Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Classic & Vintage This forum is to discuss the many aspects of classic and vintage bicycles, including musclebikes, lightweights, middleweights, hi-wheelers, bone-shakers, safety bikes and much more.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 02-13-12, 04:35 PM   #1
fender1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
fender1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Berwyn PA
Bikes: I hate bikes!
Posts: 5,513
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
126mm Spacing: When did it start/When did it end?

As the title suggests, I was wondering the time range when it fell into and then out of favor? I was thinking 1976 (on higher end frames) and 1995 to the lower end?
fender1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-12, 04:36 PM   #2
ColonelJLloyd 
Senior Member
 
ColonelJLloyd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Louisville
Bikes:
Posts: 8,211
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
I thought it was more like 1979-1980. Perhaps it was earlier on higher end bikes as you suggest.


My 1977 Schwinn Volare is 120mm (actually measures 122mm)

My 1981 Schwinn Voyageur 11.8 is 126mm.

My 1988 Schwinn Voyageur was spec'd with a 3x6 drivetrain. I haven't measured the spacing but a 130mm hub slides with ease (long chain stays).

My 1990 Paramount was spec'd with 128.5mm spacing per the catalog (and that's what it measured) presumably so you could use 126mm or 130mm easily.
__________________
Bikes on Flickr
I prefer email to private messages. You can contact me at justinhughes@me.com

Last edited by ColonelJLloyd; 02-13-12 at 05:08 PM.
ColonelJLloyd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-12, 05:06 PM   #3
due ruote 
Senior Member
 
due ruote's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Bikes:
Posts: 5,351
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
My '78 Team Champion is 126, so by then even the French had caught on.
due ruote is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-12, 05:24 PM   #4
rootboy 
Senior Member
 
rootboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Wherever
Bikes:
Posts: 15,581
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 27 Post(s)
I got a set of wheels with my Frejus which I could have sworn were older, mixed Normandy and Mailliard hubs laced to Super Champion and Rigida (no hook) 27 x 1/14 inch rims respectfully, and the rear turned out to be 126, which surprised me. Which reminds me, I need a 120 axle and spacers for that Mailliard if anyone can help out. I thought the wheels must have been older than 78, but maybe not.
rootboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-12, 05:26 PM   #5
lostarchitect 
incazzare.
 
lostarchitect's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Bikes: See sig
Posts: 6,024
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 10 Post(s)
My 1964 JRJ has 126mm spacing. I doubt it was cold set, but you never know. It also has braze-ons that were not typical for the time, but I understand they were offered as options from the builder.
__________________
1964 JRJ (Bob Jackson), 1973 Wes Mason, 1974 Raleigh Gran Sport, 1986 Schwinn High Sierra, 2000ish Colian (Colin Laing), 2011 Dick Chafe, 2013 Velo Orange Pass Hunter
lostarchitect is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-12, 06:05 PM   #6
hueyhoolihan
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Above ground, Walnut Creek, Ca
Bikes: 7⃥ 9 road bikes
Posts: 6,401
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
79 and 85 trek. both with 126.
hueyhoolihan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-12, 06:12 PM   #7
due ruote 
Senior Member
 
due ruote's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Bikes:
Posts: 5,351
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by lostarchitect View Post
My 1964 JRJ has 126mm spacing. I doubt it was cold set, but you never know. It also has braze-ons that were not typical for the time, but I understand they were offered as options from the builder.
This I find surprising if it's original. When did 6 speed freewheels come into the universe? I thought later but what do I know?
due ruote is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-12, 06:13 PM   #8
vjp
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Bikes:
Posts: 2,162
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
From the bikes I have owned, 120mm until about 72/73, 126mm until about 93 or so.
vjp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-12, 06:16 PM   #9
rootboy 
Senior Member
 
rootboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Wherever
Bikes:
Posts: 15,581
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 27 Post(s)
Really? So 126 came in as early as 74? That surprises me but my old French wheels may corroborate.
rootboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-12, 06:24 PM   #10
photogravity 
Hopelessly addicted...
 
photogravity's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Central Maryland
Bikes: 1949 Hercules Kestrel, 1950 Norman Rapide, 1970 Schwinn Collegiate, 1972 Peugeot UE-8, 1976 Raleigh Sports, 1977 Raleigh Sports, 1977 Jack Taylor Tandem, 1984 Davidson Tandem, 2010 Bilenky "BQ" 650B Constructeur Tandem, 2011 Linus Mixte
Posts: 5,008
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by fender1 View Post
As the title suggests, I was wondering the time range when it fell into and then out of favor? I was thinking 1976 (on higher end frames) and 1995 to the lower end?
If this is related to the Mondia, stop asking questions, coldset the drops and install that IGH. It'll make for a fun project.

