toosahn

***Look for my post on the second page for updates***

Finally got my Eisentraut Limited built up today (thanks to Rich for selling me this wonderful frame).

This was my first build from the ground up and it has been a two-month long process of getting the right parts and finding the time to do the special work (headset, bottom bracket).

But what a comfortable bike! Still needs work (handlebar tape, and a new seatpost), but I love it. First thought after a pedalstrokes: "I'll never sell it".

Lessons I've learned:

1. Tighten things down properly the first time! My cablestops at the down-tube scored the paint job because it wasn't tightened down properly (see pictures)

2. Velo-orange cable kits are slightly compromised. The shifter cable-housings are not long enough to run the cables up the handlebar and out near the stem. They are cut for a traditional setup. Additionally, the derailleur cable-housing was a micrometer too thick in diameter for the step-down ferrule I wanted to use.

3. Rivendell silver shifters are ok. I was expecting very smooth and easy shifting but it seems the either I'm binding somewhere, or I've done something wrong, but quite a bit of effort is required to shift the rear derailleur. See rear derailleur cable routing (is that routed correctly or is it too long?). Additionally, how do I clean up the shifter cable routing around the headtube/fork-crown?

4. Tall stems look strange but they do wonders for comfort. I got two of technomic stems and I'm seriously considering throwing the second on my Mikkelsen road bike (race geometry) to get that nice comfortable fit.

5. Mistakes are gonna happen, so deal with 'em and move on.. I made so many little mistakes in building this bike and I'm lucky I didn't get hurt or ruin parts. However, I think they were valuable lessons that will inform my next build.

Tooks some better pictures today:

thirdgenbird

i found the silver shifters on my wifes bike very pleasant.

i used a jagwire cable kit made for modern road bikes. i still didnt have enough to route the shifter cable all the way around the bars so i exited like yours and did the "double cross" method. the left shifter goes to the right cable stop and the right to the left. the cables then cross again before the bottom bracket. this keeps the housing in a nice smooth arch that doesnt touches the head tube. i do the same with brifters. unfortunately, the position of your cable stops may prevent this. i say give it a try.

as far as your shifting performance goes, make 100% sure you have the shifters assembled with the plastic bushings aligned properly. you will also want a step down ferrel where the cable housing meets the chain stay.

dbakl

Dang, that's HUGE!

thirdgenbird

more notes, before i wrap bar tape on bikes with bar end shifters i use electrical tape to securely hold the cable housing where it belongs on the handlebars.

here is a quick cell pic of the wifes cable routing. it is in the living room so if you want more let me know.


(the computer cable is secured with high quality clear tape. from the drive side it is barely visible)

bikemore 

Make sure you torque the crank set right. I've learned from experience

Roger M

Very Nice. Looking forward to some detailed and good pictures of this when you finish.

SteveSGP

Looks fantastic! And it's just my size

I prefer the old Suntour bar ends, they seem to have better leverage or something. I think you do have enough cable there to wrap the bars if you do them like I do.

I wrap them so that the cables come out a bit below the brake levers, it gives a nice smooth run I think.

toosahn

The step-down ferrule I have doesn't fit on the cable housing. I think I could sand it down a bit to get it to fit.

illwafer

your housing for the RD appears to not be seated in the stop. if you cant get a ferrule in there, you can still try it with just the pull of the cable keeping it in place. if that doesn't work, you can also use a zip tie to create a better angle (flat) so your cable isn't rubbing on the stop/housing liner. lastly, add a little lube/oil there for lubrication.

Drillium Dude 

^ Try that - without the ferrule, I almost guarantee that your shifting problem can be traced to the inner cable being squashed up against the outer housing where it emerges behind the cable guide.

Nice result - and yeah, that's a BIG bike

DD

toosahn

^^^I'll try that now

Two more complications

Complication 1: For some reason, I can't get a 27.0mm seatpost to go more than 2-3 inches into the seat-tube before I run into some serious resistance. A 26.8mm seatpost (which is what I have on right now and which is what Rich included with the bike as it was originally built with it), fits but it fits with a little tiny bit of play. I checked the diameter with a gauge at a bike shop ant it read 27.0.

Should I just keep using the 26.8 seatpost or should I try to force a 27.0mm seatpost down there?

