eddiexchoi

I'm new here and needing some help with identifying the year/model of this bike and help rebuilding it. I would like to thank you or anyone in advance for taking your time to read my posting and giving me help.
People that I ride often always talk about steel bike and that "steel is real" so I did some research and wanted to get me one also. Came across a cheap and old Bianchi which didn't have much damage to the frame so I bought it. I only been riding for about 2 years and had repair on few of the bikes that I've owned and have no clue what I need to do for this. I am looking to upgrade all the parts, including the drive train but not sure what would be the best. Lot of people told me to be original as much as possible but I rather have more gears. Any suggestions and/or recommendation would be greatly appreciated. I have some time to build this bike and have limited budget for now so it will be work in progress. Only reason I am building this bike is so that I can give my 2011 Cannondale CAAD 10 to my younger brother as a gift since he donated one of his kidney to our mother, which is priceless!

thumpism 

Looks like the model name is on the top tube just below the first cable guide. I can't read it, but is it the Brava? Probably an '84 or '85. Regarding more gears you might be able to add in inner ring to the crankset so you have a triple. Might need a longer BB spindle even if the crank takes the third ring. That might be the cheapest way to more gears. Good luck!

desconhecido 

It appears to be a sturdy and serviceable bike, but, if it were mine, I wouldn't put a bunch of money into upgrades. Service the bearings, do the cables, brake pads, maybe a saddle to your liking. True the wheels. New chain and freewheel (maybe go to a 7 speed if the frame spacing in the rear is 126 mm). Clean it up, wax it, ride the heck out of it, and save your money for something better. IMO, your effort and money would be better spent making the bike in its current configuration as pretty and well working as possible. Some solvent, grease, aluminum polish, and work and you can have that bike looking and performing as well as it did new -- maybe better.

If it's friction shift (I assume it is) and you want indexed, going to a "modern" 7 speed freewheel and selecting a relatively inexpensive Shimano 7 speed compatible rear derailleur (most of them will be) then you just need some indexed shifters. Indexed 7 speed down tube shifters are probably ebay available for not much. You can get 7 speed brifters, too, but that may be a budget buster -- I don't know.

In the late 80s, Suntour had a 7 speed indexed system called Accushift (I think). It worked very well, in my experience. Maybe that stuff is available relatively cheaply, though it would probably be down tube shifters.

Probably going to 8 speed or more, which would require a cassette hub, afaik, isn't worth the expense.

eddiexchoi

The sticker says "special". Is that the model? I dont know much but i dont think I've heard or seen that model... does anyone know where i can look this up? Model and year? Not too important but just would like to know what bike i have...

eddiexchoi

Thank you for that. I kind of wanted to upgrade to what is currently avaliable in the market.. like shimano 105 or ultegra... dont know much about sram or campy but some people i know is saying sram or campy might work/look better? Lol not much into looks but defiantly want something that will work with this... one of my buddy got a bridgestone 700 (?) And changed to ultegra and it looks awsm in my opinion... kind of wanted the vintage frame with new school drive train? I know that means new groupset along with new wheelset... thinking of spending about 500 to 700 with a new paint job... i know a buddy who owns a auto body shop who is willing to do the paint for free but not sure if they know how to paint bike frames?

CycleryNorth81

I think the Magny Ishiwata tubing is a mid level tubing so I would not spend money on a Shimano 105 or Ultegra group on the bike. If you clean, wax and lube the bearing as Desconhecido suggested, it is a very classic bike from that time period.

You can get a lot of bike for $500-700 on Craiglist if you are looking for something more high end. Look for Reynolds or Columbus tubing.

thumpism 

You can do what you like, of course, but that's a lot of money to throw at an '80s mid-range road bike. You might have a nice example when you're done, but you must question whether it is cost-effective to do so when what you'll have is a repainted, upgraded '80s mid-range road bike.

Second look at that crank tells me it will NOT accept an inner third chainring, so the recommendations for different freewheels are the best way to proceed.

