rhm

That's a crazy build. I'm going to have to try one of those fixed hubs one of these days... but backwards? Hmmm...

Dan Burkhart 

I've been considering trying one with left drive myself. There is no drive torque on the ball ring with this hub, so it might be doable.

mparker326

I thought the buy it now price on the bike was pretty fair. Considering the ASC hubs sell for ~300 or 400. The Brooks was worth 50 or so. So that was $450 without the value of the frame & the rest of the components.

@rhm, I'm running the new S3X and it is a hoot to ride. You get the fun of a fixed gear without the chore of being in the wrong gear most of the time.

Velognome 

I'd just like to have an asc hub! I'd build it into a wheel, give it a Hetchins or a Bates, care for it, feed it oil, and wipe it's little spout when it dribbles.

rhm

Pardon my bumping this old old thread, but....

The temptation to try the S3X is getting too strong for me to resist much longer!

One thing that puzzles me, though, is the available cog selection. Ebay for example finds Sturmey Archer cogs only in 13T which I'm sure would be too small for me. I'm not even sure what bike this wheel would go on. But I'm pretty sure I'll be wanting a cog around 16T or 17T. Have you guys used Shimano and other makes of cogs? I read somewhere that Surly cogs work, but they aren't cheap. I prefer cheap.

photogravity

According to the Sturmey Archer site:
I'm not sure why there would be a difference, but it appears it takes a threaded driver. If so, you can get them in lots of different sizes all the way up to 22t. Perhaps velognome can confirm that it's a threaded driver.

rhm

The driver is both threaded and splined:



It is made for a splined cog with splined spacers and a threaded lockring. Apparently you can screw a track cog onto the driver as well, as long as there's a splined spacer separating it from the lockring.

BMX hubs also use splined cogs; but I read somewhere that not all splined cogs have the same shape. So my question is, what cogs work, and what it takes to make a poorly fitting cog fit better.

jrecoi

I was under the impression that the S3X took Shimano cassette spline cogs, and that these were locked by a freewheel threaded lockring. If this is indeed the case, then Surly makes cogs up to 22 tooth that will fit.

photogravity

I see what you're saying. I'd just try to use a threaded cog. I'd be willing to guess that you've got plenty laying around from those old SA hubs you've collected over the years. WRT, the 9-splined cog question, I have no idea so I'll leave that to someone who has better insight on the matter.

rhm

Good point, I do have a few old SA threaded cogs. Unfortunately they are all mounted to old SA threaded drivers and I have so far failed to separate any of them! I also have some Shimano cassettes. If I can try out individual cogs from those to find just the right one, that'll be nice.

JohnDThompson 

Sturmey Archer makes other sizes, and in fact even the old, dished 3-spline SA cogs will work on the S3X. Or you can thread a track cog on the driver as another option. SA supplies splined spacers with the S3X, so if you place one of those between the cog and the lockring, no torque can be transferred to the lockring and no risk of "suicide hub" where the lockring loosens from back pressure on the cog. Here's a 15T track cog mounted on an S3X hub, which I rode in that configuration all last winter:

mparker326

What gearing are you trying to achieve? I am running the 13T with a 42 ring up front and I am quite happy with it. I use my 2nd gear which is mid 60's as my normal gear, the 1st gear in the 50's is my bail out gear, and the 3rd gear in the 80's is my go fast/down hill gear.

photogravity

Yeah, I know what you're saying. I broke my chainwhip trying to remove a threaded cog. Crazy, huh? In a conversation with Jon Sharrat, he indicated that he prefers threaded drivers and that he gets them off with the entire wheel in place. I'll drop him a line and see what he does to get them off with the driver attached to the wheel.

rhm

Good question!

This wheel will be going on one of two bikes, one currently running an AW with 48/18?, the other running an S5 with 45/21?. Question marks because I'm not too sure what cog is on either bike. I haven't ridden fixed before, so don't know whether I'll want to replicate the existing gearing or to go a bit higher or lower.

Ah, that is very good to know. I have a goodish supply of 3-spline cogs.

Little by little my Lambert is getting more like your Viscount!

Dan Burkhart 

9 spline SA cogs are available in one tooth increments from 12 to 22 in both 3/32" and 1/8". The only exception is the 12 tooth, available in 3/32" only. UBS shows all sizes in stock.

Velognome 

Rhm, mine takes a splined cog with a threaded lock ring and there are plenty out there, I've seen them on eBay from $1.99, the nice ones with machined edges are a bit more but I think worth it since starts and stops really take some torque. Anyway, would make a perfect hub for a spicey city commute. I find myself really enjoying riding in traffic with the setup.

rhm

Andrew, tell me more, please.

