3speed

I have trouble believing there isn't already a thread on this, but a few different search terms turned up nothing. What are the lighter kinds of tubing? I want to do a nice riding weight weeny build and would like to know what kinds of tubing I should be looking out for. I only weigh ~150, so hopefully I won't have to worry too much about being too heavy for it.

I have a full Reynolds 531 frame from 1974 now, but read that 531 isn't all that light.

TheOtherGuy

Double-butted 531 is light. Lighter though (in vintage tubing), was the Reynolds 753.
Comparable to the Reynolds 531 in the Columbus line, was their SL tubeset. The lighter, vintage Columbus tubing, was called KL, and Record. I'm not familiar with the Tange lightweight tubes, but I know they made several high quality tubesets, that were also lighter than Reynolds 531 and Columbus SL. 531 and SL were considered the "standards" for a high quality frame, for many years.

531phile 

Tange Prestige was top of the line and Tange 1 was second bestestest in the Tange lineup.

A little tip, thought not vintage: Columbus Foco is made of unicorn hoofs. Has magical ride quality. It's the best riding steel I've ridden, even better than Reynolds 853. Columbus Ultra Foco would be even better in terms of being lightweight.

clubman 

Ishiwata 019 is super light and strong. There's an online spreadsheet with the weights and strengths of all the players in tube sets but I can't find it...

TheOtherGuy

I've got one bike made from KL, and I have to say, it feels pretty magical too. Then that could also be due to the mahogany rims and silk sewups. It feels like riding a fast cloud.

Sixty Fiver

Ishiwata 019 tubing is beautiful... friend has a Kuwahara Club Sport road bike built with this and it hits the curb at under 20 pounds with no particularly lightweight bits but nice bits nonetheless.

531C is lighter than 531... these set the standards for lightweight steel.

matt0ne

Pure hopeful speculation, but shouldn't SLX be up there as one of the lightest. My Gios weighs less then my daughter's My Little Pony!

Sixty Fiver

Tubing plays a small role in how magical a ride is... my Ron Cooper is made of 531 and is a mind blowing ride and this is because of the craftsmanship that went into building the frame and fork.

The lightest tubing does not always equal the best ride and many builders have sacrificed weight for strength and ended up with very nice performing bicycles until their frames failed.

dedhed

https://www.equusbicycle.com/bike/col...cat/index.html

https://www.equusbicycle.com/bike/col...umbuschart.htm

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reynolds_Cycle_Technology

https://www.peytocycles.com/true-temp...icycle-tubing/

https://www.equusbicycle.com/bike/ishiwata/catalog2/

https://www.equusbicycle.com/bike/index.html

Road Fan

Need to distinguish between the tubeset and the alloy makeup of the steel. On the one hand, "531" refers to the manganese-molybdenum alloy that Reynolds invented. For Columbus, the alloy name is "Cyclex," and is a chromium-molybdenum steel alloy. OTOH, "531" is used to refer less carefully to tubesets made of that alloy. With the suffix (531C, 531CS, 531ST, or other ones) it refers to differences in tube design, such as different thicknesses for different tubes, or use of straight gauge instead of butted or double butted. The wall and butt thicknesses are varied, as well.

but yes, 531C as a tubeset is lighter than a straight gauge 531 tubeset, since there's just less metal.

I want an 019 bike!

Road Fan

Not sure if your balloon will be busted, but SLX and SL are the same steel and have teh same wall and butt thicknesses. What's different is that with SLX, ridges are raised on the interior walls of some of the tubes. The idea was to maintain as much as possible of the lightness of SL but gain some of the stiffness of a thicker Columbus tubeset such as SP. So relative to SL some metal was added, but not as much as the difference between SL and SP.

I haven't owned an SLX frame, but I really like my SL Mondonico. How much of the magic is Columbus and how much is Mondonico, I don't know.

prettyshady

My lightest is a mid 80's vitus carbone
followed by the aluminium vitus 979's and aluminium ALANS
For steel, french super vitus 980 I think is very light.

nlerner

My lightest bike is made from 531P or Professional. Jan Nikolajsen has lots of good Reynolds info on his website:

https://fivenineclimber.com/bikes/gaz...eynolds_80.htm

Neal

Road Fan

Well done, Jan!!!

