Jude

Just spotted this on craigslist. The guy believes it's a Peugeot PF60, he's converted it to a fixie. I'm not as interested in riding it fixed (although I might end up liking it), I'm more interested in putting gears back on it and using it for longer rides. So, assuming it fits me, the questions are: is it a decent frame and how does the quality compare to the price? And would it make sense financially to get a bike like this and put mid-range gears/shifters/etc on it? I'd probably be going for friction shifters, most likely bar-end since I hate down tube shifting.

https://philadelphia.craigslist.org/bik/2636239435.html

Edit: Just looked at it and it's in great condition. It is indeed a PF60, whatever that means.

Chombi

Looks like it was fixified, The frame should be a good one to re-build up if it's in good condition and things have not been hacked off like the rear derailleur hanger, especially. It's a mid level sport/tour model and has Vitus butted main tubes. The stays steerer and fork tubes will most likely be just plain straight gauge carbon steel. The $150 asking price would be OK if the frame's paint is in perfect condition and the frame tubes does not have any dents. Reject it if it has any kind of substantial corrosion. Touching up/matching the paint will also not be easy with the metallic paint. Be prepared to deal with a French or Swiss threaded bottom bracket, Headset and stem size. The seatpost will most likely be a less common 26.4 diameter size, so it is improtant that these components are in good working condition, with lockrings and threads not all bunged up. Those last few bits of warning just goes with owning an early to mid 80's Peugeot.
So make sure you can deal with the French size/threading component commitment before you buy it as most of that stuff is not readily available from bike shops anymore.

Chombi

Jude

Just looked at it and it's in great condition - obviously the wheels aren't original. I didn't notice the derailer hangers, I'll look again when I go back later this evening (the guy lives a few blocks away). Can you tell me exactly how much of a pain it is to find French-compatible components? The main thing I'd want to change is making it geared again and adding a Brooks saddle.

miamijim

Its no trouble to convert it back to being geared its just a matter of cost. With patience you could probably find a bike ready to ride for what it would cost to convert the PF60 back. The PF60 is a Vitus tubed road bike with race geometry and would fall mid-level in Peugeots offerings.

Depending on what he did to it you'd need:

Shifters: $10 used
FD: $10 used
RD: $15 used
Chain: $15 new
Freewheel: $20 new
Cables: $10 new
Crankset: $15

You may be able to do better than the prices I listed but the prices I listed are realistic as well.

zazenzach

waite...you went over and looked at the bike, but you're still deciding???

lol if i was the seller i'd be raging hard right now

Chombi

I think Your crankset price maybe sounds a bit low at $15,..($30 maybe??).... unless it just a lowly swaged arm model that's kinda beat up.....
I assume the rest of the prices for used stuff reflect well used but servicable condition mid level components.
Also, if the frame is in very good condition it might be well worth putting in a bit more money to build it up with newer/better components.
Chombi

Jude

I stopped by on my way home from work, I live three blocks from the guy...mentioned I didn't have much time but was gonna come back later. Which now is in five minutes. Since it doesn't seem like people think it would be much trouble to find parts, I think I'm gonna go for it assuming it rides nice (it had a flat before which should be fixed now). I'm giving myself a limit of $120 on the price, is that reasonable?

Chombi

I'd say that you should start at an even $100 (if the frame is as good as you described (close to mint?) and work from there. Remind him that the bike is not even ridable and you still will need to harvest all the needed parts to get it back on the road, plus the whole thing with the added effort of finding French parts. If you're lucky he might go for something like $115. You can also leave parts that don't look too good and use those as more leverage to slightly lower the price.

Good Luck!

Chombi

Jude

Went back and pulled the trigger on it after some test riding and adjusting handlebars/seatpost/saddle position to my size. It still needs some more adjusting and definitely different brake levers and saddle, but I love how it rides. My current bike is a Raleigh Technium, aluminum with steel bonds, and even with 28mm tires it really delivers the bumps of the road right into my body. This thing straight up neutralizes them even with 23mm tires and I'll be putting even fatter ones on.

I paid $130 - maybe I would have started lower if I'd seen your post but hey. It's a major city with a lot of hipsters and the guy could probably have found a buyer for a heck of a lot more than what I paid if he'd waited around. He said $150 (asking price on ad) was already lower than what he wanted, so I don't know if he knows Philly's bike market or not.

