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Old 08-31-10, 01:48 PM   #1
tiwaz23
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Need Raleigh Cotter Pins

hello again,
i have an old Raleigh grand prix, pre-77 is all the info i can muster on the year as thats when they stopped using cotter pin cranks (serial number is 3046627 if that helps, no letters though so im not sure what year it is..). anyways, i was wondering if anyone knows of anywhere to acquire the pins. im not looking to replace the whole crank set with square tapered, just looking for pins. if anyone has any advice id be much obliged to listen. thanks for reading this.
peace
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Old 08-31-10, 02:03 PM   #2
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I believe that Raleigh cotter pins are 9.5 mm, but it's best to measure...

http://www.niagaracycle.com/product_...ducts_id=10478

Get a bunch of them, cause you'll ruin one every time you remove the crank. Also, harris cyclery has other sizes if yours aren't 9.5 mm.

You'll probably need to file the flats so that they go in far enough to get the nuts on, too. I'd replace both sides since the angle of the new cotter and the old cotter won't be the same.
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Old 08-31-10, 02:11 PM   #3
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Post a pic of the bike, we can most likely ID the year pretty close.

The Cotters that niagara sells are bottom of the barrel quality. If you pedal with any force or weigh much at all you will flat the cheapo cotters in no time and you'll be hearing and feeling the clunk as you pedal.

get decent cotters. Its worth it.
http://bikesmithdesign.com/CotterPress/cotters.html
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Old 08-31-10, 04:18 PM   #4
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Don't forget you file the taper by hand to make it fit it's best ..
a couple hammer strokes to set it , then you tighten the nut.
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Old 08-31-10, 04:40 PM   #5
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I've worked on about half-a-dozen cottered cranksets (a low number for some of you folks) and I've yet to need to file a cotter.

Am I just lucky?
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Old 08-31-10, 06:38 PM   #6
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I always file cotters because I want them to protrude exactly the same amount on both sides of the arms. I think it looks best that way. It sometimes takes several test fittings. I never beat on a cotter with a hammer. I do it right with a good press. My cotters and cranks are hammer ding free and the cotters don't come loose.


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Old 08-31-10, 07:05 PM   #7
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I rode a schwinn unicycle for many years and I finally gave up on cottered cranks. I brazed the m'fn' cranks on and called it a day......
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Old 08-31-10, 07:13 PM   #8
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I rode a schwinn unicycle for many years and I finally gave up on cottered cranks. I brazed the m'fn' cranks on and called it a day......
^
How come comments like this always pop up in cottered crank discussions? It's not as if the OP is looking for substitutions at this point.

---------------------------------------------

That said, the important thing is to get good cotters. Too many shops presently carry absolute bottom-grade cotters which will flat out in less than a block - no matter what you do. File them or not, cheap cotters aren't worth a damn.

Trying to get cheap cotters to work? STOP.

BUY GOOD COTTERS. STOP.

END OF TELEGRAM. STOP.

-Kurt
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Old 08-31-10, 07:40 PM   #9
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Well, not all of us mind. It may prove useful someday. If not that, then some other random tidbit. Say, how did you dechrome the crank and spindle?
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Old 08-31-10, 07:57 PM   #10
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The Bikesmith cotters Zaphod mentioned are a lot better than the Chinese things. Either way though I cannot imagine not filing the flats -

Filing ensures that the cotter seats adequately, but it also helps to effect more contact area with the flat on the BB.
Once driven home, this wider, flatter surface to surface wedging helps prevent the cotter from backing out.
I use a good quality, flat mill file to do this. I am sure that if I left the convex surface of the new cotter unscathed, it would back off more easily.
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Old 08-31-10, 08:10 PM   #11
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Some of the Grand Prix models were equipped with steel cottered Stronglight cranksets- they use a different cotter. Harris Cyclery (of course) has any type of cotter you might need....
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Old 08-31-10, 08:24 PM   #12
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Unfortunately Harris stocks crappy cotters.
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Old 08-31-10, 08:32 PM   #13
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That said, the important thing is to get good cotters.
How can you tell which cotters are good? Are all Chinese made pins bad and all German made pins good? Is it that the more expensive the better the quality? I need new cotter pins and most sites that offer them don't include where the pins are made and none list a brand name (obviously).
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Old 08-31-10, 08:39 PM   #14
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I think filing makes the pins less slippery by removing the chrome.

Have you guys ever noticed whether or not the unfiled pins which loosen up had notches pressed in them by the spindle?
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Old 08-31-10, 09:24 PM   #15
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How can you tell which cotters are good? Are all Chinese made pins bad and all German made pins good? Is it that the more expensive the better the quality? I need new cotter pins and most sites that offer them don't include where the pins are made and none list a brand name (obviously).
I have no idea whatsoever. I'd like to know, but I dare say the only fellow with that information is Mark Stonich - and there's no reason for him to divulge it, seeing that he sells them graded.

I'll pay a bit more and get them from Mark; at least I know what I'm getting. Better pay a bit more than pay a lot more purchasing a whole bunch of crap cotters.

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Old 08-31-10, 09:30 PM   #16
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How can you tell which cotters are good? Are all Chinese made pins bad and all German made pins good? Is it that the more expensive the better the quality? I need new cotter pins and most sites that offer them don't include where the pins are made and none list a brand name (obviously).
Generally you get what you pay for. IMO the best ones are French, but they won't fit your English bike.
The difference I've noted is that the cheesy ones are too malleable - especially the threaded portion. They will fold on you if you are not very precise in their removal, and they tend to stretch out instead of snugging when you install the nut.
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Old 08-31-10, 09:44 PM   #17
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http://bikesmithdesign.com/CotterPress/cotters.html

Read the descriptions--he gives reasons why some cotters are better than others.
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Old 08-31-10, 10:56 PM   #18
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Most replacement cotters are very poor quality and sourcing good ones can be a challenge... it is worth the extra few dollars to get quality cotters.
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Old 09-01-10, 08:11 AM   #19
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http://bikesmithdesign.com/CotterPress/cotters.html

Read the descriptions--he gives reasons why some cotters are better than others.
Its really worth reading those descriptions if you want to understand the difference between a crap-o cotter and a good one.

He recommends filing cotters as opposed to not filing.
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