Unidentified Frames and Frame Numbers
08-30-14, 11:39 AM
#1
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Unidentified Frames and Frame Numbers
A few weeks ago @verktyg was kind enough (on another forum) to help me identify what my frame is NOT. That only leaves the question of what it IS.
So, a suggested thread is to put detail pics (like lugs, bridges, braze ons) and a serial number of unidentified frames and see if we can put 2 and 2 together and work out what thay might be. Hopefully the forum search function for number strings is up to it too!
Obviously I'll start with mine! Serial no is 8123003 stamped neatly under the BB, has 531 respray decals and looks to be good quality and of course european Simplex dropouts and matching simplex FD and RD, hopefully original. Marked up as a Gitane, but apparently not.
Of course I may be
but even if one person gets to ID their frame, I reckon it would be worth it.
So, a suggested thread is to put detail pics (like lugs, bridges, braze ons) and a serial number of unidentified frames and see if we can put 2 and 2 together and work out what thay might be. Hopefully the forum search function for number strings is up to it too!
Obviously I'll start with mine! Serial no is 8123003 stamped neatly under the BB, has 531 respray decals and looks to be good quality and of course european Simplex dropouts and matching simplex FD and RD, hopefully original. Marked up as a Gitane, but apparently not.
Of course I may be
but even if one person gets to ID their frame, I reckon it would be worth it.
08-30-14, 03:56 PM
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Why don't you do pictures of the whole frame not just parts. I would guess mid level bike as the lugs are not very fancy. If it is in fact Reynolds frame tubes and not just lables it might be a bit better than mid range. Most probably French so if there is a French version of this forum you might have better luck there. Roger.
08-30-14, 04:12 PM
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Definitely French, judging from the Simplex/Spidel component group and the Simplex dropout.
The rear brake bridge reinforcements does remind me of a Gitane, but the dropouts, domed stay ends and the plain, non windowed BCM lugs is more common (but not unique) on Peugeots of the 80's. Both manufacturers used Reymolds 531 tubing on their race bikes during the 70's and 80's. Wish I could see more of the bike, but at this point I'm on the fence between it being a Gitane or a Peugeot. Pictures of the whole frameset from both sides, the top tube cable guides, the bottom bracket can also help identify this bike.
The rear brake bridge reinforcements does remind me of a Gitane, but the dropouts, domed stay ends and the plain, non windowed BCM lugs is more common (but not unique) on Peugeots of the 80's. Both manufacturers used Reymolds 531 tubing on their race bikes during the 70's and 80's. Wish I could see more of the bike, but at this point I'm on the fence between it being a Gitane or a Peugeot. Pictures of the whole frameset from both sides, the top tube cable guides, the bottom bracket can also help identify this bike.
08-31-14, 05:14 AM
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verktyg
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Lugs appear to be Nervex DuBois which Peugeot used on PX-10s during the 1970s.
Reynolds 531SL (531 Extra Leger in French) decals on the forks are very likely original. "Repop" (replica) 531 SL and Extra Leger decals only became available a few years ago.
Reynolds 531SL became Reynolds 531P (531 Professional) around 1980-82.
The "Reemaillage" (respray) frame decal dates from 1984. It was probably repainted by a frame builder sometime in the 1980s.
These style Simplex dropouts appeared in the late 70s and fit either Simplex RDs or the de facto standard Campy style RDs which most derailleur brands had changed to.
The fluted seat stay tops are similar to those used on Motobecane bikes from 1977 through the early 1980s. I've never seen a Motobecane with Nervex DuBois lugs.
So what does MiloFrance have?
It's probably a late 1970s, high quality French frame made with Reynolds 531 Extra Leger tubing. It's likely a contstructeur built frame (small French custom frame builder). Many towns in France had at least one shop that custom made frames for cycling enthusiasts.
It should be a light, smooth riding bile.
verktyg
Chas.
Reynolds 531SL (531 Extra Leger in French) decals on the forks are very likely original. "Repop" (replica) 531 SL and Extra Leger decals only became available a few years ago.
Reynolds 531SL became Reynolds 531P (531 Professional) around 1980-82.
