Heatherbikes

Maybe this has been discussed, but i have relied on ebay for classic and vintage and modern bike parts for years. Not having much money, I usually go for used, or what I am looking for is old and used anyway. Also, bike parts are so much more expensive in Canada, crazily so.
I recently had the funds to work on a bike project again and noticed there would be a thing for customs/duty that I had never seen before. I just looked at a derailleur I would like and saw the duty charges to Canada and no way do I want to pay that! I read many rants on forums about it, something to do with a GSP, which is optional. Any item coming to Canada goes through customs and they decide whether to ding an item any further. So these extra fees are somehow bound by ebay?
Anybody else incensed? Anybody know what the deal is, or how to bypass it?
I wish I still had my PO box in WA! Or better yet, an american friend!
I suppose I can look through classic and vintage sales here...

Sixty Fiver

It has gotten crazy.

american psycho 

I'm moving away from eBay and moving to sales here or on classicrendezvous.

10% flat fee on vintage bikes PLUS 2.5% PayPal charges are ridiculous. Compare this to a $12 fee/year here.

I've had good response here, even though the listing system is primitive.

big chainring 

The border is lined with "receiving" places just for this purpose. I've sent items to these remote border towns and then my Canadian customers cross the border, pick up their goods and go back home. Hey yesterday was 4/15, tax day. Its all about avoiding taxes, right.

thinktubes 

Don't blame Ebay - read this.

mikemowbz

The key issue is with eBay's 'Global Shipping Program', through which US sellers can avoid the trouble of dealing with paperwork, etc., themselves.

The program is run by Pitney Bowes, a huge international shipping company, and entails the pre-payment of customs duties/brokerage fees - even on items declared at under $100 US, which would incur zero such fees if sent directly via USPS. Hence the up-front inclusion of additional charges in the ebay listings. I presume that is the OP's complaint, given the reference to fees appearing in the eBay listing where they did not before (and I'm guessing that we're talking relatively low cost items, again based on the OP's post).

I do blame ebay for this, as it's the result of a specific shipping program they implemented though a contract with Pitney Bowes - and it means that Canadian buyers pay fees that previously would not have been charged at all on items declared at a value under $100 (these extra costs going in part to the Canadian government, generally the equivalent of sales tax that would be charged domestically, and in part to Pitney Bowes for doing us all the favour). For such items, the fees being charged are by no means the inherent cost of doing business across the border; rather, they are the product of this particular shipping arrangement.

Some sellers will send items via USPS, which avoids any and all such fees on items below $100 declared value (or below $90-95 to be safe, if someone is keeping an eye on the exchange rate). In a couple of cases where the eBay Global Shipping Program additional fees have been significant, I have explained the situation and had items (especially items in the $50-90 range) sent via USPS instead of via the Global Shipping Program as per the original listing. This means that the seller must take a minute of their time to fill out the customs form and select the appropriate shipping service. Some folks will do it, many won't - and I do understand the matter of convenience here, especially for the über-busy or for businesses for which it is a matter of policy.

That said, the courier companies are at least as bad (often worse) when it comes to dinging customers for cross-border customs/taxes that would not have been charged if the same (sub-$100) items had been sent via USPS, and for piling on the 'brokerage fees'. I once had a bill for over $30 in total taxes and fees handed to me along with a wheel shipped from Colorado, for which I had paid $60 including almost $30 in shipping costs (I curse UPS to this day).

Items over $100 will get dinged by customs no matter what (except in cases of misrepresentation regarding the declared value), regardless of the shipping method. The couriers will charge extortionate additional fees on such items above and beyond the gov't cut. USPS/Canada Post will charge exactly $7.00 Canadian in addition to the customs/tax amount. eBay's Global Shipping Program is, I think, somewhere in between on such items...and much to be preferred over the couriers.

As mentioned by others, there are loads of cross-border 'receiving' businesses, if one is lucky enough to live in Vancouver, in Southern Ontario, in Montréal, etc.

Of course, many Canadians live 2, 4, 6 or 8 hours (or somewhere along that continuum) from the nearest US town or city that might feature such businesses.

This has been discussed in several previous threads, but I sympathise with the OP's concerns - and hope this answers some questions, as well as dispelling the notion that this situation (where we're dealing with lower-cost items) is anything but a product of the specific shipping arrangements contracted by eBay through Pitney Bowes under the name of the Global Shipping Program.

