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Old 07-27-10, 11:07 AM   #1
BG2
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Help identify this 'as is' ate 70's Merckx

I have here a Merckx, but there is a story to tell first.

The bike is probebly late 70's (see BB lug) and the fact that the cableguide is on top of the BB wich is for me a indication it's lat 70's.
But somewhere in the 90's the bike has been resprayed in mid 90's team colors and the have been modifications made like 2 extra eyelets for the waterbottle and a lug for the frontderr. which was not a 70's period thing (the clamp front derr was).

The hardware like grips are not correct as is the crank (veloce) and front derr.

Can anybody tell what's right and wrong on this bike and how the original paint job should be.

Also the wheels are all tubes and need to be replaced by normal rims, but what type. is the Mavic Module E2 good for the year of this bike.

Now anybody that an throw in some light is more than appreciated.



















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Old 07-27-10, 11:12 AM   #2
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Those more knowledgeable will chime in shortly I'm sure..but I can help you help them by asking you to post some pictures of the entire bike and not just close ups.
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Old 07-27-10, 11:16 AM   #3
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Yes, you're right i was convinced the closeups would do, but how wrong i was.

I'll post pix of the entire bike asap.
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Old 07-27-10, 11:21 AM   #4
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Would you say the sloping-crown fork is a later replacement as well?

-Kurt
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Old 07-27-10, 11:32 AM   #5
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Early 80's Professional.
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Old 07-27-10, 11:53 AM   #6
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I am no expert but the dropouts look short for a '70 frame, and was the right one repaired? depending on the lever of the bike tubulars may have been the stock wheels perhaps a Fiamme? somethign tells me the original pait was either white, perhaps with the luggs lined in red, or orange.

is the current paint something like a Telecomm?
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Old 07-27-10, 12:10 PM   #7
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right dropout definitely looks repaired in the photos.
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Old 07-27-10, 12:12 PM   #8
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Definitely Telekom colors. Don't recall if the BB was faded to black like OP's. Factory repaint? Or maybe not a repaint at all? The Merckx 'bubble' font decals are pretty unique, but we can't see if they are present. When was the heyday of Team Telekom?

Last edited by jan nikolajsen; 07-27-10 at 12:50 PM.
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Old 07-27-10, 12:25 PM   #9
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Tearsforgears on this Telekom matter:

http://www.tearsforgears.com/2007/09...eam-bikes.html


and


http://www.tearsforgears.com/2009/07...log-pages.html


I own a fully built Kelme Century and a Telekom frameset which is a Corsa Extra. I've been told my Corsa Extra is a 1992.

.....but what do I know.
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Old 07-27-10, 12:30 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bianchigirll View Post
I am no expert but the dropouts look short for a '70 frame, and was the right one repaired?
They are 1010b dropouts that were around in the '70s. Right is repaired.

I don't remember my Merckx history, but I think the rear derailleur was probably replaced, and this is an '80s frame. Braze on FD was extremely rare in the '70s.
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Old 07-27-10, 12:32 PM   #11
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Strangely, what actually looks to be added are in fact the top-of-BB shell cable guides. Note the hole in the center of the BB shell on the underside: that was to screw in the plastic cable guide. I had a frame exactly like this (mid-80s) in yellow and not the Telecom colors. It had a plastic cable guide - greyish in color - screwed into the BB shell through a hole just as on yours.

If it's a repaint, somebody had it ALL - note the little 'Made In Belgium' decal above the gear levers. Again, same as mine. This is original, and early/mid 80s. The fork is definately from that era.

And I also concur: driveside rear dropout has shiny brass jumping out at you! That looks like a repair I'd get an expert opinion on before taking her out for a thrashing.
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Old 07-27-10, 12:52 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Drillium Dude View Post
Strangely, what actually looks to be added are in fact the top-of-BB shell cable guides. Note the hole in the center of the BB shell on the underside: that was to screw in the plastic cable guide. I had a frame exactly like this (mid-80s) in yellow and not the Telecom colors. It had a plastic cable guide - greyish in color - screwed into the BB shell through a hole just as on yours.
Absolute rubbish.

The hole is a drainage hole. The over the top BB routing is original. Do you think they took off a bottom of the stay cable guide to braze on a top of the stay guide?

