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  1. #1
    aka Tom Reingold noglider's Avatar
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    bicycletutor.com is no longer free

    We have to pay to see the videos. I'm annoyed. I don't need them; I just want them, so I'm not going to pay.

    Has anyone here paid?
    Please email me rather than sending me a private message. My address is noglider@pobox.com

    Tom Reingold
    New York City and High Falls, NY
    noglider's ride blog

  2. #2
    Fast+Bulbous thinktubes's Avatar
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    Well they've certainly got a lot of nerve! It's not like they spent any time or money producing them.

  3. #3
    LET'S ROLL 1nterceptor's Avatar
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    I think they started charging a few months ago,
    I just use Youtube for my mechanical show and tell

  4. #4
    Bicycle Repair Man !!! Sixty Fiver's Avatar
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    I get paid when I teach classes.

  5. #5
    Senior Member tugrul's Avatar
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    I don't need them anymore (I know enough to be dangerous now), but I do remember them fondly.

    The thing I don't understand is how is he going to keep up his reputation when newcomers hit his pay wall and just go find another video on youtube.
    Looking for Quick release for a BR-6208 Cotter pin press

  6. #6
    Senior Member shnibop's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tugrul View Post
    I don't need them anymore (I know enough to be dangerous now), but I do remember them fondly.

    The thing I don't understand is how is he going to keep up his reputation when newcomers hit his pay wall and just go find another video on youtube.
    my thoughts exactly, his videos are good, but no better than any other FREE video that can be found on youtube

  7. #7
    Senior Member randyjawa's Avatar
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    I am on the other side of the coin.

    At one time I asked for a $10.00 per year subscription to MY "TEN SPEEDS". I did make a small bit of money but nothing to write home about. With that in mind, and still wanting to present a useful, entertaining resource, I dropped the fee, offered access to the website for free. For the last two months I have gotten 2,000,000 plus hits per month and tons of email.

    I do invite people to donate to the website. My figuring is that if they feel they have been treated to entertainment, and/or useful information, then they just might want to say thank you. But darn few do. However...

    Lots of people want to ask me questions, through the email vehicle I provide, and I answer everyone, to the best of my ability. Still no thank you from most.

    So, as usual, it comes down to we all want something for nothing, or very little, at the very least. Will I keep MY "TEN SPEEDS" going. Yes, as long as I enjoy publishing the site. The point I am making is this...

    Information is valuable, in any walk of life. Entertainment is always sought out and paid for. Just go to the movies, spend $15.00 and get entertained for an hour and a half. But the reward to the person, who spends days and days going through hundreds of pages of MTS information, both entertaining and useful, is far greater, in my opinion. And he/she can go back anytime they wish to do so. But they still don't want to offer a bit of help for all that entertainment and information.

    The guy with the videos feels he has a right to charge for his information, and so do I. What he doesn't understand is most of us, me included, want something for nothing and that is what will kill many creative websites, as time passes.

    Of course, he could always load his site up with advertising, and that is exactly what I have considered. I have spent years developing MY "TEN SPEEDS" and I think it to be a good resource, one that I hope to make better and better. Is it worth it? To you? To me?

    I do hope you see the point here and don't think poorly of the guy who would like a bit of a reward for his efforts. Keep in mind, this is just my opinion. You can still visit my stuff for free and not be hampered with a bunch of advertisement.
    Last edited by randyjawa; 09-30-11 at 04:00 AM. Reason: added stuff
    Learn how to find, restore and maintain vintage road bicycles at... MY "TEN SPEEDS"

  8. #8
    Chainstay Brake Mafia
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    bicycle tutor's videos are excellent videos on bike repair and his production level is top notch. Unfortunately the information he is presenting can be easily found elsewhere.

    I think it would be smarter to offer some videos for free, or portions of videos. I don't know if he's changed how he works since the pay wall first went up
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  9. #9
    Senior Member BigPolishJimmy's Avatar
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    I agree with frantik, how will newcomers know how great the videos are if some aren't offered up for free. Maybe just a couple of basics like changing a tire or lubing your chain. The key of course is that it's not my decision to make. I used to recommend his videos to newbies as they really are easy to follow.

  10. #10
    Older I get, faster I was con's Avatar
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    He has every right to charge. I have every right to no longer use them.

  11. #11
    aka Tom Reingold noglider's Avatar
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    Sure, he has a right to charge. I would never claim otherwise. I think the fees are too high, and he doesn't even have free samples (as far as I can tell). Even the big music companies know that free youtube videos lead to increased sales. The NY Times, through cookie tracking, lets anyone read something like 20 articles a month for free.

    $5 a month? It might be worth it if I knew how many videos I was going to watch in a month, but I don't.