P.S.: For *new* bike parts, rather than used, UK sellers (chainreactioncycles, ribble, etc.) are often the best option for Canadian customers, though some ebay sellers (such as xtremebikeandsport and many others) offer cheap shipping via USPS that does not entail any unnecessary additional charges on lower-cost new items.

wrk101

As you are in the Vancouver area, I have recommended in your prior threads what I consider to be fantastic work around for these issues, with a drive of 30 miles from Vancouver. The typical bike I pick up here is 75 to 100 miles away one way.

Living close to an international border has some great advantages. I would consider 2 hours to be close. As far as picking up items, I would love to be within two hours of a Canadian shipping point, as it would open up the domestic Canadian market, both for sales and purchases. In the world of vintage items, two hours is right down the street to me. I guess that is part of living in a more rural area.

As far as the ebay global shipping program, its a mixed bag. On the one hand, the fees are high, on the other hand, its a great encouragement for sellers who have ZERO interest in shipping globally to try it out. So long term, while the fees are high, IMHO, its going to dramatically increase the supply, which will drive international prices down. I predict the bid prices will go down, the handling/shipping charges will go up, so the buyers will end up getting items for about the same $$. Sellers will end up getting LESS, so they will have the choice of getting less, or selling direct and avoiding ebay's global shipping program.

Selling on ebay internationally is more than just a one minute job of checking a box. First, you lose all shipment tracking, which means if the buyer claims they did not get the item, sellers are SOL. Not getting the item includes any delay clearing customs or whatever, something buyers do not control. It also complicates any return. I've sold internationally, but crossed my fingers on the sale going through successfully, and I am not sending to buyers with low feedback scores. But if I use the ebay global system, once I have confirmation that it arrived at their reshipping point in the USA, I am off the hook as far as any claim of "I never got it" or "item poorly packed". What are those conveniences worth to a seller? It depends... Realize as a seller, I GET LESS as savvy buyers will include the cost of the additional fees in their bids. I really don't understand BUYERS complaining about the new system. Just adjust your bid down to compensate. Ultimately, the seller is losing, not the buyer.

mikemowbz

Can't argue with that. I don't know about the OP (who is perhaps in the Vancouver area, given the reference to a PO box in WA? I guess this must have been indicated in prior threads?), but it's only about 22 miles from my front door to the various shipping/receiving businesses in Point Roberts, WA. Of course, as someone who has never held a driver's license, that's ~45 miles round trip on my bike (not too bad, but time-consuming). For higher value items, of course, the border agents at Point Roberts re-entry point may just ding you for the customs costs there (though shipping costs can be saved); for larger items, it does help to have a car.

I've taken advantage of being on the border in a number of ways, most notably in crossing in to pick up complete bikes received with the assistance of generous fellow Forum-members. And I've definitely got a lot more options than much of the population elsewhere in Canada - as does the OP, if indeed a resident of the Lower Mainland (check out: TSB Shipping Plus) or Victoria. I've held onto items I've sold through various forums to ship while I happen to be visiting WA state, which is a nice option (Canada-to-US shipping is higher even than the reverse).

And I agree that the Global Shipping Program is not without its advantages insofar as it makes items available from sellers otherwise disinclined to ship across borders. The main disadvantage, from a Canadian perspective, is that the GPS (with its associated fees adding a substantial premium) has become the default for many sellers in cases where the default option would have been the USPS (and zero fees on sub-$100 items) previously.

I don't know about the medium-to-long-term market impacts broadly speaking; you may be quite correct. I've found that many sellers are unaware of how the GPS works with regard to the fees at issue (as compared to USPS), and have - as noted - negotiated direct USPS shipping in lieu of the GPS program in the past. As per your hypothesis, this has in a couple of cases netted the seller a good price on an item I wanted enough to bid aggressively for (but still would have walked away from otherwise).

wrk101

The other thing the global system is doing is it will put the private companies that have been doing it for a long time out of business, which is fine by me. Active sellers surely have sold to some of those buyers, with MASSIVE feedback scores and strange user names. I had one of these blow up on me, they trans shipped to Hong Kong, and their ultimate buyer complained. Can of worms...

On long term trends, savvy buyers will surely just adjust their bids down to cover the cost. Heck, many of us routinely do this with shippers that want $150 just to ship a frame within the USA.

