smontanaro 

This is a good point. Considering the CR definition, there are lots of bike boom bikes that don't interest that crowd, though they fit the timeline. Peugeot PX-10s and PY-10s get a fair amount of ink, UO-8s, not so much. And probably for good reason.

oldroads

Antique: 75+ years old
Vintage: 25+ years old
Classic: could be any year

That's the way I see it.

rootboy 

According to Merriam-Webster, anyway. Doesn't seem all that applicable here. As a noun at any rate.

1:
a (1) : a season's yield of grapes or wine from a vineyard (2) : wine; especially : a usually superior wine all or most of which comes from a single year
b : a collection of contemporaneous and similar persons or things : crop

2:
: the act or time of harvesting grapes or making wine

3:

a : a period of origin or manufacture <a piano of 1845 vintage>

KonAaron Snake 

When trying to figure out what's likely to be appreciated in the future, I ask myself what did kids and teenagers most desire that they couldn't have? Fast forward 30 years and that's what he wants as a status symbol, nostalgia...pick your reason.

iab

That's true. But at some point there is a shift. Cars are a good example.

In about 1976, my father bought a 1947 MG TC to restore. It was exactly what you described, what he desired as a 9 year old. He used to go to Road America to watch them race. It took him a couple of years to restore (probably took longer because of my "help") and when it was done, I was very impressed it was worth about $15K.

Fast forward about 30 years. The people who wanted that car in their youth are dying. Who wants it? And that is somewhat reflected in the value as it was worth still about $15K in 2003.

Fast forward to now. Even less people are around to have desired it in their youth. But here's the weird thing. Price on that car is now about $35K.

I have no idea what happened but the but the nostalgia factor is nearly gone.

KonAaron Snake 

Interesting point IAB - and true. I guess there are phases...the teen nostalgia phase and than a more mature (?) collector/antiques phase. My question is does it have to go through that nostalgia phase to ever make it to phase two? I think it might...that's what gets it on the radar to be something special later on.

The Golden Boy 

There's a point where rarity becomes a factor.

Even the most common, mass produced items disappear and break and are considered inconsequential. That leads to them being rare or uncommon down the road.

rootboy 

Could be KA Snake. But it also has to do, for me, with quality. There are some things I have no nostalgia for as they were not part of my youth but now entice me because of their obvious quality compared with newer offerings. Stanley/Bailey hand planes come to mind.

KonAaron Snake 

Quality is always in fashion. That sounds like a Macys ad.

David Newton

The question was supposed to a clever way of saying that the OP's first post was a troll, and I apologize.
I really wish a newbie's first post was "Hi, my grandfather gave me his Italian racing bike from the 1930's, does it look all original to you guys?"

David Newton

Thanks for using a MG TC to illustrate, I'd love to just drive one once, much less own one to work on.
The same thing goes on with vintage guitars. The old guys who collect them are getting even older, and most of the values have peaked and fallen in the recent inconvenience, but you see more and more young punks latching on to any old guitar and playing the heck out of them. Old stuff seems to acquire layers of goodness with the passing of time, and the "good" old stuff even more so.

KonAaron Snake 

I know that for me I tend to be attracted to older stuff, or antiques, across the board...older furniture, older homes, older cars...etc. I also like stuff made from leather, wood and metal more than plastic. I wonder how much of this is my dissatisfaction with our disposable, throw away culture?


Maybe that's a good way to ask the question - would the Kinks sing about in 30 years?

RaleighSport

The times I've been present for different incarnations of this question the majority tended to settle on 25 as a very soft cut off.. that we all fudge pretty often. But as has been said already, there really is no hard rule or rule at all for that matter setting cut offs...

RubberLegs

Went for a group ride this AM on my 87 Bridgestone, was the OLDEST bike on the ride, and as it is over 25...MUST be vintage! ;-) There was a LaMond as well, but mid-90's....the rest were all CF and AL....we kept a pace of 18.04 for 27 miles...

auchencrow

Not to introduce another concept here, but I think there is a point at which something "vintage" becomes "antique". It hinges on its value as a curiosity and historical artifact begins to outweigh its utility.

