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  1. #1
    Senior Member Lenton58's Avatar
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    Will This Proposed Transmission Work?

    Will this proposed transmission work? I'd like your opinion

    I am collecting pieces for my Woodrup (Reynolds 531c) built by Mr. Kevin Sayles as a sports-tourer, 73 degree angles.

    Hub and Wheelset:
    New Ultegra (130 mm/freehub)

    Crankset:
    NOS Tricolor 600/Utegra, 170, 52/39 (currently has 42 inner) 130 BCD (I hope that a 39T will be easy to find — like over the counter).

    Shifters:
    New (current production) Shimano FS-400 DT (braze-on) — INDEXED ONLY, no friction option

    FD:
    Vintage Dura Ace — (can't get the number right now)

    RD:
    * OPTION (A): RD-M650 Deore DX; long cage
    ** OPTION (B): RD-6208 600EX (SIS)

    Cassette:
    8 speed CS-HG50-8 suffix 'V'; 13T-26T ... 13,14,15,17,19,21,23,26

    REMARKS

    (1)
    It looks like I am good to go with RD option (B). Not so sure about smooth shifting with option (A).

    (2)
    One encouraging bit about option (A): I have a build that currently uses a SunTour indexed FS on a modern production Shimano 6 speed (14T-28T ) freewheel. It changes on an MTB SunTour XC RD. Shifting is not perfect on every cog, but it is sufficient, except that I have to trim a Sugino 75 FD at the extreme ends.

    (3)
    You can see that my stuffs are Franken-builds, but that is because of budgets and the constraints around the rarity of vintage parts in this part of Japan. Also the expense and hassle of importing. Not that this is exceptional among a lot of BF members, I'm sure. I am not a purist-collector. My bikes are used to keep healthy and fit — plus I just downright love cycling and bicycles. Each build has a specific purpose. This proposed transmission above is intended for wide range ratios to be used for commuting and light-weight touring. I hope that members will offer their opinion.

    (4)
    I'd like to do perfect group-set builds, but until I win the jackpot, the deal remains thus: as long as it does not look dork-like and vintage-heretical, and as long as it works — OK!

    WHEW! Just had another quake here ... but nothing has fallen down!
    Last edited by Lenton58; 08-30-12 at 11:14 AM.
    Me: I've learned a lot about cycling by my mistakes, and I can repeat them perfectly! My Bikes: Vitus-979, Simplon-4-Star, Gazelle-AB, Woodrup

  2. #2
    MIKE is my name! puchfinnland's Avatar
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    have you checked the frame spacing is 130mm?

    you may need to reset the dropouts to fit.
    My name is Michael, and I am a recovering bike addict, It has been 11 months since I purchased a bicycle for myself..
    (Im bound to fall off the wagon again, its just a matter of time)
    Lord help me!

    "Some cream crackers, a glue *** and a little imagination can turn any domestic cat into a fearsome Stegosaurus."

  3. #3
    Senior Member AZORCH's Avatar
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    I like the 600 RD with the config you're describing. The Deore may be the better option though if you drop to a 39t inner. I'm doing this from memory though, so I recommend checking Velo-base to be sure.
    The Early Morning Cyclist: marksbikes.wordpress.com
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  4. #4
    Bianchi Goddess Bianchigirll's Avatar
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    Some older DA only worked with DA shifters.
    Bianchis '87 Sport SX, '90 Proto, '90 Campione del Fausto Giamondi Specialisma Italiano Mundo, '91 Boarala 'cross, '93 Project 3, '86 Volpe, '97 Ti Megatube, , '90 something Vento 603,

    Others but still loved,; '80 RIGI, '80 Batavus Professional, '87 Cornelo, '09 Motobecane SS, '?? Jane Doe (still on the drawing board), '90ish Haro Escape

  5. #5
    likes to ride an old bike
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    According to what is written online about shimano indexing, yes. Should not even need the long cage. For added safety get friction capable shifters instead.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Lenton58's Avatar
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    puchfinnland:
    have you checked the frame spacing is 130mm? you may need to reset the dropouts to fit.
    I had a local frame-builder (Matsumoto-san of AMVNA) check out the entire frame. The stays were reset at 130 mm, and the drop outs aligned. Curiously, the stays were found to be 135 — MTB spacing.

    AZORCH:
    ... I recommend checking Velo-base to be sure
    The comments on Velobase were interesting. Contributers said that there was enough travel for 7 and 8 speed. And the specification is for 26T as the biggest cog. The only remaining question is whether it will shift from a 39 ring.

    Bianchigirll:
    Some older DA only worked with DA shifters
    Hmmm — I guess that this will be an experiment.

    MrEss:
    For added safety get friction capable shifters instead.
    My first choice for a new over the counter item would have been the 105 shifters which had a both friction and indexing options. But it seems that Shimano has discontinued them since I last looked at the catalogue. Only the off-group FS-400 is still available and it is index only. I have a set of Dia-Compe on order for another build (5 or 6-speed). The FS-400 was sitting right on the shelf at the LBS, so on impulse I snagged it.

    I've been using vintage shifters on all my multi-speed bikes. Some work well, some OK, some are a bit of a PITA. To negate any hassles with worn shims and so on, I thought of getting new ones — future insurance. My veteran shifters are not going anywhere anyway.

    Thanks for your input. I'll put a note up here when I get everything in a pile and then assembled.
    Me: I've learned a lot about cycling by my mistakes, and I can repeat them perfectly! My Bikes: Vitus-979, Simplon-4-Star, Gazelle-AB, Woodrup

  7. #7
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    Kevin Sayles.

  8. #8
    Senior Member zukahn1's Avatar
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    Sounds like a pretty interesting and solid build plan. One potential issue I see from experience is getting everything to clear everything running a 8 speed cassette on a older frame you may be into the chain stays on the small gear, but with a little tweaking in the spacing you should be able to get it to fit. I have managed to get a 9speed Dura ace and 52/38 on my old Jeunet which is a tighter fit.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Lenton58's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zukahn1 View Post
    Sounds like a pretty interesting and solid build plan. One potential issue I see from experience is getting everything to clear everything running a 8 speed cassette on a older frame you may be into the chain stays on the small gear ...
    I think I am OK. By rights, this bike should not even be on C&V. It's a retro design, but it was built in '96 ... the era of 8 speed. And I suspect that it was originally fitted with a three ring front and a mountain cassette. I got it as a frame-set only, so this is all just conjecture. Thanks for the warning, but I'll be gobsmacked if I'm banging on the chain-stay. We'll see
    Me: I've learned a lot about cycling by my mistakes, and I can repeat them perfectly! My Bikes: Vitus-979, Simplon-4-Star, Gazelle-AB, Woodrup

  10. #10
    Senior Member Lenton58's Avatar
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    Thanks Otis! I have edited my post. I don't know how could have confused the name. BTW, I'll enjoyed trawling the link and catching up on your brilliant work.

    (Edited Aug.31,'12)
    Last edited by Lenton58; 08-30-12 at 11:18 AM.
    Me: I've learned a lot about cycling by my mistakes, and I can repeat them perfectly! My Bikes: Vitus-979, Simplon-4-Star, Gazelle-AB, Woodrup

  11. #11
    Senior Member zukahn1's Avatar
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    Sounds good I thought you where dealing with a much older frame.

  12. #12
    hi YoKev's Avatar
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    sounds good

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