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Old 02-17-14, 06:48 PM   #1
vonfilm
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Show us your Fillet Brazed Schwinn Superior and Sport Tourer

I am feeling a strong need to have one of the final fillet brazed Superiors made in the late 70's. Now I realize the chance of finding one on Austin's Craigslist is almost nil. I would really love to see one in black like the one in the Schwinn catalog.. A Schwinn fillet brazed 4130 frame with a conventional bottom bracket and no kickstand braze-on would look so smooth. Hang a pretty Stronglight or Campagnolo crankset and some polished high flanged Campy hubs and you would really have something. With a set of tubular rims and tires it could be pretty light. Surely some caliper would work with this. My 73 Super Sport needs some fillet brazed company.

Please show us what you have.
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Old 02-17-14, 07:06 PM   #2
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As found, 1974+/- Sport Tourer. Picked it up last year. Even has the Schwinn Approved matching lever covers. Needs some nice gum walls, otherwise, its a time capsule.

Picked up off of Charlotte's C/L.




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Old 02-17-14, 07:10 PM   #3
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This isn't mine, but here is an article showing a '77 Superior being rebuilt: http://johns-recycled-bicycle.blogsp...-grade-in.html

That's a 26" AMxxxxxx (Jan. '76) serial no. frame built into a bike on Tuesday April 13, 1977 (1047 badge #). The paint and decals are excellent, however it is missing the original rear wheel (rim/hub/skewers), freewheel, spoke protector, saddle, crank dust caps and more. Unfortunately it has a completely incorrect low-end steel bolt-on rear wheel that was not original to the bike.

It is currently for sale in the Chicago area: http://chicago.craigslist.org/nwc/bik/4336541766.html

Although the rebuild work that was done on it is excellent, it would be worth so much more if it were genuinely restored instead of just being rebuilt/refurbished. In particular the cheap bolt-on steel rear wheel really detracts.
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Old 02-17-14, 07:12 PM   #4
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People really like fancy swoopy lugs. Shiney lugs. Sculpted lugs. Outlined lugs.

I like fillet brazing. The smooth flow of one tube into another is a thing of beauty.

I know it's not really what you're asking for- but here's my 87 High Sierra.

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Old 02-17-14, 07:57 PM   #5
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Picked this up about 4 years ago , 1974 , 24" frame , Opaque Red . The stem was an SOB to break loose , I'm surprised I didn't bust something .
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Old 02-17-14, 08:00 PM   #6
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Supersports, with their straight-gage tubing and thick-walled .833" ID steerers, are rather heavy, even before adding the one-piece crank or kickstand.

I wish that these Superiors were more common though, because even if thgey are also heavy, these frames are beautiful and have good "English" frame geometry.

I'm stuck on Supersports though, since they are the real sleeper with their one-piece cranks, while still having the good geometry that allows one to put out their all on an unsuspecting peloton.

Luck out and find clipless pedals for a Supersport, and you won't have to wait for a Superior to come along (I've never found one for sale).

A Supersport is also not a hard frameset to repaint, the chrome fork crown cap is conveniently removable.
Of course a framesmith can upgrade that inexpensive, beaten Supersport frame you found for $15, befor your paintwork is done.

So, do Superiors also feature the 21.1mm (.833") ID steerer?

The pictured Sports Tourer does appear to have a real, chromed fork crown.
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Old 02-17-14, 08:08 PM   #7
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I have a green '77 Superior awaiting the restomod treatment at home. I just need to get a couple projects out of the way first.

I was looking for a red '78 Superior like the one I bought new in 1980. When this green one showed up on Ebay, I convinced myself that I liked Flamboyant Green better than red. Pictures coming when the house thaws out.
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Old 02-17-14, 08:13 PM   #8
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1972 - Built-up from an eBay frame-set. Has Campagnolo record hubs with Mavic clincher rims, Selle Anatomica saddle, a NOS Crane rear DR, the rest from the parts bin.. Rides like a dream.
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Old 02-17-14, 08:19 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrk101 View Post
As found, 1974+/- Sport Tourer. Picked it up last year. Even has the Schwinn Approved matching lever covers. Needs some nice gum walls, otherwise, its a time capsule.

