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-   -   Just bought a classic Pinarello - where do I start... (http://www.bikeforums.net/classic-vintage/877945-just-bought-classic-pinarello-where-do-i-start.html)

runningDoc 03-15-13 07:06 AM

go to the grocery store/hardware store and buy a box of these to clean the frame with:

http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m7...6s44o1_500.jpg

for first sponge(s) use diluted soapy water (dishwashing liquid). you'll be amazed at the grime that comes off. even things that look like scratches are just caked oil/mud and will come off. for the 2nd sweep just use whetted sponge(s) with water. After that wipe down with a dry rag. Then you can do a waxing for protection extra shine.

fiataccompli 03-15-13 07:36 AM

good advice. I see a lot of folks really eager to put in a ton of time/energy/paint/etc. on a bike that once they ride they may figure out they don't really like. Obviously if putting any miles on it, it's wise to repack all spinning/turning areas, but otherwise bikes are ideal for "rolling restoration" projects. Enjoy.

Seweryn 03-15-13 07:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by runningDoc (Post 15389464)
go to the grocery store/hardware store and buy a box of these to clean the frame with:

for first sponge(s) use diluted soapy water (dishwashing liquid). you'll be amazed at the grime that comes off. even things that look like scratches are just caked oil/mud and will come off. for the 2nd sweep just use whetted sponge(s) with water. After that wipe down with a dry rag. Then you can do a waxing for protection extra shine.

Sounds great, however I am not sure if I can get this stuff locally, but will soon find out ;).


Quote:

Originally Posted by SJX426 (Post 15389286)
I expereinced the same thoughts when I bought my Colnago. The suggestions are valid! I followed them and am satisfied.
I took all the componants off the frame, cleaned lubed them all. I had rust on the chrome and had some concern about it. I dipped the fork and head tube in a solution of Oxalic acid for 24 hours which took care of the rust. I just cleaned it up with wax and reassembled. I have tons of pictures on PhotoBucket if you are interested is seeing before and after pics. The CU in the titles means "Cleaned Up". there are some close ups of the fork crown with the rust on the edges of the "C" and clover. The results were satisfying enough. I have not touched up any of the frame scratches yet (seperate album) because the Testors is not quite the right hue.
Pinarello is on my wish list for N+1 bikes, as are other Italian steeds. Great looking bike and enjoy the ride!

http://s985.photobucket.com/albums/a...20Superissimo/

That looks very impressive! Thank you for sharing your experience. The bike looks fantastic :thumb:.

Seweryn 03-15-13 07:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fiataccompli (Post 15389565)
good advice. I see a lot of folks really eager to put in a ton of time/energy/paint/etc. on a bike that once they ride they may figure out they don't really like. Obviously if putting any miles on it, it's wise to repack all spinning/turning areas, but otherwise bikes are ideal for "rolling restoration" projects. Enjoy.

Thank you, that is a very valid point :thumb:.

tarwheel 03-15-13 10:06 AM

Simichrome polish and very fine steel wool are great for removing rust on chrome. Personally, I would remove the old decals. If you want to replace them, you should be able to find replacements on eBay.

Seweryn 03-15-13 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tarwheel (Post 15390182)
Simichrome polish and very fine steel wool are great for removing rust on chrome. Personally, I would remove the old decals. If you want to replace them, you should be able to find replacements on eBay.

Thanks. Not an exact match, but they are there.

Old Yeller 03-15-13 12:21 PM

[QUOTE=Seweryn;15388934]I have to say Old Yeller, the final result is excellent! Would you mind to simply explain how you got this frame restored so well? Obviously, you got a new set of decals, am I right? Looks brilliant!