    Randy, you could make money on your site with Google Ad Words. Just carve out a little section of each page for Google Ad Words. When visitors click on the links that Google provides, they send you a few cents. Some people make a living off this, just by putting these ads in their blogs. They've quit their day jobs! You already have lots of visitors. Try it. It's mutually beneficial. After all, if the visitors click the links, it's because they're interested in the advertised products. And they're targeted by content and also by location of the visitor! Without your knowing it, you might be advertising for a bike shop in Guatemala when some Guatemalan visits your site.
    Please email me rather than sending me a private message. My address is noglider@pobox.com

    Tom Reingold
    New York City and High Falls, NY
    noglider's ride blog

  12. #12
    FBoD Member at Large khatfull's Avatar
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    This may be of interest: http://forums.bicycletutor.com/thread-3037.html

    New Membership System

    As you may have noticed, when you click on a video you are now taken to a membership sign-up form. I've started charging a small monthly fee for access to all of the video tutorials. Once you are logged in you'll be able to watch any of the videos. Members will also have access to all future tutorials as long as your membership remains active. You can cancel at any time and you will still be able to login and watch videos until the end of the term you've paid for.

    NOTE: The help forums will remain free, but require a separate registration/login.

    Bicycle Tutor currently runs at a loss and is badly in need of funding. I sincerely wish I could keep the videos free for everyone, but in reality that is just not feasible. I will be keeping the membership fees as low as possible to ensure the videos remain accessible to many people.

    A few things membership fees will fund:
    Hundreds of new video tutorials.
    Rent for a small permanent studio/office space.
    Purchasing of bikes and components to cover all makes.
    Full-time wages for myself and a few technical staff.
    Development of smartphone video apps.

    Initially it'll take me a few months to get set-up and rolling at full steam. I'm really excited about the possibilities and am keeping my fingers crossed. Thanks to everyone who's been patiently waiting for new tutorials!

  13. #13
    incazzare. lostarchitect's Avatar
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    If I was him, I'd have put ads up. Frankly, with Park Tool's site being free, and the thousands of instructional videos on youtube, he's just going to lose views. Ads on the other hand (google text ads like Tom suggested would be a good way to go) could be matched contextually to the page being viewed, offering relevant tools or parts. But it's his site, so he's free to choose.
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  14. #14
    Lotus Monomaniac Snydermann's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by randyjawa View Post
    For the last two months I have gotten 2,000,000 plus hits per month and tons of email.

    Lots of people want to ask me questions, through the email vehicle I provide, and I answer everyone, to the best of my ability. Still no thank you from most.
    +1 to randyjawa's whole post (I just quoted a section rather than repost the whole block of text).

    Wow, 2 million a month! Is that visits or pageviews? (Just curious). We got 1757 visitors and 7,839 page views in August, and I thought that was a lot! Unfortunately, our visitor bounce rate is almost 40%, but I think that's because of the Lotus car company and other products that use the Lotus name.

    To fund my website I'm offering products for sale, at least this way if you want to contribute you get something other than just "information". I'd prefer not to have advertising on the site.

    I do answer a ton of email from the Lotus site, but almost everyone sends a reply . . . some folks multiple replies.

    It sounds like the guy wants to fund a lot with that fee per month and make his site a career. While at times it does feel like a full-time job, I don't know how easy it will be to make it a career.
    Always searching for Lotus literature and memorabilia for use at www.VintageLOTUSbicycles.com, can you help?

  15. #15
    Senior Member randyjawa's Avatar
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    Just carve out a little section of each page for Google Ad Words
    And here-in lies the problem, well one of them, anyway...

    My website is a mess underneath. I am the only person on Earth who could figure it out. However, I am trying to learn Word Press, and once mastered, I will completely re-do MTS. This time allowing for advertising opportunity. I might not use add words since a fellow, who, unlike me, does have a clue, will be part of the maintenance team and advertising sales manager. So, he makes it work and asks for payment, but not from our customers who just go to MTS for entertainment or information. Me, I get to keep flapping my lips about this and that, some of which is fact and some, perhaps substance induce delirium.

    One thing is for sure - I like trying to present an information source disguised as a bunch of stories. People seem to like it, however; I am too verbose. As the new approach to how to do it surfaces, verbosity will take a back seat, and opportunity to understand will push to the front.

    Wow, 2 million a month! Is that visits or pageviews? (Just curious). We got 1757 visitors and 7,839 page views in August, and I thought that was a lot! Unfortunately, our visitor bounce rate is almost 40%, but I think that's because of the Lotus car company and other products that use the Lotus name.
    Huh??? This means so little to me.