Picked up off of Charlotte's C/L.

bill

I really like that this one has all of its original Frenh made Schwinn Approved components, seat , paint and details intact in good shape pretty rare.
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Old 02-17-14, 09:29 PM   #10
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reminder tip for anyone contemplating building up one of these machines from a frameset - you will be needing one of the special front derailleurs with an oversize mounting clamp.
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Old 02-17-14, 09:32 PM   #11
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OK, I'm going ever so slightly down a tangent...but it's for a good cause! I want to sell this rare 1977 Sports Limited and somebody here must be dying to dig in and restore it. Built on Monday Sept. 12th 1977, a model not in any Schwinn catalog, for dealers only.

Plenty of before and after pics in that Photobucket album, and it even has a chain and brake cables, now!
So it's ride-able.
http://s179.photobucket.com/user/unw...53196481522173
I'm a motivated seller...hit me up (as the kids would say)

Last edited by unworthy1; 02-18-14 at 10:48 AM. Reason: corrections
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Old 02-17-14, 10:35 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dddd View Post
Supersports, with their straight-gage tubing and thick-walled .833" ID steerers, are rather heavy, even before adding the one-piece crank or kickstand.
While the 4130 Chrome-Molybdenum tubing Schwinn used on the fillet-brazed models started out as 18ga single-butted (straight-gauge), it was actually double-butted as the frame was built. Schwinn called these "internally lugged" frames. During fabrication 1-1/4" long sleeves were inserted into the ends of the tubes joining the head and crank hanger tubes. The tubes were slightly dimpled to secure the sleeves and the ends were then milled to provide a close mating surface to the head and hanger tubes. Finally the tubes were then fillet-brazed to the head and hanger tubes using brass solder. Here is a diagram from a '73 Schwinn Reporter dealer newsletter showing the internal lugs at the head tube.



The fillet-brazed Super Sport and Superior frames were identical except for the crank hanger tube (OPC vs. 3-piece crank), dropouts (mid-'71 and later SS had stamped dropouts), kickstand mount tube vs. chainstay brace, and the upper downtube braze-ons.

Quote:
...do Superiors also feature the 21.1mm (.833") ID steerer?
Yes for the '76-'78 fillet-brazed models.

Quote:
The pictured Sports Tourer does appear to have a real, chromed fork crown.
The '71 and up fillet-brazed Sports Tourer and Superior used the same forks, which were fully chromed then masked and painted. The masking at the crown was *very* crude!


Attached Images
File Type: jpg Schwinn Frame Construction (Medium).jpg (54.8 KB, 62 views)
File Type: jpg OpaqueRedST-fork (Medium).jpg (46.5 KB, 61 views)
File Type: jpg OpaqueBlueST-fork (Medium).jpg (38.0 KB, 59 views)
File Type: jpg LimeGreenST-fork (Medium).jpg (41.8 KB, 55 views)
File Type: jpg KoolLemonST-fork (Medium).jpg (43.6 KB, 57 views)

Last edited by Metacortex; 02-17-14 at 10:47 PM.
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Old 02-17-14, 10:43 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by unworthy1 View Post
OK, I'm going ever so slightly down a tangent...but it's for a good cause! I want to sell this rare 1979 Sports Limited and somebody here must be dying to dig in and restore it.
The Sport Limited was made in late '77 only. If you remember we found from the headbadge stamp that yours was made on Monday Sept. 12th 1977. A rare model not in any catalogs!
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Old 02-18-14, 12:50 AM   #14
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That's a lot of good information, metacortex. Thanks for sharing.

And what is the wall thickness of 18ga steel?
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Old 02-18-14, 05:58 AM   #15
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Here is a frontal pic of my ST freshly built up after a powder coat. Note the Campy Grand Turismo towards the back of the photo doing its best Leatherman tool impersonation. Some would say a Leatherman would shift better.