As far as 126mm spacing, I have no idea. I only know of one bicycle in my collection that has 126mm spacing - my 1985 Schwinn World Sport.
__________________
--
Ridding the world of derailleurs, one bicycle at a time.

46 Hercules Roadster, 49 Hercules Kestrel, 50 Norman Rapide, 51 Hercules Lion, 52 Hercules Windsor, 56 Hercules Royal Prince, 61 Fiorelli Tandem, 67 Carlton Super Race (IGH), 70 Schwinn Collegiate (IGH), 71 Hercules, 71 STF Hercules, 72 Peugeot PX-8 (IGH), 76 Raleigh Sports, 77 STF Raleigh Sports, 77 Jack Taylor Tandem, Early-80's Mike Appel SC, 84 Davidson Tandem, Late-80's Alpine, 10 Bilenky "BQ" Signature Tandem
photogravity is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-12, 06:26 PM   #11
PeregrineA1 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Cowan Heights, CA and Beaufort, NC
Bikes: Wizard, Eisentraut, Paramount, Litton, Colnago, Turner, Surley, Trek, Kona, Fuji, Scott, Landshark, Centurion, Hujsak, Masi
Posts: 814
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
'75 Wizard, 126 mm; '75 Eisentraut Limited 120 mm; '79 Olmo Grand Prix 124 mm; '89 Landshark 126 mm; '91 Landshark 126 mm

I have not measured my '78 Colnago Super or '85 Colnago Junior. I will when I am at their respective homes and report back.
PeregrineA1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-12, 06:31 PM   #12
rootboy 
Senior Member
 
rootboy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Wherever
Bikes:
Posts: 15,581
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 27 Post(s)
Those guys in the Olmo shop wanted to be different that day
rootboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-12, 06:40 PM   #13
PeregrineA1 
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Cowan Heights, CA and Beaufort, NC
Bikes: Wizard, Eisentraut, Paramount, Litton, Colnago, Turner, Surley, Trek, Kona, Fuji, Scott, Landshark, Centurion, Hujsak, Masi
Posts: 814
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
QC.....Maybe not! They were a precursor to the current Surly spacing of in between.
PeregrineA1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-12, 06:51 PM   #14
old's'cool 
curmudgineer
 
old's'cool's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Chicago SW burbs
Bikes: 2 many 2 fit here
Posts: 3,682
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by rootboy View Post
Which reminds me, I need a 120 axle and spacers for that Mailliard if anyone can help out. I thought the wheels must have been older than 78, but maybe not.
Sorry, I don't have anything in response to the OP that hasn't already been comprehended above, but I believe somewhere I have a 120mm Atom Normandy axle, if that is compatible. If you think it might be, I'll dig it out and take some dimensions.
__________________
Geoff
"I think that I think, therefore I think that I am"
old's'cool is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-12, 07:02 PM   #15
dbakl
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Bikes: Cinelli, Paramount, Raleigh, Carlton, Zeus, Gemniani, Frejus, Legnano, Pinarello, Falcon
Posts: 5,775
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Didn't the 1970 Raleigh Pro come with one of the earliest 6-speed freewheels?
dbakl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-12, 07:09 PM   #16
VintageRide
Senior Member
 
VintageRide's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Burnaby,B.C., Canada
Bikes: 1952 Urago " Tour De France ",late '50's/early '60's P. Peschi: Early '70's Chrome Garlatti ; 1981 Fuji S12S 650b conversion : 1985 Apollo/Kuwahara Sierra Grande: 2013 Rawland Stag 650b
Posts: 451
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
My 1977 Sabatini is 120mm and I checked a 1981 ( might be 1982 ) Rocky Mountain road frame and it was also 120mm. I really think that as the supply of 120mm hubs and 5 speed freewheels were plentiful for a few years not all builders were in a hurry to change when 126mm was establishing itself.
VintageRide is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-12, 07:13 PM   #17
Bill Kapaun
Senior Member
 
Bill Kapaun's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Mid Willamette Valley, Orygun
Bikes: 86 RockHopper,2008 Specialized Globe. Both upgraded to 9 speeds.
Posts: 9,194
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 10 Post(s)
My brothers 73ish Takara 10 speed is 126.
Bill Kapaun is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-12, 07:15 PM   #18
ColonelJLloyd 
Senior Member
 
