photogravity

pastorbobnlnh 

Is there a "Wave the White Flag" emoticon I can post in the case of smart***?

Oh, found a recent Shimano PDF Technical Bulletin about the chains. Didn't see anything in the Park website that disputed the one use only Shimano connector pins.

I searched Sheldon Brown for specific information on the Shimano HG chain and couldn't find anything.

ThermionicScott 

Sheldon's site essentially says "Use a master link" and seems to discourage reusing chain pins by omitting mention of that practice except for blurbs like this:

Can you get away with reusing the pin on 7/8-speed HG-type chains? Maybe, but it's not the best practice. Especially when master links are so secure and easy to use.

Lazyass

Park discusses reusable rivets. I personally wouldn't want to use it more than a few times. The HG70 chain comes with a reusable rivet already pressed into the open sideplate. Is is not a flared reinforced one time done rivet. I believe all the Shimano 6/7/8 speed chains do. 9+ speeds do not. Of course if you press it all the way out you'll have to use the replacement rivet the chain comes with. Never in thousands and thousand of miles since 1987 have I ever had a chain break on me. As Sheldon Brown correctly states, 9 speed and newer Shimano chains need a new reinforced rivet every time you reassemble it. But that's a new thing started when these super narrow chains came out in the late 90's, you never had to worry about that before. Maybe that's why cyclists who weren't around before this century don't know any different.

SJX426 

Manufacturing ease and cost takes precedence over end user serviceability. One of the reasons I look sideways at some well-known brands. It was faster, lower cost with common available mechanics tools to change the front disks on my VW Scirocco than a Honda Accord.

Bikedued

Chains last about 2-3 thousand miles anyway, I have hardly ever removed a chain once installed, unless it was kust totally blownout? With the amount of bikes I have thoughI can count on less than half of one hand,when that has occurred. The Shimano pinned chains are just fine, and I have a box full of the pins I got in a group of bicycle tools, enough to last me long past my lifetime. The ONLY chain i would reuse a pin on, is something older than 1980, when the plates were thicker and the pins stuck out further. Doing so with most chains made in the last 20 years is tempting fate in a huge way. I just don't get all thw Shimano whining I guess.,,,,BD

3speed

^ I find it's easier to clean the chain if I can just pop off a quick-link and sit down with the chain by itself rather than sit there crouched near the bike, or standing at the work stand the whole time. Maybe I'm just lazy, but I much prefer a quick-link. I'm also about to take this bike on a tour around Europe for a couple months. It'll be a lot of miles and a lot of riding in a mix of dusty and constantly drizzly conditions at different points in the tour. I want to be able to pop the chain off and take it into the hostel with me to clean it rather than crouch outside near my bike trying to clean it. I also want to be able to easily pop on a quick-link and be done if I need to repair a chain failure. I'd rather not dick around with little pins through all of that, though I guess I may since rccardr has made the generous offer to send me a few. I wouldn't want to pay a few dollars a piece for the stupid single use pins vs. a quick-link, though.
I have dealt with plenty of chains, thank you. I've been working on bikes for years. "Have you never messed with chains before?" sounds condescending and is neither friendly nor helpful. That is why others are responding to you as such. Many of us here in C&V pride ourselves on the fact that this is generally a friendly and helpful forum. Anywho, as I said, I would donate it, since it's still basically a new chain. It just won't suit my needs. Otherwise if it were worn out then I would Recycle it.

dddd

+1 ^^ ...kinda sums it up from my own experience.

HG70 chain cannot safely have a partially pushed-out rivet re-inserted, because the peening shears off (to spare the chain's sideplate opening from enlargement).
I've done trailside repair for many riders who had just re-riveted an HG chain and had failure on the first ride. Chain failure can be very dangerous and destructive, as when a popped sideplate snags on the front derailer cage, stopping the pedals abruptly and of course ruining the front derailer.

KMC makes two models of "missing link" for 7-8-speed chain. MissingLink II is the narrower one for KMC, IG and SRAM chain, while the original Missing Link "Model 1" fits Shimano 7-8sp HG chain.

Missing Links are sold by the 6-pack for well under $20 online, and I use them in part because the Shimano pins became more expensive in recent years.

SRAM 9s links fit Shimano 9s chain, but SRAM 10s links do not fit Shimano 10s chain. A KMC 10s link probably fits a Shimano 10s chain, I'm only moderately certain that I've tried it.