Here's one in another thread, with some upgrades:
https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-vi...i-special.html

Narhay

If you like the bike you can do something like what has been done in this thread:
https://www.bikeforums.net/classic-vi...i-s-ergos.html

It will cost quite a bit more than the bike is worth as it sits but again if you really like the frame and it fits then go for it.

Me, I would service bearings, replace cables and housings, chain, freewheel, clean and lube everything, new bar tape and brake hoods and maybe some new tires. It will feel like a brand new bike and you can ride it like that. You may find that a bit of maintenance will make it feel very different. If you don't like the shifting you can try some barcons (suntour makes some that would work well) as bar end shifters to change it up a bit. You could also add the 7 speed freewheel and give yourself a new gear and change the range of gears in the back.

jimmuller 

I can't be sure, but that looks to me like a pretty nice bike. I have an '87 Brava, also a "mid-range" road bike, and I really like it. Like Narhay said, the trick to making yours into a superb rider is to fix or upgrade what is important.

For gears, that RD looks like a Suntour arx-GT which Velobase.com says can handle a 34T rear cog and accommodate 32 teeth of chain take-up. That means you could swap the FW for a 34T or 32T and climb just about anything. You'd need more chain links but you could use a new chain anyway. Try a KMC Z8, or SRAM PC-870 (for more money). New tires and cables, maybe KoolStop brake pads. True up the wheels, repack the hubs and the BB, and maybe the headset too. What size wheels are they, and how are your roads? I'd suggest you try 25mm Panaracer Pasela tires, maybe with their Puncture Technology (or whatever they call it now). If the wheels' measure about 19mm wide on the outside, 13mm in the inside, then consider 23mm tires if your roads are decent and you aren't too heavy. Some people argue that wider wheels roll more easily, but they are also heavier which you can really feel, which is why I like lighter tires. Then ride it like you stole it.

As for spending money, tires, chain, cables aren't free. But expense is a matter of perspective. A decent frame with good wheels and components will ride better than a great frame with lesser wheels. So I don't consider it a matter of what the bike is worth. It's a matter of what any upgrade is worth.

Thumpic

That's a nice bike and will make a great vintage rider. It will never be a satisfactory modern bike. If you want to make it the best it can be and enjoy it, you can have a sweet ride. If you want brifters, a swoopy saddle and carbon bar tape, spend your money on a newer bike. Or flip that one to start your new bike fund.

Lascauxcaveman 

Step 1: New chain, tires, tubes, cables, clean and lube all bearings and derailleur pivots.

Step 2: ride it a couple hundred miles and see how you like it.

After that, you'll have a better idea what to do. Don't buy a lot of high end parts for it just yet. LA is a great market to go check out a lot of good used bikes on Craigslist, if you have the interest and the time. YOu may very well want to save your upgrade fever for a better frame. Though this one is not bad.

zazenzach

This is a lower end bike. Ishiwata Magny tubing was only one step up from hi-ten (probably even weighed the same).

Get it riding, dont put one penny more into it. You can get a real nice bike for $500 off craigslist.

Seabass_First

that crankset is cool!

these guys are right, don't poor money into this one, use it to learn about bike maintenance.... just clean it up and ride it/flip it...

btw sounds like you have an awesome brother! congrats!

jimmuller 

More on spending money - Do not bother painting this frame unless you have some serious emotional attachment to it, such as it was given to you by your wife when she first met you 25 years ago. Many newcomers to the vintage bike world think of restoring a bike to its original condition or appearance. That is usually a bad idea unless the bike was particularly noteworthy and the frame needs paint for protection. We euphemistically refer to scratches and faded paint as patina, but those defects do represent its history and experience.