The bike is an early 80's Professional model, like I said in post #5. The serial number bears that out. The fork could be original, both flat and sloping were offered in the early 1980's.
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Old 07-27-10, 01:02 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by Old Fat Guy View Post
Absolute rubbish.

The hole is a drainage hole. The over the top BB routing is original. Do you think they took off a bottom of the stay cable guide to braze on a top of the stay guide?
Please read my post again. I stated the top guides 'look' to have been added. As for the hole, drainage could be the reason, but on mine (exact shell, milling and all) a plastic guide was fixed through a hole exactly as in the photo the OP provided. Just a fact, so the hole served a different purpose at least in the case of my frame.
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Old 07-27-10, 01:06 PM   #14
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To the OP:

Top guides are obviously original, and I arrived at that conclusion by noting something I missed before: the top of chainstay cable stop for the rear derailleur. Doh! Getting old; not paying attention to detail!

How's that driveside rear dropout looking?
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Old 07-27-10, 01:06 PM   #15
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Both of you got valid points. The one thing that supports OFG's candidly expressed notion is that the chainstay cable stop is on top, amidst what appear to be virgin chrome.

Still, the BB lug is obviously repainted.

Edit:
simul-posting with Drillium!!

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Old 07-27-10, 01:07 PM   #16
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As OFG states, the bike is a Professional.

I looked at Cadre and the numbers get it very close.

The owner of the lbs I'm at says it is an '82.

Close enough for me.
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Old 07-27-10, 01:13 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by Drillium Dude View Post
Please read my post again. I stated the top guides 'look' to have been added. As for the hole, drainage could be the reason, but on mine (exact shell, milling and all) a plastic guide was fixed through a hole exactly as in the photo the OP provided. Just a fact, so the hole served a different purpose at least in the case of my frame.
The hole is for drainage and then it WAS used for a plastic Vitus guide that popped into the hole (and still allowed drainage) during a brief transition period to brazed on, and then cast in, under BB guides. Around 83 or 84 I think.

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Old 07-27-10, 01:22 PM   #18
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I apologize if my 'candidness' was a bit harsh, but stating ill thought out opinion as fact rankles me a bit.

Jan can vouch that I am an irritable old grouch.

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Old 07-27-10, 01:44 PM   #19
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My 83/84 Professional also has the Telekom Paint job and I also assumed that it had been repainted at one time but mine has the italicized Eddy Merckx font and not the "bubble" font.

The "spear point" design was being used quite early, I wonder if EM suggested to use these colors to Telekom because he liked them (and they were available and not being used by another team) as he had painted bikes in these colors before?

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Old 07-27-10, 02:46 PM   #20
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There were no Eddy Merckx "company" built bikes in the 70's, They started in 1980. All previous Eddy Merckx "branded" bikes were built by other companies (Falcon, Kessells, Colnago, etc).

This is an Eddy Merckx from the early 80's.
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Old 07-27-10, 03:36 PM   #21
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Great bike in really sad shape. Won't take too much to get it back to the condition it deserves to be in except for maybe the drop out. Not sure how much of a problem that's going to be. I hope you get to ride the heck out of it.
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Old 07-27-10, 05:21 PM   #22
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Could the “8470” serial mean that the frame is 1984 production?
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Old 07-27-10, 05:41 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Bianchigirll View Post
I am no expert but the dropouts look short for a '70 frame, and was the right one repaired?
Yup. And not a very good repair, either, by the looks of it. What does the inside face of that dropout look like, I wonder? I'm not seeing very good brass penetration on the outside. I suspect it won't last long with use.
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Old 07-27-10, 05:43 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Old Fat Guy View Post
Absolute rubbish.

The hole is a drainage hole. The over the top BB routing is original. Do you think they took off a bottom of the stay cable guide to braze on a top of the stay guide?
Do other Merckx frames of this model have a hole there as well? If not, I suspect it was added after the fact by somebody who wanted to go all high-fashion and route the cables under the shell, but didn't want to bother with drew-ing off the original guides.
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Old 07-27-10, 05:52 PM   #25
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Do other Merckx frames of this model have a hole there as well? If not, I suspect it was added after the fact by somebody who wanted to go all high-fashion and route the cables under the shell, but didn't want to bother with drew-ing off the original guides.
Yes, they do have the hole.
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