Hey, here is a fairly straightforward question. Sez I.

If I have a bike set up with an AW and like the gear range I have on it, whatever it is, and am converting it to an s3x hub. Would you gear the S3X the same as the AW, or higher, or lower? I can think of reasonable rationale for any of the three... but what do I know.

At any rate, I ordered one. But I did not order a cog. Yet.

Velognome 

I think a 16 comes in the box? (or not)

At any rate, regarding the gearing and AW/S3x? My AW's are all built into 590 wheels and the s3x is in a 700 but running a chubby 32mm tire so it's hard to compare or even speculate. I ride the bikes very differently too. Mine is set up to ride in H with the N as heavy traffic & mild climbs and L as my bailout.

To maybe answer your question my cadence is higher than on a bike that freewheels.

I can tell you, in the begining everything felt wrong, too high and I'd default into mid-range which isn't the 1:1 and I swore I could fell the ratio and the drift (rotational slack) seemed huge. Too low and I spun out on every hill, long mild grades were the worst....I wanted to go but there was no more! After a few months of daily riding, I settled into a 46x16 which is perfect for me, I top out around 25mph in H and can climb a wall in L. Being fixed the bike has a natural speed limitation and I'm comfortable where it is. Would not be a problem to ride a Century or more along the Coast or Peidmont, climbs are not as much an issue as descents. I'm approaching 3 years of almost daily riding and unless I look for it, the slack is not noticable at all, rather I use it to initiate a shift or my body naturally picks up on it as I transition from forward torque/dead spin/braking torque. It's just fun to ride and I think it's made me a better rider, more attentive any way.

Yea....this doesn't help, does it? What bike is it for?

Dan Burkhart 

That may depend on the retailer. Some will put packages together to include cogs. From the distributor, a cog is not included with this hub.

JohnDThompson 

The AW and S3X are geared quite differently. AW ratios are 0.75, 1.0, and 1.33 but the S3X ratios are 0.625, 0.75, and 1.0

mparker326

I live in a hilly area. I loved riding fixed and had settled in with a main gear at around 70, but preferred mid 60. The 70 gear would eventually start hurting my knees, but the 65 would spin me out too much going down hills. I basically wanted a higher gear and a lower gear in addition to my preferred 65 gear inch. So I ride mine with the .75 gear as being my primary gear, the 1.0 gear as my downhill and the .625 as my uphill. On my AW's, I prefer a 2nd gear around 60.

Since you have never ridden fixed before, I'd just set up a hub with a track cog on it and settle in on what you like as your basic gear first before you decide on what additional gears you want with the S3X.

JohnDThompson 

That's how I set mine up as well, with 48 x 14 chainring and cog.

Velognome 

Cool, the owner of our LBS is more generous than I thought, not only did he throw in the cog, but apprently swapped out the thumb shifter for a bar end or me

rhm

Okay, so I checked the current gearing on my Lambert. 48T chain ring with 19T cog for 50.7, 67.6, and 90.1 gear inches.

This bike lives on Long Island, where it is pretty flat. My favorite rides here are a metric century with only some gentle hills and an imperial century that has some fairly steep, but short, hills. I have to stand up to get up one or two of those, but don't have to walk. At the beginning of that ride I'm usually cruising in the higher gears, but by the time I get home I am constantly switching back and forth between first and second, not happy with either. So I'm thinking John's 48T / 14T combination will work for me all right, with 57.3, 68.8 and 91.7 gear inches.

Thanks, guys! I'm getting impatient to try this thang.

Face Palm

FWIW I thought I'd chime in. I have an S3X, and I do really like the hub. After I got it dialed in, it shifts smoothly and reliably, and is much quieter than I expected.

I'm currently set up for 71.4, 53.5, and 44.6 gear inches on the S3X. As others have found, keeping 3rd gear as direct drive - the way SA designed it - means that 1st gear rarely gets utilized. Perhaps I should find hillier places to ride, but barring that, I've been thinking of doing as previously mentioned in this thread and setting it up with 2nd gear as my primary, for something like 58/70/93, or perhaps a little lower. Might mean trouble if I encounter bigger than normal hills, but would make the hub much more useful overall. In general, it would be nice if 1st and 2nd gears were geared a little further apart from each other, but you get used to it.

As an aside, some knee issues have me using the hub with a freewheel right now. It's great that the threads allow this flexibility (though if you only want to freewheel, other SA hubs are cheaper). Not all freewheels fit correctly (some Shimanos can't get far enough down on the threads), but most English thread BMX freewheels fit just fine. And the hub works as good with the freewheel as with a fixed cog.