Anyway, I'll probably ride it as a fixie for a little bit (I'm kind of getting used to how it works) before putting a crapload of gears on it and using it as my day-ride bike around Lancaster County and stuff. Which brings me to the other questions - all the wrenches I've used on it have worked so far, and they're standard metric sizes, but I'm kind of worried that if I want to replace the stem/handlebars (a not-remote possibility) I'll have to go hunting for some obscure parts and/or settle for things that aren't exactly what I want. Is this likely to be an issue? Also will I have a hard time finding any other parts?

Anyway I think it was a solid purchase. I can probably sell my other bike for close to or as much as what I paid, and I was kind of falling out of love with that thing anyway (mainly due to the aforementioned rough ride quality) so once I sink some cash into refitting this thing I don't think I'll have come out too far behind.

Also, yeah, the frame is in amazing condition. I don't have a working camera currently, but it looks minty as hell. The wheels are new but also in great shape, and the handlebar/brake levers are sort of scuffed looking, but I'm taping and replacing those respectively anyway.

Junk083

I've got one of those too--albeit it is still geared. Couldn't see the fork in the CL ad, but the chrome sure cleans up nicely! I figure mine to be an '83.

Nice find!

Chombi

Congratulations, glad you got it! Welcome to the world of C&V steel Peugeot bikes!
Keep us posted on your adventures with it!

Chombi

miamijim

Perhaps low but regular run of the mill parts aren't expensive and the PF60 crank is nothing special.

PF60:

Chombi

You're correct about the PF60 OEM crank being not that special after all.....I thought it might have been at least a Stronglight 104...uhm...bis?
I know that the PF60 is more tour than race, but that's what I would like to put on a frame like it...

Chombi

Jude

Just stopped in an LBS and talked to the owner. He's knowledgeable and helpful but I guess he doesn't share your opinions on this bike, since he strongly discouraged me from trying to re-gear it. Basically he thought it'd be expensive and too hard to find compatible parts. He recommended leaving it fixed. What do you all think?

The other issue he had a strong opinion on, and I fully agree, is the need to get a stem that's a bit taller and maybe (but maybe not) a bit shorter horizontally. He suggested a Nitto Technomic stem which would be 70 bucks to buy there. I see them for sale online for in the $50 range and I'm still divided on whether I should save myself some money or support the LBS. Or, third option, just put a brake lever on the flats of the bar which would allow my main riding positions to be more upright - I'd still have the hoods for another more aggressive position after all.

So - your thoughts on anything in this post? Especially on the question of whether it makes sense to try and re-gear it, and whether new parts would be workable on this old frame.

Chombi

Mehhhh,...I suspect that he just does not want to be bothered with any request from you for 6 speed components as he might have a whole bunch of FG/SS gear to sell in his inventory. Try finding an older LBS that caters to older bikes that might have older parts in their drawers, if this one does not seem to. Like I said, this shop might not have anything to sell you anyway. as a C&Ver, You will also need to get used to going to the internet for C&V components that will fit.....eBay, CL,...wherever. They are all out there. It just takes a little patience and sometimes a bit of money to get them.
I'm not saying you neccessarily need to go with a geared setup, it's really up to you in the end. It's just a majority of C&Vers here love to shift gears. Some of us also just hope that you at least give consideration to utilizing those DT shifter bosses and rear derailleur hanger on that classic Peugeot.

Chombi

Jude

I had a geared setup in mind when I bought this thing. Since that shop basically works with new bikes (or at least only sells new bikes) I assumed I'd get a different opinion either from here or if I take it down to South Philly where there's a shop that sells all C&V (and, well...old) bikes. I figure I'll get more helpful advice from that dude.

Anyway, It seems like the only part compatibility I'd have to worry about is if the BB is French-threaded. But I don't know what will fit into this old frame - let's say I found something like this on craigslist and bought the appropriate parts: https://philadelphia.craigslist.org/bik/2655727168.html

Or like this: https://philadelphia.craigslist.org/bik/2661146845.html

Would that stuff generally work?

devinfan

Congrats on a nice bike! I think you got an amazing price, personally. The bike looks great set up as it is. If it were me, I'd just remove one of the levers, re-wrap the bars and get on the road. It's a decent conversion and you've got a nice light fixed gear at a great price. Fixed gears are great for Winter training. I rode fixed exclusively for 2 years and it made me a better cyclist. I don't want to echo the sentiments of your LBS guy, but if you're looking for a geared bike it might be cheaper in the end to buy one complete, and have one geared and one fixed. They both have a purpose.