Whether I ship myself (which I have done several times), or use the global shipping service (done that as well), I get whining about shipping rates. Easy enough to check what rates will be, via whichever service you prefer.

Catnap 

i tried to use Ebay Global Shipping with my auctions last month and got flooded with angry / dismayed messages from buyers who felt the fees were exorbitant. So I ended up removing it as an option for all my auctions and went back to using USPS shipping.

that said, for most items going overseas, I've started requiring USPS Priority International instead of the cheaper Parcel Select service because I can't get any shipping insurance or tracking on Parcel Select. I wish I could offer lower shipping prices to international buyers, but I can't take the chance of the item being lost or damaged in shipping, since I'd be on the hook for the refund.

I have had a few buyers purchase items that I had eBay Global Shipping offered on, and I will say that it's a great service. I just wish it wasn't so pricey!

Heatherbikes

Thank you for the response! It is not just ebay doing it I see. As I said I have bought stuff on ebay from US sellers with never a problem before, so why would a strange system that piles on unnecessary fees be attractive to a seller? I have emailed ebay sellers about it, and quite often they did not even know what it was and willing to take it off, others who are unaware of the situation are using it because it is easy. I was looking at a pair of boots that are used, only $30, but shipping is $30. and GSP charges more than $10. With USPS that would roll on through customs no problem. USPs is wonderful. I avoid UPS like the plague and will not buy anything from a US company that uses it. They automatically charge brokerage fees, duty, taxes and then if I am not home, will send the item to some far away depot.
I have been charged duty on items that are made in the USA as well! I know shipping has gotten very expensive which I accept, but it has also gotten very slow even within Canada. One peeve I do have is that US sellers/businesses will not ship USPS first class, even if I ask nicely. I try to explain that it will not get through customs any faster, I live in a weird rural area, so add a few days onto that. I am happy to pay less for the slow way. I will not give negative feedback if it comes late, as priority international can take ages too! I sometimes shop from a company in Oregon that ships first class and it takes a week max. Canada is right next door, no oceans, no strangeness, a fairly integrated system, it will be okay!
Yes, buying from the UK and Europe is often less expensive. The UK in particular has very reasonable shipping.
Technically I live near Vancouver, but add on ferries and it becomes a long slog without a car. Years ago I had a share in a US po box and people would take turns picking things up when they were going down to trader joes or whatever. I just do not know anybody who goes anymore, and it is not really possible for me to go which is why I rely on shopping online. Now that the canada customs is letting canadians bring back far more than the official amount without charging(and why is that? to promote visits to the US and boost their economy?), taking a trip is even more tempting. I'd especially like some swift industry bags...

I know it sounds like whinging, but I hate seeing something so unfair and canadians seem to always get the short end of the stick in these situations.
I will continue to ask ebayers nicely about the gsp, and if unwilling to remove it, then I will shop elsewhere, even if there are tears over the pretty campy bit I am refusing. I do believe there will be loss of business over this.
Also, I am not necessarily against taxes, but being canadian, I pay taxes all the time for everything, so do not feel the love having to pay tax on a used item, especially not duty on a low cost used item.

cyclotoine

good synopsis and I agree with Mike, depending on the shipper it pays to ask if they'll ship USPS first class on low value items. You have to wait but there are no additional fees. Someones, as Mike pointed out, the GSP is to our advantage because we can know the total cost and not get dinged the "brokerage fee" by the courier when the item shows up. At first I was wary of GSP and refused to bid on items that used it. Then I had a really great seller check the cost of shipping USPS and it was more because the item was too big for first class I guess. So the GSP was cheaper and I knew all costs up front. Now I just assess the total cost including GSP charges and bid accordingly. I have been pretty happy with that and just got a bar and stem combo that the seller didn't even bother to break down... the box was huge but the GSP allowed them to ship a box that size at a pretty reasonable price.

Heatherbikes

Oh, and the company I order from in Oregon that ships basic first class always give me tracking numbers, so first class does offer it, at least to Canada.

mongol777

cbiusa.com - best service ever if you are within reasonable driving distance. Unless I need the part right away - I ship everything there and pick up and/or ask my friends to pick up.
Fee is per package (although they do have program where u can pay flat fee if you plan to receive a lot of shipments)