OK, time to ride my bike now (not the new beauty, but my everyday one), as I commute to work. I will post later and will get the bike on the road very shortly :).[/QUOTE



The frame came out of a buddy of mine at work's garage. He was a criterium racer at Purdue. He crashed the bike and destroyed the original fork. The frames front end was tweaked so he had a frame builder, Cherry Bicycles, I think, align the frame. He ended up having a custom frame built to replace the Pinarello by Cherry Bicycles so the frame hung in his parents garage then to his garage ever since 1992ish. I got the frame clean with all purpose kitchen and bath cleaner. Once clean I went over all the chrome with very fine steel wool and WD40. Then I used Turtle Wax Chrome Polish on all the chrome surfaces. To get the old flaking decals off, used fingernails and the edge of an old credit card to scrape them off. With the decals off, I treated all the painted surfaces with Meguires Scratch X then a good coat of paste car wax over the whole frame. I found Testors Sapphire Blue Metallic model paint was a good match for paint touch ups. The new decals came from H. Lloyd's Cycles. The old decals left a ghost image from paint fade and made positioning the new decals very easy. That was about all I did. The components were bought piece by piece off eBay and were cleaned up as I acquired them.

Seweryn 03-15-13 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Old Yeller (Post 15390732)
The frame came out of a buddy of mine at work's garage. He was a criterium racer at Purdue. He crashed the bike and destroyed the original fork. The frames front end was tweaked so he had a frame builder, Cherry Bicycles, I think, align the frame. He ended up having a custom frame built to replace the Pinarello by Cherry Bicycles so the frame hung in his parents garage then to his garage ever since 1992ish. I got the frame clean with all purpose kitchen and bath cleaner. Once clean I went over all the chrome with very fine steel wool and WD40. Then I used Turtle Wax Chrome Polish on all the chrome surfaces. To get the old flaking decals off, used fingernails and the edge of an old credit card to scrape them off. With the decals off, I treated all the painted surfaces with Meguires Scratch X then a good coat of paste car wax over the whole frame. I found Testors Sapphire Blue Metallic model paint was a good match for paint touch ups. The new decals came from H. Lloyd's Cycles. The old decals left a ghost image from paint fade and made positioning the new decals very easy. That was about all I did. The components were bought piece by piece off eBay and were cleaned up as I acquired them.

Thank you Old Yeller for the details. Really impressive and I believe some patience is needed with the works ;).

I will check the H. Lloyd's Cycles website for the decals. Looks interesting.

:thumb:

Old Yeller 03-15-13 03:09 PM

You're welcome and thank you for the compliments. If I were you I would go with decals from Cyclomondo or Velocals over the H. Lloyd's. H. Lloyd's were only the main Pinarello decals while Cyclomondo's and Velocals are complete. When I did the restoration in 2005 there weren't many options out there. I actually had to get the Olympic wreath decal from Velocals several years later. He was nice enough to breakup a set and sell me the wreath decal for a reasonable price. I highly recommend contacting them to see if they could produce a blue set to match your originals.

Seweryn 03-15-13 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Old Yeller (Post 15391363)
You're welcome and thank you for the compliments. If I were you I would go with decals from Cyclomondo or Velocals over the H. Lloyd's. H. Lloyd's were only the main Pinarello decals while Cyclomondo's and Velocals are complete. When I did the restoration in 2005 there weren't many options out there. I actually had to get the Olympic wreath decal from Velocals several years later. He was nice enough to breakup a set and sell me the wreath decal for a reasonable price. I highly recommend contacting them to see if they could produce a blue set to match your originals.

Thank you again. I could not find any Pinarello decals on the H. Lloyd's list, so the other websites you mentioned may be a better bet anyway. I will try to get some touch up paint tomorrow in a local motor factor, as it is very reasonable money. I am a bit too tired today (from cycling to work :D) to start stripping the bike, so may just take the wheels off and bring the whole frame to get a good match. Will update, if I manage to do any progress with the bike.

Old Yeller 03-15-13 03:45 PM

I just checked out the Velocals website and he does sell the Stelvio Decals and they are available in several blue colors. I'm not sure which blue to choose.

http://www.velocals.com/servlet/the-...bicycle/Detail

Seweryn 03-15-13 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Old Yeller (Post 15391474)
I just checked out the Velocals website and he does sell the Stelvio Decals and they are available in several blue colors. I'm not sure which blue to choose.

http://www.velocals.com/servlet/the-...bicycle/Detail

Thanks, that is great.

