znailz

Hi,


Need help to identify this frame before i restore it or repaint it…
I just got this frame from eฺBay but didn't know what frame is…?
Seller said it was a swiss frame because of the small swiss flag on the seat tube.
Here is the information i got…

Headset: 1 inch (25.4 mm)
Seatpost: - 27.2mm
Bottom Bracket: 36 mm x 24 mm
weight 1825 gram + fork 690 gram
seat tube: 57cm
rear space: 126mm
Campagnolo stamp on fork and drop out…

Thanks in advance

unworthy1

dunno about it being Swiss, don't see the Swiss Flag you mentioned...it's a very nice and stylish frame; yet another mystery with a four-leaf-clover but unlike the last one with similar engraving in many other details. Not like any of the typical Swiss makes we have seen (such as Allegro, Mondia and Cilo) but probably a very good frame. With that BB threading and the seatpost size I'd say it's probably Italian and either Columbus SL or other high end tubing...never seen that particular BB shell "venting" ever before...probably your best clue.

znailz

thanks a lot unworthy1
here is the pic for the swiss flag thing i'm talking about with another photo of the decal marks that leftover..

unworthy1

It sure doesn't ring any bell: maybe you can decipher a few more of the ghost letters left in that (head tube?) decal...I can see a "Z" and maybe an "R" but since you can look up close and under a magnifier, seems like the center has a pentagon shape, ala Basso (but this frame NOT Basso, I think)...I wonder if that Swiss flag is something left over from a band of "many flags" that wrapped around the tube? Similar to what Masi had in their logo, but used by other brands: a strip that includes flags from all the nations that have a big race...cause I still think this frame is Italian (but NOT Masi).

znailz

thanks again unworthy1

Drillium Dude 

Probably a Lazzaretti.

Compare this:



With this:



I also suspect the Swiss flag decal is part of a band decal made up of the colors of other countries, similar to Masi, Guerciotti and others.

DD

znailz

Wowwww!!! thanks Drillium Dude

orangeology

endless amusement of endlessly finding super gorgeous frames and such endless knowledges and insights here.
endlessly awesome

unworthy1

hats off and low bow to DD!
I never would have come up with Lazzaretti in a dozen years...cause this is the first I've heard of it! Well maybe not but been long enough that it seems brand new again.
I CAN provide a little background thanks to the CR List: it's a Roman bike shop, and perhaps the oldest still in business (dates back to 1916, and may still be going on Via Bergamo #3 , Roma) and the early frames ('60s) were contract built by Galmozzi. By this OP's era they were getting frames made by Billato, Gloria and (my bet for this) BMZ.
I lean to BMZ since the frame from New Zealand that was ID'd a week or 2 ago as a BMZ also had the four-leaf clover panto on the forkcrown.

Drillium Dude 

Actually, I got the inspiration from your post, so take a bow as well! It was you who pointed out you could detect a "Z" and an "R". Lazzaretti popped immediately into my head after reading those letters, so I punched it into Google and found the headbadge pic within a few hits. After a few minutes of comparing the two side-by-side, I was pretty confident.

I also believe this to be a BMZ-built frame, and from the details, it appears to be a mid-late 70s (lack of Lazzaretti engravings, semi-sloping fork crown...).

znailz: You scored yourself a pretty cool - and relatively uncommon - frame there. What are your plans for it?

DD

znailz

Take a bow to you guys 3 times!!
at first my plan is remove the old paint job and do the raw lacquer or chrome...if I can not identify what is this frame... But now I know.. I'm thinking about to restore it to the old style color with Lazzaretti logo.

And maybe use with the dura ace 7700 group set that I have.

the problem is it's very hard to find the lazzaretti logo in the net... The best is the one that DD show me in this post.

thanks again DD and unworthy1

unworthy1

I'm still amazed by DD's detective work...all credit to him where it's due...Since the shop is still in business, try contacting them for either an old decal set or better copy of the graphics (if you have to resort to reproducing them, yourself). Maybe a shop with this much history keeps an archive.
https://www.ciclilazzaretti.com/

If that fails, there's a guy in Italy that sells repro decals, maybe he has something from Lazzaretti. If I can dig up his address, I'll update this post with it.

Edit: Found the name I was looking for but he's been inactive since about 2008 so I think it's a dead trail...but he's:
Giorgio Panciroli
Italia
info(AT)vintagetransfers.it

and that vintagetransfers.it site is "under construction"...plus I found no sale of anything "Lazzaretti" from him in the CR archives.

znailz

Thank you very much unworthy1
I'll email Lazzaretti and will update you guys...