That's all fuzzy aesthetics. The real factor in your case is expense. It isn't worth paying someone to paint it because it isn't really special. Your body-shop friend may do it for free but painting a bike well requires prep work too. Besides the usual paint prepping, you or he will have to protect the threads of the BB and the surfaces of the HT and fork crown. You'll probably want to remove the entire HS, then re-install them. You'll need to pull the drive-side (fixed) BB cup.

Just clean up the frame and do all that other stuff. Then ride it.

due ruote 

Agree with others, try a light paint polish like Meguiar's, then wax. Don't bother painting, it should clean up well.

I'd go with a 7 speed freewheel. If it turns out you really like the bike but not the downtube shifters, you could switch to bar ends. If you want them indexed, go with Shimano and pick up a Deore rear derailleur. It will shift like butter and handle whatever range of gears you choose.

John E

Good advice. Skip the indexing -- there is nothing wrong with friction shift, which lets you do a lot of mix-and-match and upgrading of components. Get 32 or 34T in back, and see if that gets you up the local hills.

desconhecido 

I agree about using friction shifters and having them on the downtube. Works fine, lasts a long time, all that. But, indexed shifting really is a nice feature and many people, for whatever reason, just don't like shifters on the downtube. Somebody I've known a long time told me the other day that they are "dangerous" on the downtube. I held my tongue. Sort of like manual transmission cars. That's what I drive, and always will. Auto transmissions are for little old ladies with one leg. But, it seems I am in the minority on that issue as well. Actually, auto transmission technology has advanced to the level that they are more efficient than manual and if I ever buy a car again, it will probably be auto for that reason.

John E

I understand the downtube shifter objections, but there are lots of good friction workarounds, including barcons and handlebar mounting pods. My point is simply that indexing contributes very little, and it is downright counterproductive on the front derailleur. My sons choose to drive cars with manual transmissions, but I really like tiptronics and similar shiftable automatics, maybe because my left knee has been immobilized twice because of patellar dislocations. When I am physically unable to ride a bike, I want at least to be able to drive a car.

desconhecido 

I have a couple bikes with indexed rear and friction front. I think that's the way Campagnolo used to be. One is a 1997 C 9 speed the other is a more recent bike, a Bob Jackson touring frame, that I have set up with 8 speed Ultegra spaced to Campagnolo 8 speed with Record brifters. The RD on the BJ is the Campagnolo Racing Triple (ha, ha) that they made back in 1997. I can do friction shifting and I think it's fine and all that, but when I ride either of these bikes, I don't miss it.

Also have a bike with 8 speed Campagnolo indexed DT shifters shifting a seven speed rear freewheel. It works very well. For that particular bike, the change from friction to indexed was very much appreciated by its rider when I converted it back in 1997. Of course, the front is just friction.

The first bike that I rode with indexed shifting was a Santana tandem that we had back in the late 80s early 90s. It had a seven speed freewheel with Suntour indexed shifting. I would say that my experience on that bike was that the indexing contributed more than just a little.

As for auto shifting transmissions: as far as operating, it's my opinion that the auto aspect contributes little or nothing. Six years ago I had my left hip replaced and I was driving the standard shift vehicles within a week of the surgery (modern orthopedic surgery is a miracle). These are passenger vehicles, not big heavy duty trucks with clutches requiring a lot of force. Once you get the car rolling, you don't really need the clutch for shifting, if you're modestly clever with throttle control and if your transmission has good syncros. If you only have the use of one leg, you could have a hand assist for the throttle installed to get you going from a stop. Or, a hand operated clutch. Maybe if I lost both legs, one arm and four of the fingers on the other hand I'd consider an automatic. But, I recognize that many, perhaps most, people disagree with me about automatic transmission vehicles. They find more than a little advantage even though there are almost always manual transmission options available. For example, if you can't find a new pickup to suit your needs with a manual, you can likely find a 69 Ford with 3 on the tree and OD. Now, that was a truck.