Complication 2: The Suntour Cyclone Gt derailleur is having trouble shifting into the largest sprocket and the smallest sprocket on my 7sp Dura-Ace freewheel. I had no troubles with another 6sp Regina Freewheel I had. I've tried messing with the upper and lower trims but nothing has worked. I've tried pulling the cable taut but that didn't work. Any thoughts? Essentially, it's functioning as a 5-speed at the moment.

illwafer

you need to loosen the cable to your RD in order for it to hit the small sprocket. adjust your RD to the low limit w/o the cable. once you have it set, install the cable. unscrew the upper limit screw. you should be able to reach the large sprocket no problem.

you shouldn't use your 26.8 post if the tube is 27.0. is there an obstruction, or is a super tight fit? you might have to gently unpinch the seat clamp area with a flat head screwdriver (carefully). you might want to get the LBS involved for this one.

MetinUz

There can be a large variation among seatposts with a nominal size. If it goes down a few inches, that means the lug is not pinched. I would just try to see if another 27.0 seatpost fits.

toosahn

I did try that and it didn't work. Feels like the Super record rear derailleur I have on another bike struggling to get into the right sprocket

Puget Pounder

Once you seat the housing, you will find that the silvers offer shifting that is smoother than a baby's bottom.

If your post has trouble fitting, and you know that it is built for 27.0, you might want to ream the tube. That usually settles it. Using a post that is too small can cause the lugs to separate in some cases.

toosahn

I used a knife to whittle down the end of the cable so I could seat the step-down ferrule.

Although the shifting is perhaps smooth, it does require much more effort than any other friction setup I've used.

mapleleafs-13 

how friggin tall are you??!

toosahn

6' 3'' with very very long legs.

hueyhoolihan

as some have noted, and you are aware, all is not right with the RD housing ferrule or lack thereof. there is a special ferrule (not altogether unlike a ferrule used on brake housings) that i have on my '79 trek 710 that is supposed to go there. i don't see one on yours and the kink has got to be a problem, if not THE problem with your poor shifting and the excessive force required.

toosahn

So should I shorten the r. derailleur cabling? To get rid of the bike loop I have right now?

hueyhoolihan

i don't see the length of the RD housing to be a problem.

mtnbke

That bike is two small for you by like seven cm. Sure you like comfortable upright bars, I get that, but your relative saddle/bar height reveals you're perched on top of a frame that is much much too small. The problem with using such a too small frame is that you have to resort to inane contrivances to get the handlebars into a relatively appropriate height. You prefer bars slightly above saddle height, which only exacerbates the problem. I think you're going to talk yourself into loving that frame, but what you really need is something that fits you, and that just flat doesn't. It isn't some modern compact sloping geometry bike. You shouldn't have anything more than a fistful of post. This is like giving someone who needs a 63cm a 56cm. That is probably a great bike for someone weight/height appropriate, however, with that flexy hi-rise stem you've turned it into something low-end in terms of how it will ride for you.

Also the Velo Orange cables aren't "compromised." I'm not a huge fan of their stuff, but you're trying to use a ridiculous extension stem on a much too small for you frame (a bigger frame at that). Plus you're wanting to run big loopy curves from your barends. That's not a problem with the cables you bought, or the housing, that's a problem with your expectations about length. Your comment was a bit disingenuous. Would it be fair for me to say that the Velo Orange cables were compromised because they weren't long enough for my tandem?

Also the Silver Dia-Compe shifters that Rivendell sells aren't all they are cracked up to be, per Grant's ad copy. The thing is Grant can't sell source original Sun-Tour Accushift Bar-cons anymore, so he can't sell 'em to you. So he rewrites his dogma and ad-copy to fit what he can buy and resell. The silver shifters are what they are. There are much much better shifters available. I suggest you read some of Grant's ad-copy regarding the shifters he used to spec on Bridgestone's and his rants about the high water high yen stuff from the 80s coming out of Japan. Instead of buying Taiwanese Dia-Compe Silver shifters get some Kelly Take-Offs and mount Suntour Superbe Pro indexing shifters for poor-man's ERGO/STI.

Kobe 

It always comes back around to that thief Grant.

I love that bike, even at 6'6" I would make it fit. You may want to try tandem derailleur cables. They are only about fifty cents more and I have run them aero style inside the bar tape with no problems. As others have said I think your shifting problem lies in with the ferrule.

xB_Nutt

As others have mentioned, your poor rear shifting is due to the rear cable stop/shift cable housing interface. Measure the inside diameter of your cable stop and see if one of these will work.

https://www.universalcycles.com/shopp...461&category=7

bobbycorno

Yep. Albert's THE MAN! Too bad he's retired...

SP
Bend, OR