Some amount of colours to choose from...

bikingshearer 03-15-13 03:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pars (Post 15387156)
Oh, and that bar tape has to go :)

Yes. For the love of God, yes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Harlan (Post 15387230)
That tape looks like crap even though it appears to be new, just unwrap and take it to your nearest toxic wate dump...

Fixed it for you. If that tape isn't banned by some Geneva Convention or other, it ought to be.

Seweryn 03-16-13 01:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bikingshearer (Post 15391519)
Yes. For the love of God, yes.

Fixed it for you. If that tape isn't banned by some Geneva Convention or other, it ought to be.

:roflmao2: Will take the tape off for sure. I wonder... who in their right mind put that in in the first place :rolleyes:.

Rocket-Sauce 03-16-13 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Harlan (Post 15387230)
That tape looks new, just unwrap and redo it...

Nothing wrong at all with Shimano 600. I'm building a bike with it right now.

Incorrect. That tape is HIDEOUS and must go. http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/sick/barfing.gif


Agree completely about 600. Good stuff.:thumb:

Rocket-Sauce 03-16-13 07:23 AM

Oh... and.. you will have a very nice bike when you are done!

Seweryn 03-16-13 07:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rocket-Sauce (Post 15393380)
Oh... and.. you will have a very nice bike when you are done!

Thank you. I can't wait actually. Just realised the chain really needs to go, as it slips from the chainrings. And probably chainrings as well should be replaced. Next in line is the cassette and the jockey wheels - they all gone way above their limit :(. The bottom bracket is a bit noisy when spin, but may last another while.

jimmuller 03-16-13 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seweryn (Post 15393456)
Thank you. I can't wait actually. Just realised the chain really needs to go, as it slips from the chainrings. And probably chainrings as well should be replaced. Next in line is the cassette and the jockey wheels - they all gone way above their limit :(. The bottom bracket is a bit noisy when spin, but may last another while.

A comment on each of those points. The chain may be jumping the chainrings because it has one or more rusty and stuck links. Chains are consumables, so by all means get a new one if you must. The chainrings shouldn't be pitched unless they are bent, which is unlikely. They wear by the teeth becoming shark-tooth shaped, but even that may not necessarily call for replacement if it isn't too bad. The pulleys can be removed from the RD and their bearing sleeves cleaned and oiled. Don't replace them unless they are broken or the teeth are worn down. (Some people would give their eyeteeth, or at least their Campy teeth, for Campy pulleys.) They often crack, but that don't mean they won't do. If they are so worn they won't control the chain laterally, then obviously they won't do. Finally, if the BB is noisy then definitely tear it down, check the bearings and race surfaces, replace as necessary, consider new bearings (they are cheap), and lube everything. Do not ride it with crunchy bearings. DO NOT RIDE IT WITH CRUNCHY BEARINGS. They will only get worse,m and will trash the races (if they haven't trashed them already).

Seweryn 03-16-13 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimmuller (Post 15393619)
A comment on each of those points. The chain may be jumping the chainrings because it has one or more rusty and stuck links. Chains are consumables, so by all means get a new one if you must. The chainrings shouldn't be pitched unless they are bent, which is unlikely. They wear by the teeth becoming shark-tooth shaped, but even that may not necessarily call for replacement if it isn't too bad. The pulleys can be removed from the RD and their bearing sleeves cleaned and oiled. Don't replace them unless they are broken or the teeth are worn down. (Some people would give their eyeteeth, or at least their Campy teeth, for Campy pulleys.) They often crack, but that don't mean they won't do. If they are so worn they won't control the chain laterally, then obviously they won't do. Finally, if the BB is noisy then definitely tear it down, check the bearings and race surfaces, replace as necessary, consider new bearings (they are cheap), and lube everything. Do not ride it with crunchy bearings. DO NOT RIDE IT WITH CRUNCHY BEARINGS. They will only get worse,m and will trash the races (if they haven't trashed them already).

Thank you for your comments Jim.