E.g., 17th Century Amati violins are still current technology, whereas a 19th Century gut-stringed Martin guitar is more or less an antique. Martins from the 1930's however, will likely remain vintage as long as steel strings are made. Electric guitars will remain so as long as amplifiers accept 1/4" phone jacks, or until an i-phone app replaces the guitar entirely.

( I think rock&roll would lose some cool factor played through an i-phone. Don't you?)


Likewise, our C&V bikes will likely remain "vintage" as long as we can get tires and parts to service and ride them. Riding them is key because without a demand for spares (think 27" tires) the will stop making them and our beautiful bikes will be relegated to the dust-bin of history.

1987

The general use of vintage (especially when used about second hand sales and auctions) is old and of good quality. Without good quality it's just old or used.

FYI: antique is when something is 100 years or older.

ThermionicScott 

Really, "old bikes" would probably be a better descriptor for this subforum. "Classic" and "vintage" both imply some sort of quality or desireability, and we don't necessarily limit our discussion to those bikes. "Classic" does allow for newer bikes made with traditional methods, though.

As for the time cut-offs, they're nebulous and always will be. Heck, they play Nirvana, Pearl Jam, and the Police on "classic rock" stations these days.

KonAaron Snake 

I think non-traditional new bikes can be classic as well...

I find this:



Far more classic and interesting than this:



One is a dime a dozen and merely old...the other is strikingly different, built in low numbers and part of a controversy.

Velognome 

In the end......

If your the seller it's Vintage and or Classic

If your the buyer it's just Old and Obsolete

repechage

It will be fun to watch the revaluation of the UCI regs for racing bicycles as they are going under review with the new UCI leadership, the guy who is going to oversee them was involved with the development of some interesting British race bikes…
Maybe the Y-Foil could be legal again.

repechage

Yes, bike snobs many or the thought leaders there.

iab

If I may, why is that?

I'm just trying to understand why there is an increased demand in that car. Like I wrote, those with nostalgia are dying off. What about it floats your boat?

Also, I will be throwing a bike shindig in July. If you come up, I can probably arrange a ride. My dad is re-restoring the car and it should be done by then.

Oldpeddaller

Speaking personally, it's ALL about nostalgia and memories. My first 'racing' bike was a gas pipe Halfords Olympic 5 speed with everything steel and chromed. I rode it everywhere and hated it's shortcomings - no love there, not a Classic or Vintage in my book. My first 'real' bike was a new (1972) Claud Butler frame I bought and built up myself and loved riding for thousands of miles and ever since then I've always had Claud Butlers in my life (currently six of them from 1935 to 1986). When I started club racing on my Clauds I was regularly beaten by bigger and fitter chaps on Holdsworths, which I couldn't then afford. Obviously it was the magic prancing horse on their head badge that made all the difference. I didn't know then that the Clauds and Holdsworths were mainly built in the same works in Penge and were 'badge engineered' to be Claud butler or Holdsworth in the paint shop! So I've also got two holdsworths now, a 1970 mistral and a 1954 Typhoon. All of these are both Classic and Vintage in my warped mind!

David Newton

When I was in my early teens, I read the book "The Red Car" about a teenage boy who rebuilt a wrecked TC with help from a French mechanic, then raced it to win. It fueled my interest in British cars, and bikes. I rebuilt a TR-3a of my own, but I never could afford a TC.
Thanks for the invite, but I don't get out much.

bhchdh 

https://www.oregonlive.com/cycling/in...ous_retro.html

So what defines a vintage bicycle and how do you get one? L'Eroica's rules give four parameters: the frame must be manufactured no later than 1989, there must be shifters on the down tubes, the brake cables must come out of the top of the levers, and the bike must use toe clips. (Be warned, the toe clips present the steepest relearning curve.) Online auction sites and classified ads will have what you need if you don't have an old bike gathering dust in your garage.