The "Reemaillage" (respray) frame decal dates from 1984. It was probably repainted by a frame builder sometime in the 1980s.
These style Simplex dropouts appeared in the late 70s and fit either Simplex RDs or the de facto standard Campy style RDs which most derailleur brands had changed to.
The fluted seat stay tops are similar to those used on Motobecane bikes from 1977 through the early 1980s. I've never seen a Motobecane with Nervex DuBois lugs.
So what does MiloFrance have?
It's probably a late 1970s, high quality French frame made with Reynolds 531 Extra Leger tubing. It's likely a contstructeur built frame (small French custom frame builder). Many towns in France had at least one shop that custom made frames for cycling enthusiasts.
It should be a light, smooth riding bile.
verktyg
Chas.
__________________
Don't believe everything you think! History is written by those who weren't there....
Chas. ;-)
Don't believe everything you think! History is written by those who weren't there....
Chas. ;-)
Last edited by verktyg; 08-31-14 at 05:19 AM.
08-31-14, 10:48 AM
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feros ferio
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We need the usual dimensions:
BB shell width (68 or 70mm)
BB shell threading (French, Swiss, ISO, English, Italian)
Seat tube OD (28.0 or 28.6mm)
Seat post OD (25 to 27.2mm)
BB shell width (68 or 70mm)
BB shell threading (French, Swiss, ISO, English, Italian)
Seat tube OD (28.0 or 28.6mm)
Seat post OD (25 to 27.2mm)
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"Far and away the best prize that life offers is the chance to work hard at work worth doing." --Theodore Roosevelt
Capo: 1959 Modell Campagnolo, S/N 40324; 1960 Sieger (2), S/N 42624, 42597
Carlton: 1962 Franco Suisse, S/N K7911
Peugeot: 1970 UO-8, S/N 0010468
Bianchi: 1982 Campione d'Italia, S/N 1.M9914
Schwinn: 1988 Project KOM-10, S/N F804069
"Far and away the best prize that life offers is the chance to work hard at work worth doing." --Theodore Roosevelt
Capo: 1959 Modell Campagnolo, S/N 40324; 1960 Sieger (2), S/N 42624, 42597
Carlton: 1962 Franco Suisse, S/N K7911
Peugeot: 1970 UO-8, S/N 0010468
Bianchi: 1982 Campione d'Italia, S/N 1.M9914
Schwinn: 1988 Project KOM-10, S/N F804069
08-31-14, 12:35 PM
#7
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Ohh plenty info!
Seat tube OD 28.4.
Seat post is a 26.0 but as suspected rattles about in the hole. A 27.2 is a bit big, but if the bolt was over tightened it may be measuring small. Look at the last but one pic above.
35 x 1" 68mm shell
Thanks all, great help!
Seat tube OD 28.4.
Seat post is a 26.0 but as suspected rattles about in the hole. A 27.2 is a bit big, but if the bolt was over tightened it may be measuring small. Look at the last but one pic above.
35 x 1" 68mm shell
Thanks all, great help!
Last edited by MiloFrance; 08-31-14 at 12:36 PM. Reason: more info
08-31-14, 03:08 PM
#8
verktyg
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Tubes were rarely round as they couldn't roll or draw them that accurately. In the early 70s Columbus and Vitus 172 main tubes were centerless ground to correct the out of roundness. It left a rough finish which had to be sanded smooth. That's one reason a number of Italian builders like Masi, Legnano and Frejus used Reynolds 531 tubing! It was smoother and more accurately drawn.
Getting back to the topic, the frame should take a 26.4mm or 26.6mm seatpost. The seat lug and seat tube might be severely out of round to require a 26mm seatpost.
Please check out this post on the GitaneUSA.com website (read all the way to the bottom). It covers a lot of the problems with seatpost fit and how to fix them:
gitaneusa.com :: View topic - 1984 Team Pro Seatpost Diameter
PS: See, I told you it would be a great riding bike!
verktyg
Chas.
__________________
Don't believe everything you think! History is written by those who weren't there....
Chas. ;-)
Don't believe everything you think! History is written by those who weren't there....
Chas. ;-)
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