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  1. #1
    Holy crip he's a crapple
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    Modernizing a vintage ride dilemma

    Lets say I just bought most of a Dura-Ace 7700 9spd group for $130.

    (no cassette, chain, or crankset)
    But I also got a very light carbon 700c 18 spoke front wheel + tire for that price (Velomax Ascent).

    Let's also say I have 2 bikes, and can't decide which one to throw these parts onto.

    One - fits me damn near perfectly. 1980's KHS Competition 10-speed that I converted to 7 in the rear when I replaced the freewheel. It currently has bar-end shifters, suntour cyclone derailleur's (super light), sugina mighty double crankset, and crappy 27" alloy wheel/tire in the front, and a crappy 700x35c reflective Michelin city tire setup in the back.

    The other, a 1985 Centurion Ironman that is completely original, dark metallic grey paint, full shimano 600 group set in perfect condition, downtube shifters, 700c wheels with 600 hubs, etc.

    The KHS is 68cm, and the Ironman is 62cm. I'm 6'5".

    I ride the KHS everyday to work, the Ironman I just use on the weekends if I go on a longer ride as it's a much faster and lighter bike, and the skinnier tires on it are more prone to flats which would make me late for work.

    I have a feeling that throwing these DA parts at the KHS will transform it.

    Would I hurt the value of the ironman by swapping out it's original 600 parts for more modern DA?

    I would have to find a rear wheel, spread the frame, and buy a cassette/crankset to get the full use out of this groupset on either bike I imagine, right? Both my bikes right now have 7spd freewheels. I would also need some cable stops for the ironman to change from downtube shift.

    Would I be able to use all of the current 7spd gears if I just slapped these shifters onto either bike?
    2012 Trek Madone 5.2 64cm - 1984 68cm KHS 9spd/sti swapped to DA 7700
    2013 Trek Rumblefish Elite 23" - 2004 Santa Cruz Bullitt 21.5"

  2. #2
    Senior Member JAG410's Avatar
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    Move the Ironman drivetrain to the KHS. Put the DA stuff on the Ironman.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blind View Post
    Would I hurt the value of the ironman by swapping out it's original 600 parts for more modern DA?
    Not if you keep the 600 parts. You can always put them back on if/when you go to sell it. Just make sure you keep ALL the parts together. I'm still cursing myself for loosing a couple of parts from my old Campy group.

  4. #4
    Senior Member Richard Cranium's Avatar
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    Turn the Ironman into a "city bike" with flat bars and use a stem with some vertical throw......

    Only one of these bikes fits you.
    Sorry about my comments - I thought you wanted honest feedback.
    2003 Lemond Wayzata - 2002 LeMond Malliot Jeune

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Cranium View Post
    Only one of these bikes fits you.
    +1

    I would update the Ironman and keep the 600 group together in a safe place. As for value, my thought is that you will increase the value of the bike by upgrading to DA. Most of the bike riding public would see a semi-modern DA STI group as much more valuable than the old school DT shifting 600 group.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Cranium View Post
    Turn the Ironman into a "city bike" with flat bars and use a stem with some vertical throw......
    Ewwww...
    Regards,
    Chuck

    Demain, on roule!

  7. #7
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    N+1 will solve your dilemma. Buy another frame and put the parts on it.

  8. #8
    Holy crip he's a crapple
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    Quote Originally Posted by seypat View Post
    N+1 will solve your dilemma. Buy another frame and put the parts on it.
    I like that idea, but it's much easier to say 'just buy another frame' than it is to actually find something properly sized for someone that's 6'5" and in good enough condition that I would consider riding it.


    I think what I'm going to do is just leave the ironman as it is, as it already rides great, and try these parts out on the KHS.

    Maybe move my bar-end shifters over to the ironman to make it nicer to shift.
    2012 Trek Madone 5.2 64cm - 1984 68cm KHS 9spd/sti swapped to DA 7700
    2013 Trek Rumblefish Elite 23" - 2004 Santa Cruz Bullitt 21.5"

  9. #9
    Wookie Jesus inspires me. Puget Pounder's Avatar
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    62cm vs 68cm is a pretty drastic size difference. Which one fits you better?

  10. #10
    Holy crip he's a crapple
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    the 68 of course. The ironman has a longer seatpost and the seat is a good 1-2" over the stem (both set to min insert depth). With a taller stem it would be more comfortable but it feels fine riding it, I just am leaned over more (more aero!).

    this is what my haul looked like when I got it home, btw



    also got a set of alloy drop bars and 2x titanium water bottle holders.
    2012 Trek Madone 5.2 64cm - 1984 68cm KHS 9spd/sti swapped to DA 7700
    2013 Trek Rumblefish Elite 23" - 2004 Santa Cruz Bullitt 21.5"

  11. #11
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    I hadn't thought about the quantity of bikes out there in your size. So I went to ebay thinking "how hard can it be?" Harder than I thought.

    However, this 68cm Bob Jackson came up. It might be worth investigating, seeing if the measurements are correct and seeing if it would work for you. You could put your group on it and sell the other stuff.

