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Old 07-10-11, 01:10 AM   #1
robatsu
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The Death of Vintage

Original post deleted. Ball took an unexpected bounce right from the git-go.

My apologies.

Last edited by robatsu; 07-10-11 at 02:39 AM.
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Old 07-10-11, 01:20 AM   #2
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Thank you, Marie Antoinette. How do you feel about cake?
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Old 07-10-11, 01:26 AM   #3
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Thank you, Marie Antoinette. How do you feel about cake?
I'm not exactly sure what that is intended to mean, one could take it several ways, but all of the ones that occur to me seem a little harsh.

Last edited by robatsu; 07-10-11 at 01:32 AM.
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Old 07-10-11, 01:33 AM   #4
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Yep, it's dead, I'll give you scrap + 20% for anything you have left.

I'm not ready to eat cake yet.
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Old 07-10-11, 01:36 AM   #5
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Despite the truths being spoken in the OP, I have to note that some members in C&V are incredibly rude. Not necessarily RFC, just a very keen observation I've made.

What a bunch of grouches.
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Old 07-10-11, 01:39 AM   #6
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i enjoy cake
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Old 07-10-11, 01:50 AM   #7
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Despite the truths being spoken in the OP, I have to note that some members in C&V are incredibly rude. Not necessarily RFC, just a very keen observation I've made.

What a bunch of grouches.
Very diplomatic. Thank you. My point is that those who complain that cheap C&V is no longer available are simply wringing their hands. Life, in fact almost all of life, shifts and changes. Otherwise, it would be very boring. So, you can no longer pick up buckets of freewheels for nothing. Those who long for the good old days are doomed to spending their lives reliving the memory.

No offense intended.
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Old 07-10-11, 02:03 AM   #8
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So I took a moment to knowingly wring my hands & remember some things past as I sell off some "treasures". Not exactly turning into Miss Havisham here and not in need of therapy or tough love or a swift kick in the butt.

Maybe mods should lock this thread, this has clearly jumped the rails rather quickly.
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Old 07-10-11, 02:12 AM   #9
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I don't know RFC-- OP didn't seem like he was lamenting the so-called perfect family of the 1950s or some other fantasy that never actually existed. He was just saying he liked it when he could buy specific stuff (in this case CV parts) dirt cheap-- before the world renewed its interest in these old bikes/parts. I mean, nothing wrong with knowing that during a certain period of time there were constant great deals... right? That doesn't mean the OP is resistant to change.

I miss the way that some of the places I travel to use to be: cheap (for me), more rural, less developed, etc-- but at the same time I'd never (if I had the power) snap my fingers and revert those places to how they used to be because I can recognize that as middle classes and infrastructure and public health programs and education ... are given birth to in these places the quality of life goes up. Or, at the very least, the people living there want the development that's happening.

The point is, we can miss the old ways without being resistant to change. And we can hold two seemingly countervailing ideas in our heads at the same time-- like missing one state of things while not rejecting the current state of things.
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Old 07-10-11, 02:22 AM   #10
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Despite the truths being spoken in the OP, I have to note that some members in C&V are incredibly rude. Not necessarily RFC, just a very keen observation I've made. What a bunch of grouches.
I don't think there's ANYONE I would consider incredibly rude.

The OP dropped the proverbial bomb, declaring the very hobby this forum is about "dead" and he expected a rousing rendition of cumbaya?
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Old 07-10-11, 02:32 AM   #11
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back to the matter at hand...
I'll up Khatfull - scrap + 25% for the really neato stuff.
Derailleurs, hubs, really nice stems, lightweight 6sp freewheels, etc.

no VO repros for me if the old stuff is cheaper
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Old 07-10-11, 02:34 AM   #12
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I have to disagree.. I really just got into this whole thing but I'm able to get my bikes for dirt cheap by hunting recycling yards/dumps and I get my parts by buying bikes that most people consider beyond use.. at the same places.. I guess the nature may have changed, but you can still do c&v for dirt cheap
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Old 07-10-11, 02:37 AM   #13
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I don't think there's ANYONE I would consider incredibly rude.

The OP dropped the proverbial bomb, declaring the very hobby this forum is about "dead" and he expected a rousing rendition of cumbaya?

I'm sorry if you and others were shocked/offended. I was just ruminating about things. "Dead" certainly is dramatic and overstates the case, but I do feel the hobby is or is rapidly becoming qualitatively different, at least the vintage (not the modern Classic, which is thriving) end of things. For me, an admittedly cheapskate, wallowing in all this fine stuff on a beer budget was a part of the attraction of vintage (but not classic stuff).

Maybe I should have titled it differently. "Death of Vintage for me..." or something.

My apologies.

Mods, please lock this thread. I'm deleting my original post.
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Old 07-10-11, 02:40 AM   #14
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it's more like the birth of vintage.. you miss the days when the bikes were just "old"

vintage mtbs can still be had cheap
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Old 07-10-11, 02:53 AM   #15
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Of course the OP is right. This goes for Europe as well. And yes things change. Its obvious. Strange outcome of this thread to say the least...
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Old 07-10-11, 03:33 AM   #16
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you shoulda been here yesterday ....
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Old 07-10-11, 03:55 AM   #17
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it's more like the birth of vintage.. you miss the days when the bikes were just "old"
That really gets to the heart of the matter.
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Old 07-10-11, 04:14 AM   #18
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Very diplomatic. Thank you. My point is that those who complain that cheap C&V is no longer available are simply wringing their hands. Life, in fact almost all of life, shifts and changes. Otherwise, it would be very boring. So, you can no longer pick up buckets of freewheels for nothing. Those who long for the good old days are doomed to spending their lives reliving the memory.

