lenos

Sure they make a lot of other things, including the Margherita shifter setup, but has anyone ever heard of them building frames/bikes?

I picked up this beast yesterday, Campagnolo 50's Gran Sport, Magistroni crank, Balilla center-pull brakes, Gnutti hubs with Campagnolo licensed QRs.

An ideas?

CliffordK

Interesting.
Post some photos of the complete bike.

I'm seeing some notes about Vittoria derailleurs, but not the bikes. I wonder if like Cinelli, the company made bikes plus certain components (tires for Vittoria, handlebars for Cinelli), then changed to concentrate on a single product line.

Why don't you send a note to Vittoria and see if they have some information about whether their company built bicycles in the past.

juvela

hello lenos,

i had one come through my workshop with the same headplate as yours. iirc it was lugless and the sort of tenspeed sold in u.s. discount houses in the early to mid 1960's. the headplate was enameled in full colour. the vittoria name appears in a rainbow band and each band of the rainbow is enameled in a different colour.

the vittoria name is used by the atalanta gomma rubber company for bicycle tyres and tubes. the company also made gum rubber brake hoods and the fulmine tubular tyre carrier. afaik there is no connection between them and the vittoria bicycles.

readers of the forum might be able to give additional information regarding your bicycle if you could post additional imagery.

obrentharris 

When I was 11 years old (1963) my best friend had a Vittoria with a very similar headbadge but enameled as described by juvela. My memory is rather hazy of that distant past but I do recall that it had lugs and cottered cranks, that it was dark blue, and that I was extremely envious of the Campagnolo derailleurs. It was probably purchased at "Vince's Bike Shop," a little hole-in-the-wall on El Camino Real in San Mateo. Vince was the genuine item, immigrated from Italy and called everyone "Cousin." That was back when bike shops were narrow dark tunnels with every inch of wall space covered with tires, parts, and bikes: No carpeting or rooms full of the latest cycling apparel back then!

I haven't seen a Vittoria since but I've been keeping my eyes open.
Brent

juvela

since all three examples cited thus far were found in california i wonder if perhaps there was an importer for this marque in the state at this time...

the equipment described by lenos certainly sounds like the late fifties to early sixties time period. the example which came through my workshop did so about thirty years ago.

hope you are able to upload additional pictures lenos.

lenos

I'll post more pictures later but at this point it is a frame/fork and a box of parts.

lenos

Here it is in all its splendor. A little rough but it looks like it was a fairly nice bike in its day. Components included Gran Sport front and rear derailleurs, and levers, Balilla center pull brakes with a script logo, Magistroni cranks, Gnutti hubs with campy licensed skewers. Some of what is shown has already had the ultrasonic treatment.

juvela

hello lenos,

thank you for the additional images. appears we are looking at a one up from the bottom sort of machine from the late fifties or early sixties. frame constructed of Agrati "AM" lugset and bulge-formed head.

as you have likely already noticed the Gnutti quick release skewer cams operate "backwards" from most others. this was done to get around the Tullio patent.

iirc the one i had come through about thirty years ago was a lower model than yours.

thank you for sharing the bicycle/project with the forum.

lenos

Thanks for the info. These Gnutti skewers are actually licensed by Campagnolo, so maybe a little more interesting.

Regards,

juvela

yes, i saw that. that is why they work "backwards." later gnutti skewers operate "normally." likely has to do with patent expiry. iirc under italian law patents are granted for a fourteen year term and can be renewed once. so after twenty-eight years they lapse.

in case you would like to bracket the date of the bicycle a bit more finely its campagnolo gran sport rear derailleur may be of assistance. there are various periods or generations for these. if you go to velobase.com they have detail photos together with dates for the different variations.

you made no mention of your machine's pedals; did you get them with the bike? iirc it would have come with sheffield brand pedals; likely one of the quill models but perhaps one of the rattrap models.

have fun with the project.

juvela

came upon a further example this week. photos are from a cl offering. headplate reads vittoria but machine's transfers also say fiorelli:



wrt dating: seems slightly odd to me that a cycle fitted with huret allvit 1900 rear mech would have a suicide front mech. model 1900 launch is given as 1962. seems just a hair late for a suicide front. other readers will know more...

CliffordK

Nice find, and in good shape. Did you bring it home yet?

I wouldn't be surprised if the RD has been changed over the last half century.

Are the rear dropouts smooth, or toothed?

juvela

seller makes it clear in their text that they are not a bicycle person. so photos, despite their number, leave some questions unanswered. does the metal knob on the juy front mech indicate it to be a french or an italian example? pedals obviously sheffield. chianset looks like it may be agrati. not quite enough res to read the stamping on the rh crankarm head. oops, writing on outer c/w looks like it may say magistroni. lugset, bulge-formed head, and crown are agrati. identity of shift lever appears to be juy so it presumably came ex-works with an all juy gear ensemble. stem & bar set may be schierano. too bad we cannot see the rear sidepull caliper better; possible it may be original. since transfers read "export" it may be built with 27" wheels.

evidently another badge for fiorelli to add to coppi. wonder if they did any others as well...

CliffordK

It looks like it is probably a simplex shifter.



Dave Moulton's Blog - Dave Moulton's Bike Blog - Suicide*Shifters

It looks like it is a fun transitional era bike.... assuming that it isn't too bastardized with mismatched parts which is also a possibility... either older parts than the frame, or newer parts.

How much is the seller asking?

To me, a really old bike would be fun, but probably not one that would get ridden a lot, so it would be hard to justify spending a lot.

3speedslow

That BB has got a serious rust problem. Have you investigated it yet? That looks like a nice frame to save.

IMO, I would think about a paint job as well. It really looks trashed and the lugs and fork are quite attractive as is the headbadge.

It's this type of bike that would stand out from the crowd cause you don't see them that often.

Look forward to the build.

juvela

here are some additional images -



seller began listing at $450 and subsequently reduced to $250.

here are the two links:

Fiorelli Vittoria Olympic Vintage Road Bike

Fiorelli Vittoria Olympic Vintage Road Bike - $250

machine located in the San Francisco Bay Area. thus far, all examples mentioned in thread have been found in California. this leads one to suspect that there may have been a distributor for them in the state at one point.

since they would seem to be manufactured by Fiorelli one is led to the person of John W. Murphy, a bicycle distributorship located on Shipley Street in San Francisco. this company was an agent for Fiorelli/Coppi bicycles. do not know if they go back far enough to have brought in the cycles discussed here. only know them from about 1969-81. the company closed in the early 1980's.

readers with a long view of cycling in California may be able to make some helpful input here. authorities such as @Scooper and @verktyg amongst others...

kennymann

In 1963, I had a Vittoria (with a "suicide" shifter front derailleur, slightly different from the one pictured -- ivory-colored plastic tip), bought from an independent auto parts store (Ed's Auto) in San Rafael, CA. Cost 1/3 of what a Schwinn Varsity cost at the time -- which is why my parents bought them for me and my brother for Xmas when I was 11 years old. Mine was the same color as the yellow one pictured above, with the same labeling and badge, but not the label on the top tube. No memory on brands of parts. Did not have skewered hubs -- mine had knock-offs with large alloy wings. Brakes were steel side-pulls.

ussalmon

I know this is a long shot but does anyone knows the whereabouts of this bike?, I would like to contact the owner to see if he can take closeup pictures of the decals for me so i can re create a set for a bike that is being restored. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

juvela

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hello Gus

images of chartreuse example posted by me come from a Los Angeles CL listing of about ten years ago

have no further information on cycle or seller



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ussalmon

No problem.

I was able by work with those pictures.

Thanks!