Phil_gretz

I'm certain that one of our C&V experts will have experience with this.

I have this SunTour Cyclone derailleur, Series 1700 - medium cage, that's specified at 24T cog size, but I going to try it with a 14-28T 6-speed. The Disraeli Gears page is this:

https://www.disraeligears.co.uk/Site/...281700%29.html

If you'll go to the page, there's a note:

"Maximum cog: 24 teeth (hanger 29mm or less) or 28 teeth (hanger 32mm or more) (Source: SunTour)" and here's the question. My hanger (integral to the forged dropout on my 1982 Fuji Team) measures roughly 30mm with my digital calipers. That's center-to-center from my mounted axle to the center of the current ARx derailleur mounting hex bolt.

So, it's not quite 32mm, but close.

Short of trying it to see, do any of you have experience using the Cyclone (not GT) with a 28T max cog?

Thanks,
Phil

Doohickie

No, but... if you already have the 28T freewheel, just try it.

DiegoFrogs

I suspect that'll work just fine with some adjustment.

Orrery

I tried it but couldn't get it to work well. It was clipping on the largest cog even when I had the B screw tightened all the way. Maybe you can get it to work though!

Edit: I am pretty sure I was using the 'medium' cage and not the 'short cage' variant.

ColonelJLloyd 

I've never heard them referred to as "medium cage", but rather "short cage". Anyhow, I'm using one on my '77 Volare. I was aware of the published limitations and my RD has a very, very strong return spring. It's the strongest of any RD I've had. I decided to pair it with a 13-26t Suntour 6sp Ultra freewheel and a 52/42 Sugino Maxy. It shifts into the 26t cog without incident, but on a steep climb out of the saddle, the Retrofriction shifters have trouble holding it there. They really would be just about the perfect friction shifter were they equipped with D-rings to adjust on the fly.

Phil_gretz

I don't [technically] have the derailleur yet, but will in a few days. I'm hoping that by adjusting the axle position and the B-screw, I can make it work. Also, this model has a slightly longer neck than its older twin brother, so that may help.

I've ridden 13-26T before with 52-42 up front, and that didn't give a very low gear for long climbs. I may have to go that route on this bike, though.

The stock crankset is 53 42, so I know that I could live with the 26T if need be.

The ARx has plenty if clearance for the 28T, by the way...

Phil_gretz

So, I'm going to attempt the swap AFTER weekend rides on the bike. Then I will post photos and results of having tried every trick I can to make it work. Let's hope....

MrEss

On my Atala, my Cyclone Mk-II short cage derailleur has no problem shifting up onto my 30t rear cog. Not quite the same derailleur, but I imagine the geometry is quite similar.

In fact, with the B-screw set totally loose (like, the same as if you unscrewed it completely and removed it), the top pivot never even moves as it shifts across my 13-30 cassette. Makes me wonder why this derailleur even has a top pivot.

JohnDThompson 

On derailleurs with unsprung upper pivots like the SunTour, the top pivot is there so the derailleur can be moved out of the way when removing or installing the wheel.

balindamood

One option is to back the B-screw out and screw it in from the back-side (so the screw head rests on the dropout. I have had success getting an new Ultegra derailleur to swallow a 32-tooth cog and a couple of Shimano Deore DX's to track onto 34-tooth cogs by doing this.

pcb 

Good one! I now know of 6 get-around max cog limitation methods:

1. If you have horizontal drops, pull the wheel back as far as possible
2. Screw B-screw in all the way; if that doesn't work try:
3. Get a longer B-screw and screw it in further; if that doesn't work try:
4. Reverse B-screw, thread in from other side (thanks balindamood!) [Maybe I remember trying this, and on some rders the screw head can't clear the der body?]
5. Locate a 9t upper/guide pulley, SunTour offered these as a

Lastly, if all else fails, get a real touring or ATB-era rder and be done with it...

Phil_gretz

Thanks. The frame came with one of those bolt-in dropout spacer things that places the rear axle forward about 1cm or so. I will be removing that as an option to get the axle back farther. I appreciate the encouragement and we'll see if it'll work. PG

ColonelJLloyd 

How does this affect shifting on the smallest cogs, i.e. 11t?

balindamood

Seems to work fine.

MrEss

I have found that it works OK, as balindamood says. It's not great, though; obviously it means that the jockey wheel will be further away from the smaller cogs.

When I realized I wasn't using very much total chain wrap (11-30 cassette, 36/46 double), I upgraded from a Cyclone Mk II GT (long cage) to a Cyclone Mk II (short cage). This brought the jockey wheel up a lot closer to the cogs, which made shifting a bit faster and quieter.

It shifted fine before the swap, but it was just a bit nicer and more refined afterward. I'd imagine you'd have the reverse when you pull the jockey wheel further out with the b-screw trick.... it should work just fine, but a bit sloppier and not as nice feeling.

ThermionicScott 

How about switching to a 39T or 40T inner ring? 39/26 would be the same gearing as 42/28.

wrk101

+1 Depending on the crankset, my favorite gear easing technique is to replace the chain rings with rings off a donor mtb; something like 47/35 or similar. I keep an eye out for 110BCD rings and MTB donors for just this purpose. I've done this change on several bikes.

Phil_gretz

I don't have my camera (memory card taken by 19-year old daughter), but I'll try to post a photo or two tomorrow. The install was an easy swap (Cyclone for ARx), and I could leave the B-screw basically "out" in the dis-engaged position.

If I number gears 1-6 on the small chainring and 7-12 on the large, I have to be careful not to cross chain (6 and 7), because there's just barely enough chain in 7 and too much in 6 for the small Cyclone derailleur pulley mechanism to handle. However, in 5 and 8, it runs smoothly. I wound up adding one link to my chain to make it fit just right. I also removed the rear drive side dropout spacer thing, so that I could seat the axle at the rearmost position in the dropout.

Some adjustments of the high and low screw, attach and snug cable, and go.

I rode it ~38 miles after church today as a shakedown, including some hills. Everything worked smashingly. With PowerShifters on the down tube, the whole shifting experience is quite pleasant.

Finally, my stock chainrings are 53-42, and my freewheel is 14-28, so the combination is beneath the rated 26 max for the Cyclone. Thanks all for the encouragement, and I will post photos tomorrow.

Phil

1 Lugnut

I run a 2nd generation Dura Ace Crank (53-39) to a 12-26 Regina America freewheel w/ a Cyclone RD on my Mondia. It shifts flawlessly, esp going from the 39 ring to the 53. I'll be darned if you can even hear it shift when it picks up the chain. It always amazed how smooth this setup actually shifts when compared to other bikes I have w/ Ergopower shifting. No problems when shifting the RD either. I believe the chain is a Sedis...

It's actually an 8-sp freewheel, but I don't use the 12-tooth cog since the Accushift Index DT shifters are only 7-sp....