    Honestly, I fluked my way through building MTS. That's why I am willing to share, any revenue generated, when the new guy comes fully on board. To be even more honest, I need to get at the Word Press thing more seriously but riding season is such a busy time for me, and not just because I ride.
    Did I mention tha
    Learn how to find, restore and maintain vintage road bicycles at... MY "TEN SPEEDS"

  16. #16
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    Hey Randy, I'm a web developer (most recently built this site) and could be available to you for help. As I said else where I fount MTS before these forums and have really enjoyed your detailed work.

    I don't mind giving advice or helping with specific problems, or we might even be able to work out a barter of some sort for some more in-depth help. I'd love to see MTS be successful for years to come, and to remain the valuable resource it is for people like me brand-new to riding steel.

  17. #17
    aka Tom Reingold noglider's Avatar
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    Well, Randy, as you note, your web page will benefit from a rewrite, so as soon as you do it, you'll reap many benefits, including the ability to put ads on it. I know this is little more than a glorified hobby for you, so wouldn't it be cool if it increased your revenue?
    Please email me rather than sending me a private message. My address is noglider@pobox.com

    Tom Reingold
    New York City and High Falls, NY
    noglider's ride blog

  18. #18
    DRF aka Thrifty Bill wrk101's Avatar
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    Too much free good info out there. I don't have a problem with him charging, but I am not interested in spending $$ on it.

    Although the Park Tool site is free (and I use it a fair amount), Park has made plenty of money off me in tools I have purchased, and I recommend several of their tools to others (like the CT3 chain tool). So I can understand the bike tutor guy trying to make some money off his videos.

    +1 From a marketing standpoint, I think he would be better off posting a few free ones, with a link to his pay site for more detailed/in depth videos. But how he markets his site is his choice.
    Last edited by wrk101; 09-30-11 at 11:16 AM.

  19. #19
    Senior Member randyjawa's Avatar
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    I know this is little more than a glorified hobby for you, so wouldn't it be cool if it increased your revenue?
    YES!!! I would like that and not just to get money. It would free me up to do what I like most and that is not buying and selling bicycles. I love finding, restoring and riding my own bikes. But I need to sell them also to avoid getting a real job at my age.

    I derive little pleasure from trying to sell what I find. That said, I really like it when people contact me, through this Forum or my website, with specific vintage bicycle related needs. Then, I feel like I am helping others and meeting the foundation of my business philosophy, which incidentally is, to help others.

    I believe that is the fundamental purpose of business. And it must have some merit. I am proud to say that I have quite a few repeat customers, friends, not sure how to put it, that have purchased stuff from me many times each. That I like.

    Ebay - not so much:-(
    Learn how to find, restore and maintain vintage road bicycles at... MY "TEN SPEEDS"

  20. #20
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    it happened sometime this summer.


    too bad. was using their site, but not anymore.

  21. #21
    Senior Member LarryMelman's Avatar
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    He started charging a few months ago. I suspect that he was expecting subscriptions provide a real "income" for him. I joined his forum to advise him that there was way too much free content out there that was just as good as his, or almost as good. And to suggest that he put his previously free videos on youtube where they would continue to be free. Changing free content to pay, is not going to make anyone pay, it's just going to piss everyone off. He banned me from the forum, and IP-banned me from the site. When I emailed him to say I was sincere and not a troll, he removed the IP-ban but left me banned from the forum and removed my post. I haven't been back. Before he started charging, he hadn't created any new videos in over a year.

    You can draw your own conclusions about his financial state, or his willingness to listen to anyone. He wants money up-front to fund his office/staff/etc. ... and then he'd get to work on creating more tutorials? Sorry... no. A bike-repair guy isn't gonna get "venture capital" from anyone.
    Last edited by LarryMelman; 09-30-11 at 11:47 AM.

  22. #22
    Senior Member ColonelJLloyd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by randyjawa View Post
    Then, I feel like I am helping others and meeting the foundation of my business philosophy, which incidentally is, to help others.

    I believe that is the fundamental purpose of business.

    The fundamental purpose of business is not to help others. You're obviously smart enough to know that. You're also smart enough to know that if you charge people for membership to your site you can't continue to advertise it for free on BF.
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  23. #23
    Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by ColonelJLloyd View Post
    The fundamental purpose of business is not to help others. You're obviously smart enough to know that. You're also smart enough to know that if you charge people for membership to your site you can't continue to advertise it for free on BF.
    Why we advertise for Nashbar, VO, etc for free all the time.
    Even a turkey can fly in a hurricane

  24. #24
    Senior Member ColonelJLloyd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by frenchbikefan View Post
    Why we advertise for Nashbar, VO, etc for free all the time.
    I relay my experience with products for which I've paid. I don't advertise for anyone.
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  25. #25
    Senior Member himespau's Avatar
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    as long as sheldon, Park tools and you tube are out there, charging will be tough.
    Punctuation is important. It's the difference between "I helped my uncle, Jack, off a horse" and "I helped my uncle Jack off a horse"


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