English 3 speeds rule.

http://www.ravingbikefiend.com/bikep...girlsride1.JPG

And they can haul twice their weight in groceries...

http://www.ravingbikefiend.com/bikepics/2011basil1.JPG


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