I will examine the parts as soon as I take them off the bike. I have no BB removal tool and a guy from my local bike shop could not take it off either. I am meeting my good friend this afternoon, so will have a chat about this, as he is into steel bikes and works on them himself. One step at a time, I suppose is the best approach here :).

Pars 03-16-13 12:34 PM

3 Attachment(s)
Agreed on the bearings. Grade 25 ball bearings are dirt cheap, particularly when you consider the cost of replacing the cups, spindle possibly, etc. Couple that with the problem of finding the right parts. Probably uses 9 1/4" balls per side if in a retainer, or 11 per side if loose.

These appear to use standard BB tools (for the time). You'll also need a crank extractor to remove the crank arms (remember to take out the crank bolts before doing this... don't ask :lol:)

http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=304843 http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=304844

Park Tools HCW4 and 5. Many many other tool manufacturers, etc. made these. The fixed cup could be removed with a large crescent wrench (not recommended, but I've done it), or use Sheldon's method. If you can get the adjustable cup/lockring off, you don't really need to remove the fixed cup; just clean it on the bike, clean the rest of the BB parts, grease and reassemble

jimmuller 03-16-13 12:56 PM

If it's an Italian or French BB, don't remove the right-side bearing race unless you are prepared to torque it back in good an tight. If you can clean it and verify that it isn't pitted without removing it, then you don't have to remove it.

Seweryn 03-16-13 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimmuller (Post 15394263)
If it's an Italian or French BB, don't remove the right-side bearing race unless you are prepared to torque it back in good an tight. If you can clean it and verify that it isn't pitted without removing it, then you don't have to remove it.

Thank you for helpful responses.

I am not sure what type of BB is there but after reading some literature I found there are two types - English and Italian. As the bike is Italian, I assume it rather is Italian type, but can't be sure. I have the cranks removed now, but will see if I can get the right BB removal tool.

jimmuller 03-16-13 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seweryn (Post 15394327)
I am not sure what type of BB is there but after reading some literature I found there are two types - English and Italian. As the bike is Italian, I assume it rather is Italian type, but can't be sure.

Since the bike is a Pinerallo I would imagine it is an Italian BB. But there are at least four types of BB used on lightweight bicycles.

English/Japanese/ISO is the most common. The shell width is 68mm, the threads are 1.370in diameter (1.375in for ISO), and 24 threads per inch (TPI), an odd mixture of English and metric values. The left cup is right-handed thread and the right cup is left-hand threaded.

French is 68mm wide, with threads 35mm diameter x 1mm spacing (25.4 TPI). Both sides are right-handed threads.

Italian is 70mm wide, with threads 36mm x 24 TPI, with right-handed threads on both sides.

Swiss is like French except that the right cup is left-handed threads instead of right-handed.

Italian threads are bigger enough in diameter that an English/ISO bearing race will drop in without the threads engaging at all. For you though, the key point is the right-handed threads on the right side. That means they can unscrew with pedaling unless they are torqued in tight enough. With a French BB we complain that the French never do this right. With an Italian BB we figure they did it like that for a very good reason. :) There will frequently be a thread marking on the bearing cups (or at least one side). Italian will be marked 36mm x 24 TPI.

Seweryn 03-16-13 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jimmuller (Post 15394449)
Since the bike is a Pinerallo I would imagine it is an Italian BB. But there are at least four types of BB used on lightweight bicycles.

Italian is 70mm wide, with threads 36mm x 24 TPI, with right-handed threads on both sides.

Thank you for that info, very helpful :thumb:.

I measured the BB width and it is 70mm, so most likely Italian.

Seweryn 09-28-13 09:55 AM

The project continues...
 
6 Attachment(s)
Some update on the project...

Got the frame and parts cleaned, put in a new bottom bracket, a newly sourced chainset and started re-assembling the bike.

The rear wheel axle was broken in half, so I gave the wheels to a guy to repair and service them and will hopefully collect them back tomorrow.

The headset bearings are very rough and I have to wait again for a new bearing set. Hopefully the headset can be re-used...

Thanks for any suggestions.

http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=343161http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=343162http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=343163http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=343164http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=343165http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=343166


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