Bikedued

Thankfully the broken Shimano chain never happened on my watch anyway. There was a pretty strong ridership there, including several full on triathlon riders with 12-15k rides. If you do your own make dang sure you know what you're doing. When done right it's as strong as an original joint. Sram chains and cassettes are top notch in my book. The only one with an issue was the top of the line $450 Power Dome. They machined it out of a solid chunk of titanium, and machined it all the way down to the freehub. So, after a while of riding the "cogs" would bend to one side or the other, making a smooth shift hard even on the friction setting. The very next year they stepped up though and completely redesigned to where the cogs were done in a coned based with the cogs just deep enough to accept the chain.,,,,BD

The nicest chain I personally ever had the pleasure of installing though, was a Wippermann Connex. I installed it on a Dura Ace equipped Tarmac SL4, and it was way quieter than any Shimano or Sram chain. It looked nicer too.

https://www.jejamescycles.co.uk/item-...hain-89430.jpg

3speed

Like I said, neither the Missing Link or the Missing Link II fit this 8sp Shimano HG chain. The Missing Link is clearly too wide, and the Missing Link II is just barely too narrow(same as the SRAM). I am to the point that I don't believe there is a quick-link for this one particular chain. I did find a ConneX quick-link that is 7.2mm, whereas the SRAM is 7.1, so I think the ConneX might do the trick, but I'm not going to bother ordering online, shipping, etc, to find out at this point. I'll just avoid Shimano chains like the plague in the future.

pastorbobnlnh 

I guess bad karma hit me on tonight's ride for suggesting we change lazyass' user name earlier today. My Missing Link on my KMC 9 speed chain decided to separate about 3 miles from home. This occurred as I was descending at 20 mph. Fortunately nothing bad happened. Other than the walk home.

dddd

I just checked the packaging of the Missing Links that I often use for the HG70 and HG91 chains, and it is labeled Missing Link, with no numerical designation.

The fine print says it is for 7.3mm 6, 7, and 8-speed chain. This is the wider version, the Missing Link II is for 7.1mm chain such as SRAM or IG chain.

Perhaps your too-wide one is a singlespeed link of some sort put into MissingLink packaging? Can you measure it's outside width in it's fully-engaged position?

3speed

^ Hmm... I'll go back to the LBS tomorrow and ask to check another package with a regular Missing Link. I would Love for it to all be because of a stupid packaging mishap. I measured this chain and it comes up at 7mm even. I'd bet it should be 7.1(probably my crappy Harbor Freight caliper), which is what the LBS guy said it should be and why he sold me the Missing Link II.

sunnyone

This is a neat idea. Exactly how would you do it?

dddd

Just to reiterate, the HG70 chain is listed as 7.3mm outside width, which the regular Missing Link should fit (Missing Link II shouldn't fit).

Prowler 

Gosh, lotta energy in this thread. Granted I'm a noob, but I've had no trouble finding a KMC Missing Link to fit my different chains and I'm pleased with how they work. BUT there is a lot of misinformation and vagueness and ignorance on line and at LBS. This is an example of why I own a pretty nice (but not really that expensive) vernier caliper; one what will measure to 10ths of a mm. When I need a link I measure the chain - the width across the two inside plates. Then I can search on line and at LBSs with facts; "I need a 7.1mm quick link". I too have found that even some good LBS techs don't have data - they just assume if the box says 8sp chain that must be true. You could even open the quick link package to measure the link if the package or the mfg website does not specify. If you can use hard data your search will be more productive. KMC alone has several widths - see their website. BTW I think their statement "non re-usable" is just for the lawyers. I've reused mine several times.

Oh, if in doubt I bump up. Use a 7.3mm link on a 7.1mm chain. Seems to track thru the transmission just fine. I have not had a link pop open in the wild. I carry a 7.3 in my kit so I can close most any chain I'm running if that does happen. And I'm using SRAM, Shimano and KMC chains. They all seem to act the same but I keep them clean and ride like an old man.

nfmisso

https://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u...d/SNB10122.jpg

Run the chain thru the saddle rails and the frame, shorten and pin together as normal.

dddd

The published widths of these chains, 7.1, 7.3mm, etc., this is the outside (maximum) width of the chain, over the bulged outer plates and over the ends of any protruding pins.

One can still measure the width of the inner link for comparison to the inside width of a prospective quick-link, to check for the existence of clearance, but I haven't seen these dimensions used by companies to describe their products.

3speed

OK, so this chain measures 7mm and the Missing Link II measures 7mm. I'm guessing they're both 7.1. The Missing Link is in fact too wide, and it wasn't a packaging mistake.

Bianchigirll 

I feel your pain.

I thought it would be a simple matter to swap out the 12-23 cassette on my Cornelo for a 28, figuring the 42-28 would mimick the 39-23s I have been riding. Much to my suorise I needed to remover 2 links to keep the jockey off the cog. OH what this a HG chain? despite all the junk I have around it seems I have no spare HG pins on hand

EDIT FWIW When I went to buy some HG pins the guy at the bike shop, the nice professional one not the grungy uncaring guys, suggested a KMC master link. I told hime the HG chain was most likely a 7spd since it was pout on a spd setup. He sold me a KMC Missinglink for 7.1mm 7&8 spd derailleur chains. I am friction shifting a Triomphe RD on a 7spd HG cassette and if shifted like buttah!