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Old 02-18-14, 06:06 AM   #16
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Quote:
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reminder tip for anyone contemplating building up one of these machines from a frameset - you will be needing one of the special front derailleurs with an oversize mounting clamp.
And an oversize headset.
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Old 02-18-14, 06:24 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vonfilm View Post
I am feeling a strong need to have one of the final fillet brazed... Schwinns. ...Hang a pretty Stronglight or Campagnolo crankset and some polished high flanged Campy hubs and you would really have something. With a set of tubular rims and tires it could be pretty light. Surely some caliper would work with this. My 73 Super Sport needs some fillet brazed company.

Please show us what you have.
Start with this....



Add lots of $$$, patience, and time, to end up with this....







Or, spot one of these on CL, listed only as "Old Schwinn...."



...and spend hours, cleaning, polishing, rebuilding, customizing, and a few $$, when it started out looking mostly like this....



So after hours of loving labor, it has lots of nice patina, history, and a sweet rebirth....





IIRC, the geometry on '60s & '70s Schwinn fillet brazed frames never changed, so they all basically ride the same, which I have to say is really nice, especially for a hefty guy like me. So if you find a FB frameset in need of painting or PCing as a blank canvas for your project, that's a perfect time to make frame modifications.

I didn't think to do this when I built "Sporty." I now wish I had at least had the kickstand tube removed and a chain stay bridge added. It would have also been possible to replace the stamped dropouts for forged at the time. We did take off the down tube cable stops in order to add the shifters.

Best of luck on your hunt, but consider the possibility of creating your own FB Superior.
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Old 02-18-14, 08:19 AM   #18
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A question for the Schwinn experts. Had a cycling friend who purchased a used flambouyant blue Superior in about 1971. The bike dated from about 1962 or so iirc. It was fitted with a T.A. triple chainset and had Schwinn Approved Huret gearing.

It seems to me that the Superior was discontinued at some point and then relaunched in about 1976. Is this correct? Thank you for any information.
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Old 02-18-14, 08:38 AM   #19
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Yes, there was a 15 speed Superior model in '62 & '63. There had also been earlier Superiors in the thirties, forties, and perhaps early fifties also. Here is my modified '62 Superior with TA Cyclotouriste triple crank.



Here are my modified '76(red) and '77(blue) Superiors.

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Old 02-18-14, 10:22 AM   #20
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And what is the wall thickness of 18ga steel?
From the tables I see online it appears to be 0.49".
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Old 02-18-14, 10:37 AM   #21
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In regard to the headset and FD:

It is important to save the originals if trying to save money. New headsets can be found if you look for ones marked as "Old School BMX." On Sporty I used a Chris King headset since they still make these. A very nice headset but not inexpensive.



On the FD, I was able to fit a vintage Campagnolo Record by using a longer clamp screw. But you will also have to sort out the cable stop and routing options. If you look closely below the FD you can see that I found a band on Campy cable stop (and again using a longer screw) was able to turn 90 degrees and make work. Not ideal, but it gets the job done.





Unfortunately, it did deform the paint and clear (which was quite thick).
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Old 02-18-14, 10:45 AM   #22
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The Sport Limited was made in late '77 only. If you remember we found from the headbadge stamp that yours was made on Monday Sept. 12th 1977. A rare model not in any catalogs!
Nope, I forgot...I forget a lot these days...thanks for refreshing my memory.
So... when should I ship this "diamond in the rough" to you?
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Old 02-18-14, 11:17 AM   #23
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Pastorbob,
Is that a Technomic stem in your green Sports Tourer? If it is, how does it fit?
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Old 02-18-14, 12:27 PM   #24
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Pastorbob,
Is that a Technomic stem in your green Sports Tourer? If it is, how does it fit?
Its a bit of an oddball. I've only ever had this one and have seen maybe 2 other examples on the internet. It is marked "Schwinn Forged" and maybe Metacortex can shed some light on it. It was not original to the bike, but I'm assuming was made by Schwinn in Chicago. This is the only example I know of them making an aluminum stem.



There's a varation on this stem which came on the larger framed Sports Tourers and Continentals. It is actually what I have on Sporty now, since the original was too short in reach for me. It has a flattened/ridge top extending from the fork to the handlebars. It is almost as tall as a Techtomic and the reach is about 100mm. Unfortunately, no pic at this time.
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Old 02-18-14, 01:33 PM   #25
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Here's my 74 Sports Tourer
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