Having had some joint issues, I honestly understand your concerns and am not being intentionally flippant. Modern orthopedic surgery really is a miracle and it gets better every day. I've had many friends and acquaintances ask for an opinion, because I have a little experience, and my advice is always the same. If someone has a joint that is causing a lifestyle or pain problem and surgery is an available option, go for it. The improvement is immediate and truly miraculous.

armstrong101

That bike wouldn't recover much on resale. It's a Japanese-made (not Italian) Bianchi, and it's not in Celeste. These two points severely limit its upside. I'm just saying this before you decide to spend a lot on upgrading it.

eddiexchoi

thank you all for your comments!!! it really helps a lot but very mixed feelings... I guess I will try to salvage what I can and try to ride it "as-is" for now? not too familiar with quill system and saw the threaded to threadless conversation kit but someone at a LBC told me not to... arggg... just have to play around and see which direction I'm going... does anyone know what year and model this is? and the geometry?

eddiexchoi

I was also told that Ishiwata Magny has different grades? if so, how can you distinguish? and somewhere I saw that the Ishiwata Magny is better than Columbus and/or Reynolds? Do I have the wrong info?

Paramount1973 

That statement is uninformed and I am being charitable here. Magny-X tubing was Ishiwata's seamed strip manganese-molybdenum tubing, similar to mid-level offerings from Reynolds (like 501), True Temper, and Tange. That bike is double-butted through-out, fork, tubes, and stays. It has forged dropouts with dropout adjusters on the rear. It is hardly a low end bike. This is an '80s era Japanese Bianchi and they are pretty nice bikes, certainly on par with mid-level offerings from Trek, Schwinn, and any of the Japanese manufacturers from that era.

Magny-X tubing is mentioned here in part 2 of the lowdown on tubing:
The Lowdown on Bicycle Tubing

Sheldon Brown mentions Japanese Bianchis here:
Japanese Bicycles in the U.S. Market

jimmuller 

Do not bother converting to a threadless stem. You simply have no reason to. More importantly, you really need to ride it, ride it a lot, and ride it even more before you can judge anything about it. Vintage bikes can be wonderful but you wouldn't know that if you listen to riders of modern bikes or LBS employees.

FWIW, you shouldn't be judging it for its "value" unless you expect to sell it to finance another bike. a101's comment that it is Japanese and is not Celeste may be true for its resale value, but that doesn't make it a worse bike. Bianchi made lots of bikes that weren't Celeste, and only collectors or buyers who want a particular feature or model will care.

My Bianchi Brava is Japanese, and black. I found the frame on ebay, thought it was interesting and put in a bid. I expected to lose and was shocked when I won. I built it up with various components, all "middle-end" or better. I was even more shocked when I first rode it. It was spectacular. My longest ride on it so far was about ~80 miles but I have no doubt I'd be comfortable riding it on a century. Two years ago I commuted on it about 1000 miles. I've been told the frame was chrome-moly, possibly double-butted, but the frame carries no tubing sticker; where the sticker would normally go there is a World Championship Boulder, Colorado sticker. It doesn't matter. As equipped it weighs about 24lbs, and the ride is wonderful.

Well, it really depends on the particular tubing. You'd have a hard time finding anyone who'd say anything is better than Reynolds or Columbus. Some would claim Reynolds 501 is about equal to 531. Truth is, you probably can't tell the difference on a well-designed bike.

The real advantage with a boutique steel is a small savings in weight. All steels have the same density and elastic properties. They differ in tensile strength. With a stronger steel you can have thinner tubes, but there is a flexibility price to pay. Reynolds 753, for example, will be lighter than 531, but not so much that it matters unless you are racing. The same goes with the various Columbus and Tange and Ishiwata tubing. Any decent, well-built bike will be just fine! You need to ride it. Ride it. Ride it!

zazenzach

My fault. I looked at the fork and all i saw was Magny. Magny X is a bit different.

If i remember correctly, magny x was later rebranded by fuji as valite. if that's true, i can say from personal experience that it was pretty decent stuff. Probably around reynolds 520 in terms of weight/strength quality.