Bianchigirll 

Columbus MAX! despite its bulky appearance it is actually lighter (well the tubeset) than a SL,SLX,TSX. MAX tubes set 1900gr. SL 1925, SLX 1969
https://www.equusbicycle.com/bike/col...umbuschart.htm


the Tange UltraLite Prestige was very nice and light.

RobbieTunes

Tubing weight is relevant, but one component of the group can easily make that moot. Or the saddle, the seat post, or the pedals. Then add water, and a wedge bag, a cell phone, shoes and helmet, and now weight is starting to become less relevant.

If your goal is simply to build a weight-conscious bike, there are lighter ways to go, such as older Cannondales, or carbon fiber.

If you want to stay with steel, but still race up the hills of Mad City or Mineral Point Rd, then by all means, search out a light steel frame. When searching for the components and the frame, be prepared to pay as much as you would for a lightweight, used CF bike.

It's fun to build a bike, though, and that's sometimes as rewarding as the ride.

Picchio Special

As with many tubing types, there are different versions of Tange Prestige, some of which strays into the "silly-light" range. The equivalent of the thinnest Prestige would be Ishiwata 015.
Excell also made some very light tubing, and to me, Excell is as exotic as it gets from the classic era - .25 in its thinnest sections.

repechage

I had a track frame made of Columbus Record. Essentially KL in straight gauge. I forget, but one tube the seat or down tube was KL. I was advised by the builder that the best performance of the frame would be in the first 10,000 meters. Through a translator I was told to ride the bike to know it, then race only.

As the stuff was relatively new, some of this might have been too much caution.

Then there is the co-worker who placed a Reynolds 3/10 ga. frame in a Park workstand and crimped the tube... flightweight has its price.

3speed

Never understood the argument that once you count in water, bag, etc, the weight no longer counts. You're adding those same things to a heavier bike, and therefore you're still ending up with a lighter bike in the end no matter how you look at it. But anyway, most of the point is simply to have a really nice riding bike, and the point of trying to build a light one is mostly just the fun of trying to build a light one. I don't have any delusion that it's going to make me ride my leisurely 30mi loop on my days off of work any faster. It'll also be nice to save a few pounds when maneuvering it up the stairway when I go for a ride.
Eeek! Did he clamp it in really tight? I would think that if it was That easy to crush that you'd be in trouble the first time you hit a decent bump.

zandoval 

OK - But lets get to the Finnish and Starting line... How much money U got???

Its really a ratio: >$ = <#

What is the lightest tubing for the money - I really don't know but 531 has been around a long time and I am sure it has to be on the list...

Great thread>>>

jan nikolajsen 

Thanks for the comments re my Reynolds page.

If I were doing a classic steel weight weenie build (and I might soon) I would start with a reputable 753 frame in the smallest size I could handle. Considering that a such bike may not see tons of use it would be okay to go extra small for the cause.

But not all frames with similar tubing material are created equal. I have 3 bikes made of 753 from vastly different backgrounds and the bare frames fluctuate in weight more than I can logically explain!

Picchio Special

753, like many tubing types, came in a range of gauges. Plus, you have to account for the weight of the lugs and braze-on bits - BB shells certainly don't all weigh the same, and some builders would use little tricks to lighten BB shells and fork crowns, mill the dropouts, etc. Which is exactly why tubing chart weights only tell a part of the story, and rarely the most important part.
John Thompson can tell stories, for example, about how Trek would use a modified Ishiwata SCM crown - removing material from between the crown and the fork blades - on its 170 models frames built with 753. Later 170's used a Tange crown, which was stronger but not as snazzy-light.

fietsbob

Titanium has a lower atomic molecular weight than steel . for a starter..

3speed

From what I've heard I'd really like to ride one, but I don't have That kind of money. The only ones I've seen were for sale for over $500 for a frame. I'm hoping to find something cosmetically challenged but nice quality for a couple hundred or less if I can. Then on to the GELs and drillium!

Chombi

Just one mention of Supervitus 980???!
I'll second it then for one of the lightest steel db tubing!
It helped me reach a 19.25 pound weight on my Peugeot PSV. Without getting too crazy with weenie weight components. I think I can get it into the 18's if I do.....

Chombi