Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Classic & Vintage This forum is to discuss the many aspects of classic and vintage bicycles, including musclebikes, lightweights, middleweights, hi-wheelers, bone-shakers, safety bikes and much more.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 02-26-05, 04:14 PM   #1
Bart5657
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: May 2004
Bikes: 2004 Specialized Allez Triple
Posts: 104
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
In about 1969 my dad got a new Bridgestone Kabuki submariner. He rode it for many years, stopped around the time I was born, and in the last few years I started riding it now and then. I am little unsure of the frame material. Its a lugged steel frame, and up until recently I thought the top tube, down tube and seat angle were stainless steel and the rest was just (for lack and the correct termanology) non-stainless steel. However recently a bicycle mechanic told me the top tube, down tube and seat angle where aluminum and the rest was stainless steel (he came to this conclusion cause his magnet would not stick to these areas). In any event the frame is labeled stainless steel and I know some part of it is.
Just this week I had the entire bike overhauled (everything cleaned, new cables, new brake pads new bearings, everything adjusted, e.t.c). Everything on the bike is original including the paint job (suntour derailers, dia-compe brakes, 36 spoked wheels, suntour shifters on the handlebar stem, and thats all I remember right now). It is in excellent condition and rides just as good, if not better then my new road bike
Anyway, I was just curious on what the value on something like this would be. Im not planning on selling it anytime soon, and I am still riding it rather reguarly (gearing up for a few overnighters when the weather gets a bit nicer). Thx guys, I appreciate it.
Bart5657 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-26-05, 05:43 PM   #2
ofofhy
Chronic Tai Shan
 
ofofhy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: PHL/BAL
Bikes: Pake Single Speed
Posts: 1,118
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Magnets will not be attracted to most stainless steels.
ofofhy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-26-05, 08:52 PM   #3
T-Mar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Bikes:
Posts: 12,133
Mentioned: 44 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 236 Post(s)
As ofofhy stated, most stainless steels are non-magnetic or only slightly magnetic. The Kabuki Submariner uses stainless steel for the 3 main tubes and hi-tensile steel for the forks and stays. However there is aluminum on the frame, in the form of the lugs. Bridgestone, the manufacturer of Kabuki, developed a process which allowed them to die cast aluminum lugs around the tubes. There was no brazing or welding. This allowed the joining of dissimilar materials and permitted the use of thinner tubing, as the tubing was not subjected to high brazing temperatures which reduce the strength.

There was a model that did use the die cast lugs with aluminum tubing. It was called the Superlight.

The Submariner's prime selling feature was the frame material. The components are good, but nothing special. Weight was spec'd at 30 lb. Basically, it would be competing against all the one step above entry level, bike boom models that sell for $25.00 at the thrift stores. You would get a premium from an uneducated buyer for the condition, but in order to realize a good price, you would have to sell it on a place like Ebay, where the unique frame might get a couple of educated buyers bidding against each other.
T-Mar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-26-05, 09:43 PM   #4
USAZorro
Seņor Member
 
USAZorro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Florence, KY
Bikes: 1954 Hetchins M.O., 1959 Viking Severn Valley, 1970 Raleigh Pro, 1972 Fuji "The Finest", 1974 Raleigh Superbe&Comp, 1976 Raleigh Team Pro, 1996 Giant Iguana, 2000 Bob Jackson Arrowhead
Posts: 14,474
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 41 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bart5657
In about 1969 my dad got a new Bridgestone Kabuki submariner.
Does it still have the periscope and propeller?


Sorry, couldn't resist.
__________________
In search of what to search for.
USAZorro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-05, 10:16 AM   #5
ofofhy
Chronic Tai Shan
 
ofofhy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: PHL/BAL
Bikes: Pake Single Speed
Posts: 1,118
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
T-Mar: So they were basically relying on casting shrinkage to press fit the lugs around the tubes?
ofofhy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-05, 10:40 AM   #6
james Haury
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Forest Park Il
Bikes: Yeah Dahon Bike Friday Panasonic Dyno
Posts: 876
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
A salute to all those brave submariners! And Now a massage from the Swedish Prime Minister! Thx monty Python.
james Haury is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-05, 09:15 PM   #7
T-Mar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Bikes:
Posts: 12,133
Mentioned: 44 Post(s)
Tagged: 1 Thread(s)
Quoted: 236 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by ofofhy
T-Mar: So they were basically relying on casting shrinkage to press fit the lugs around the tubes?
I can't corroborate that statement, as I don't know the specifics of the die-casting processing and alloys that were used. However, I do know that the ends of the tubes were flared to give some extra insurance against being pulled out of the lugs. The ends of the tubes were capped out of necessity, to prevent the molten aluminum from flowing into the tubes, but the caps also prevented the flared end from collapsing and allowing the tube to be pulled out.

I should also have mentioned that the seat post used an expander bolt, as the the low ductility of the seat lug prevented the use of a standard binder bolt.


Quote:
Originally Posted by USAZorro
Does it still have the periscope and propeller?
Well, it was supposedly developed for highly corrosive environments, such as the seashore. So, if you find one, let us know how the periscope and propellor modifications work out.
.
T-Mar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-27-05, 09:38 PM   #8
don d.
Guest
 
Bikes:
Posts: n/a
Mentioned: Post(s)
Tagged: Thread(s)
Quoted: Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by T-Mar
I can't corroborate that statement, as I don't know the specifics of the die-casting processing and alloys that were used. However, I do know that the ends of the tubes were flared to give some extra insurance against being pulled out of the lugs. The ends of the tubes were capped out of necessity, to prevent the molten aluminum from flowing into the tubes, but the caps also prevented the flared end from collapsing and allowing the tube to be pulled out.
Actually, the tube ends were threaded or serrated and the casting was pressure formed around the threading/serrations to allow the pressure casting to mesh effectively with the tube. I know this because I have cut one of these joints apart with a hacksaw to see how it was done. The joint I cut apart had no flaring.
  Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:18 PM.