No offense intended.
+1. In a certain sense C&V has gotten cheaper because the fixie/SS crowd is no longer scooping up everything with horizontal dropouts. There was a time I'd buy anything w/ 700c's, an alloy crank and horizontal drops. I'd do a quick quality refrub and easily turn them around for a $100+ profit, now I walk right by everything. I'd wouldnt pay $25 for a bike I'd previously pay $125 for.

Even the high end is down. Previously the opening price for a NR equipted bike was $800, SR $1000 and Dura Ace was $600.....those were peak market prices. Now, one can easily find those same bikes for less. I said this a long, long time ago, bikes and bike parts in 1-8 condition are very abundant and the prices are reasonable, its the bikes and parts in 9/10+ condition or better that are bringing very strong prices.

Niches come and go, at the moment certain segments that were weak 3 years ago are now strong and segments that were strong 3 years ago are now weak. Demographics also play a role as one looks to collect, ride and appreciate what one once owned, raced or yearned for. I'm 43 and thus look for bikes from 80's which I'm most familiar with, using my simple logic I'd say most people who collect 60's bikes are in thier 60's...personaly, I really dont care for them. I can appreciate them and I can see why others drop $$$ on them but they just aren't my cup of tea.

Every time i say I'm 'priced out' out of a segemnt I once wasnt I come across something thats reasonbly priced.
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Old 07-10-11, 05:38 AM   #19
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Perhaps this thread is dead, I don't know. I would've liked to read the original post but was out riding yesterday and missed it. Well, you say something apparently provocative in any crowd and you're going to get a reaction. So it goes. I note the OP had the guts to delete his original post and apologize. That's to be commended but I think it's kind of sad he had to resort to that. As for the phenomena, I find it very interesting. Like Miamijim says, it's all relative. Some things are way up and I just wince when I see what some folks are asking for mid-level bikes from the 80's and 90's on ebay. Perhaps they don't realize their rosy dreams but the fact that they're asking that much indicates a trend of some sort. The real good and rare stuff is always going to go high. Other stuff, not. I note that Nuovo Record rear derailleurs, for instance, seem to be commanding roughly the same prices they did 15 years ago. There's always been a lot of them around I guess. Still, the OP's nostalgic regrets ring true to a point. I used to collect old tools, but gave up when Antiques Roadshow and the rise of ebay helped everyone believe they had real treasures in their attics. Sometimes they did, but usually didn't. Then again, one man's treasure is another man's run-of-the-mill. I try not to look back.

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Old 07-10-11, 08:47 AM   #20
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As an interest/activity, C&V bikes of whatever ilk and the stuff to equip them is still a lot cheaper thrill than the modern "equivalent." If you don't like change, you have to get yourself ready for the dirt nap. Maybe OP's got some burn-out -- pace yourself, man!
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Old 07-10-11, 09:07 AM   #21
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the original post wasn't inflammatory in any way.. the thread just had a weird start

Quote:
I'm 43 and thus look for bikes from 80's which I'm most familiar with
i'm 31 and also look for bikes from the 80s.. but mostly because i feel like the late 80s was the high point for steel road bikes. I do think being a child of the 80s is what makes me prefer Japanese steel though.. just like Marty McFly said "What do you mean, Doc, all the best stuff is made in Japan"
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Old 07-10-11, 09:11 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by RFC View Post
Very diplomatic. Thank you. My point is that those who complain that cheap C&V is no longer available are simply wringing their hands. Life, in fact almost all of life, shifts and changes. Otherwise, it would be very boring. So, you can no longer pick up buckets of freewheels for nothing. Those who long for the good old days are doomed to spending their lives reliving the memory.

No offense intended.
I have no idea what the original posting was, since it is deleted.

+1 For those that complain cheap C & V is dead, I disagree. First, how do you define cheap. Compared to an entry level new bike, I find many C & V bikes to be compelling bargains. For example, market value of a 1980s Waterford Paramount, in great condition, is about what a new entry road bike sells for, or less. Incredible in my opinion. I bought my 1986 Waterford Paramount from a flipper in Charlotte last year. I was happy to pay his price. I bought four other bikes from him as well, including my Series V Paramount. Deal. Around here, a lot of the used bike market (customers), are looking for that $100 to $200 bike. So vintage bikes above that mark get ignored. That can make for some pretty sweet deals.

For those that cannot find deals, my two word answer: "Look harder". And another two words: "Move fast".

+1 To Jim's comment: around here, the FG/SS vintage market has dried up, which has caused prices to drop overall.

Last edited by wrk101; 07-10-11 at 09:14 AM.
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Old 07-10-11, 09:30 AM   #23
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Spam site to the rescue for the curious.
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Old 07-10-11, 09:43 AM   #24
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I agree. After 29 years, my TA waterbottle cage broke yesterday. Cheap POS!
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Old 07-10-11, 09:51 AM   #25
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wow that's amazing how fast that site managed to scoop up the OP.

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+1 To Jim's comment: around here, the FG/SS vintage market has dried up, which has caused prices to drop overall.
yep same around here. in the winter I saw lots of bikes being sold as "fixie projects" but by spring and summer there are none.

the vintage road bike market is HOT though...
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