ColonelJLloyd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Louisville
Bikes:
Posts: 8,211
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Kapaun View Post
My brothers 73ish Takara 10 speed is 126.
If it is (or was) a 10 speed then it was surely 120mm originally.
__________________
Bikes on Flickr
I prefer email to private messages. You can contact me at justinhughes@me.com
ColonelJLloyd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-12, 07:18 PM   #19
due ruote 
Senior Member
 
due ruote's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Bikes:
Posts: 5,351
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by dbakl View Post
Didn't the 1970 Raleigh Pro come with one of the earliest 6-speed freewheels?
I don't know. The retro raleighs 1970 catalog is incomplete. 1972 doesn't specify no. of cogs, but 1973 says 6 speed.
due ruote is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-12, 07:19 PM   #20
thirdgenbird
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Bikes:
Posts: 7,108
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by ColonelJLloyd View Post
My 1990 Paramount was spec'd with 128.5mm spacing per the catalog (and that's what it measured) presumably so you could use 126mm or 130mm easily.
i think my yokota is an 89 and it was 126. it is probably 128 now. my dad put a 130mm hub in it in the early 90s and it hasent had a 126mm hub since.
thirdgenbird is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-12, 07:25 PM   #21
ColonelJLloyd 
Senior Member
 
ColonelJLloyd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Louisville
Bikes:
Posts: 8,211
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by thirdgenbird View Post
i think my yokota is an 89 and it was 126. it is probably 128 now. my dad put a 130mm hub in it in the early 90s and it hasent had a 126mm hub since.
Then it's probably still 126mm. You have to spread the steel stays well beyond 2mm to change the spacing.
__________________
Bikes on Flickr
I prefer email to private messages. You can contact me at justinhughes@me.com
ColonelJLloyd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-12, 07:32 PM   #22
repechage
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Bikes:
Posts: 10,774
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 33 Post(s)
Regina made 6 speed freewheels in the 60's, but only a 13t top cog as the smallest.
The adoption of 6 speed freewheels in the pro peloton goes back to about 1970.
There was resistance, as the extra dish was known to make a weaker wheel and bending of rear axles was more common. I want to say by the Worlds in Montreal that 6 was necessary for the pros.
Local racers in SoCal were moving to 6 in back in the middle 70's. Looking for that 13t cog without sacrifice of a cog in the middle. John Howard in an interview in Competitive Cycling in '73 or '74 advised that 52t rings and 14t cogs just don't cut it. I forget the exact quote, but it gave permission to go big and plenty.
I think it was 1976 that Suntour introduced the New Winner with close cog spacing, that allowed 6 in 122 mm and 7 in 127-8 mm for most frames and hubs.
There were a few 120 mm wide frames where a 6 would not work even when spaced to 126. The stays were not relieved inside and the cog or chain would hang up.

In short, the parts were ready before the demand was there. In the mid 80's we knew 8 was coming, just as soon as Shimano or someone else went freehub, which basically solved the axle stress problem. With a typical freewheel & hub the 8 block just placed too much force on the hub bearing that was now almost in the center of the dropouts.
repechage is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-12, 07:37 PM   #23
repechage
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Bikes:
Posts: 10,774
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 33 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by due ruote View Post
I don't know. The retro raleighs 1970 catalog is incomplete. 1972 doesn't specify no. of cogs, but 1973 says 6 speed.
Raleigh interestingly was an early adopter of 6 in back as a "production" builder, even if just for the top end bikes. The type of rider on these bikes often had problems, bending axles, the rider's just did not have finesse, and did not raise their weight off the saddle just before and during a visible bump in the road. We retrograded many a Pro for these big customers, improving the dish, degrading the chain line, and providing a stronger wheel with better axle loading.
repechage is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-12, 07:40 PM   #24
thirdgenbird
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Bikes:
Posts: 7,108
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by ColonelJLloyd View Post
Then it's probably still 126mm. You have to spread the steel stays well beyond 2mm to change the spacing.
maybe it was 128mm to begin with then. a 130mm wheels slides in this frame much better than other 126mm frames ive had.
thirdgenbird is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-12, 07:44 PM   #25
ColonelJLloyd 
Senior Member
 
ColonelJLloyd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Louisville
Bikes:
Posts: 8,211
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by thirdgenbird View Post
maybe it was 128mm to begin with then. a 130mm wheels slides in this frame much better than other 126mm frames ive had.
Given the year, that's plausible.
__________________
Bikes on Flickr
I prefer email to private messages. You can contact me at justinhughes@me.com
ColonelJLloyd is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:27 PM.