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/Bob-Jackson-...item3cc5afe185

    There is also a 68cm Raleigh Super Grand Prix on there as well. But the price is high.
    Last edited by seypat; 05-01-12 at 01:41 PM.

  12. #12
    Holy crip he's a crapple
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    Quote Originally Posted by seypat View Post
    I hadn't thought about the quantity of bikes out there in your size. So I went to ebay thinking "how hard can it be?" Harder than I thought.

    However, this 68cm Bob Jackson came up. It might be worth investigating, seeing if the measurements are correct and seeing if it would work for you. You could put your group on it and sell the other stuff.

    http://www.ebay.com/itm/Bob-Jackson-...item3cc5afe185

    There is also a 68cm Raleigh Super Grand Prix on there as well. But the price is high.
    the raleigh looks like it's trash to me, rusted chips and scratches all over, and yeah way out of a realistic price.

    that BJ looks decent and I'll keep it on my watch list to see how it goes. But really there's nothing about it that looks better than my KHS, I'm more of a fan of blue than orange. The geometry looks very similar.



    I just need to figure out how to mount the dura-ace brake calipers on my frame which was intended for 27" wheels. In that picture I wasn't running a rear brake yet but I managed to find a long reach diacompe that worked over the 700x35 tire. The brakes work fine so I'll probably leave the calipers.

    I can't find my info if the 9spd DA shifters will index properly with my 7spd freewheel, but I guess there's one way to find out.
    2012 Trek Madone 5.2 64cm - 1984 68cm KHS 9spd/sti swapped to DA 7700
    2013 Trek Rumblefish Elite 23" - 2004 Santa Cruz Bullitt 21.5"

  13. #13
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    You should be able to find the answer to the shifter/freewheel question by doing a search on the forum.

  14. #14
    Senior Member Der_Kruscher's Avatar
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    You got a killer deal on that stuff! The 9spd shifters are my favorite ergonomically and I'm sure that you know this, but they have lots of fans and can fetch quite a bit of money on their own. A little clarification on the Velomax wheel - it's an aluminum rim, not carbon...still nice though and plenty light! Better braking than carbon too and no worries about melting your rim or blowing up tires on descents. Also, those water bottle cages are probably stainless - they appear to be the Blackburn/Peformance ones which look like Ti due to the bead blasted finish. Magnets don't really stick to stainless but if you throw them on a scale it'll probably tell you one way or another - stainless ones weigh in between 40-50g or so and the Ti ones weigh in the low 20 range (if I remember correctly). I actually prefer the way the stainless cages look on a steel bike as the diameter of the Ti ones looks a bit fat on skinny steel tubes. Anyway, sorry for the divergence and definitely not trying to diminish your score - believe me, I'm jealous!

  15. #15
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    I doubt that the 9sp shifters will properly shift a 7sp cassette. The cog spacing on a 7sp vs a 9sp is greater. So a 7sp shifter will pull more cable for a single shift than a 9sp shifter.

  16. #16
    Holy crip he's a crapple
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    Quote Originally Posted by Der_Kruscher View Post
    You got a killer deal on that stuff! The 9spd shifters are my favorite ergonomically and I'm sure that you know this, but they have lots of fans and can fetch quite a bit of money on their own. A little clarification on the Velomax wheel - it's an aluminum rim, not carbon...still nice though and plenty light! Better braking than carbon too and no worries about melting your rim or blowing up tires on descents. Also, those water bottle cages are probably stainless - they appear to be the Blackburn/Peformance ones which look like Ti due to the bead blasted finish. Magnets don't really stick to stainless but if you throw them on a scale it'll probably tell you one way or another - stainless ones weigh in between 40-50g or so and the Ti ones weigh in the low 20 range (if I remember correctly). I actually prefer the way the stainless cages look on a steel bike as the diameter of the Ti ones looks a bit fat on skinny steel tubes. Anyway, sorry for the divergence and definitely not trying to diminish your score - believe me, I'm jealous!
    odd, the seller told me it was a carbon wheel and the bottle holders are titanium. I guess he didn't know? Now that you mention it the brake surface on the wheel does look like alloy, just the bit that covers the nipples looks carbon.
    2012 Trek Madone 5.2 64cm - 1984 68cm KHS 9spd/sti swapped to DA 7700
    2013 Trek Rumblefish Elite 23" - 2004 Santa Cruz Bullitt 21.5"

  17. #17
    Senior Member Der_Kruscher's Avatar
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    I'm sure that both were honest mistakes and you still did awesome - the shifters alone are worth what you paid or more. Velomax only ever made aluminum rimmed wheels (that I know of). Easton bought them out a few years ago and now makes carbon hoops. Regarding the bottle cages - I worked in a bike shop for awhile and even the shop employees would get confused. This includes my former boss who should have known. Ah well, between the two cages you've got something like 40g more than if they were Ti...a negligible difference.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blind View Post
    odd, the seller told me it was a carbon wheel and the bottle holders are titanium. I guess he didn't know? Now that you mention it the brake surface on the wheel does look like alloy, just the bit that covers the nipples looks carbon.

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