Jude

I have to admit I'm pretty confused between one guy's estimate that it would cost maybe $100 in parts to gear it, and another's estimate that it would be cheaper to buy a new bike (i.e., probably at least a few hundred dollars)...

devinfan

Not trying to confuse you. I'm sure there are forum members here that could turn that bike into a geared bike for $100, I just don't think you're that person. If you have a good set of tools, and the knowledge and wherewithal to source all the correct components at a cheap price you could do it, but since you're a beginner I don't see it happening until you've had a while to mess around with bikes.

I was an absolute beginner once too and I spent a fortune trying to get components bit by bit to build bikes up. At the moment you'll be relying on your bike store a lot, and they charge for everything they do. I'm not trying to be a downer, the best way to learn about bikes is to build one up, I just don't recommend it as a cheap solution. From what I can see you'd need a new rear wheel that would work, shifters, derailleurs, and probably a new crank and chainrings too + cables etc. If you honestly think you can do that for a hundred bucks, that's awesome. Anyway, have fun doing whatever you do. I stand by my recommendation to either pick this bike up and ride it for two weeks every day to get used to it and see if you like it (I think you will), OR wait for a geared bike that is ready to go.

Jude

So, finally had time to take it down to a shop that specializes in older bikes and asked about switching out the stem, which is way too low right now. The guy (unfortunately not the owner, who I assume is a walking encyclopedia) measured the stem diameter and said it was "measuring at 21.9" but basically was a 22.0 stem. This is a weird size, as he wasn't able to find any in the store, at least any that were taller or shorter horizontally than what I have now. He thought it was also highly unlikely I'd find any French stem that was a better fit than what's currently on there.

So my options for making it rideable:

1. Go with what the guy at the first store (not a place that focuses on older bikes) wanted me to do, i.e. buy a $70 Nitto Technomic stem from them - or get one online (except I'd have to make dang sure it was the right size first).
2. Go with his suggestion that he says is "not ideal" - putting a slightly skinner stem in and adding something to fill the extra space. Sounds sketchy to me.
3. Just put a flat handlebar on there since I sort of prefer those anyhow.

Options 2 or 3 would be much less expensive, obviously. What would you all say? Are there other stem options I'm not aware of? I want the bars a fair amount higher and also a bit closer to me, although just raising them would of course bring them somewhat closer. The position that I currently am in if my hands are on the beginning of the drop-curves (corners of the tops...or whatever it's called) is pretty close to what my ideal would be for riding with brake access. On the hoods with a hand on the brake, I'm really bent over, and too much weight is on my hands, which is worse because the brake hoods are very uncomfortable. They will be changed, but that alone would not be solving the problem.

Incidentally, this guy had a much more optimistic view of equipping the bike with modern components to re-gear it, which was encouraging. Although if that does ultimately get done it will be a little ways down the road.

Jude

Any comments on the stem question?

devinfan

Your stem is slightly smaller (.2 mm) than a regular stem. You can easily take any standard quill stem in the size that you want and go to work with some sandpaper on the part that's going into the bike until it fits. .2 mm is not a lot. If you end up putting a flat bar on your bike, I think you'll find the current stem length works fine because the bars will always be in the "top of the drops" position. Or if you want, I'm sure someone on this forum has a french stem they can sell you.

Jude

That sounds fairly easy. Did the bike shop guy not know what he was talking about? From what he said it sounded like my stem was bigger and a different stem would have to be added to in girth in order to work with the bike.

devinfan

I'm sure the bike shop guy is very knowledgeable. French stems aren't something he probably sees very often. Anyway your stem is 22mm, and standard stems are 22.2mm, so yours is narrower not wider. That means you can take a regular stem and sand it down. Just make sure to run a piece of tape or other marker around the area you want exposed so that it doesn't get sanded and end up looking like crap. Also obviously I wouldn't do this to a rare or sought-after stem.