JMONAY

I've been a happy, loving owner of a 1958 Raleigh Sports with its original Sturmey-Archer Dynohub and SW 3-speed rear since November 2013. Apparently it was one of the few SW's that actually worked. The bike led a hard life and was then left outdoors under an awning for at least a decade before I got it. I rode the bike daily until the summer, gave it a cosmetic restoration and flushed out the hub with WD-40 (I didn't have the tools to disassemble it at that point) and then kept riding it. It has trucked along flawlessly and silently up and down the Ann Arbor hills until now.



Ever since the summer, I've kept a up a rather generous oiling routine, which was about 4-5 ml of SAE 30 motor oil every month or so. I know this is overkill and it did leave a sticky black mess on my rear wheel but I figured it was okay to run a "total loss oiling system" so the hub internals would be washed clean every so often.

Recently, however, I've cut back a little on oiling. And by that, I mean I haven't topped it off since maybe early February. Sounds okay, right? Well last week, after letting ol' Gwendolyn sit for a week while I was away for spring break, I started noticing that moving the pedals backward at a stoplight took a little more effort than it used to. I paid more attention to it but it still shifted fine. I then parked the bike because it needed new brake cables (still waiting for knarps to arrive) and for the last maybe five days, the bike has not wanted to freewheel. It's not completely stuck and it still shifts, but I'll say it's difficult to spin the pedals backwards in any gear. It's so sticky that when I wheel the bike forward with the kickstand down, the pedal moves it back up. I'm more mystified as to why it got so bad so quickly.

So, I'm wondering if any of what I wrote above sounds to anyone like I have done something wrong regarding the maintenance of this hub. For example:

- Wrong oil? SAE 20 (or blue label 3-in-1, but not black label) was suggested, SAE 30 was said to be fine and it was the only single-stage oil I could find anyway.
- Too much oil? like did it build up and/or leave gunk?
- Let it sit too long with too much oil? Gwendolyn has never been happy with not being ridden.
- Was flushing it out with WD-40 the wrong thing to do?

Or has the old SW sucked up a broken pawl or otherwise bit the dust?

I think I may have the right tools to take the hub apart now and do an inspection and cleaning, but if the unthinkable has happened, I do have a leftover '79 AW hub to take its place. I would like to keep the SW running if possible since it was so lovely and the super wide ratios suit my commute better. Any advice and expertise would be appreciated before I blow the hub apart.

Cattywompus

I can't offer any help, but good luck! That's a pretty bike you have.

Salubrious

Wow- I've not heard of anyone that had or seen an SW that works.

Apparently this one does not either... I suspect one of those half moon pawl thingys has shattered. I've got an SW doner hub yours free for the price of shipping if you are interested on one for parts. I really liked the gear range on mine too FWIW. It works sorta, does the usual dropping out in 3rd gear. PM if interested.

JMONAY

Thanks I'll need it. And yeah, I love this bike to death. It not only looks good, but rides (or rode) beautifully. It's the one I'd keep if I could only keep one.

JMONAY

Ooh, I'm interested! I'll message you in a sec

JohnDThompson 

I have an SW hub I use occasionally. The problems I see with it are largely temperature related; when it gets cold, the springless pawls are reluctant to engage.

The good news is, the SW hubs are easy to overhaul, vis-a-vis the ubiquitous AW hubs: fewer parts, no fiddly pawl springs, etc. If you open the hub, examine the pawls for damage. If you find erosion on the pawls, you can often reverse them to expose new surfaces to wear. Failing that, Sheldon Brown explains how you can modify an SW hub with flat springs to eliminate the lack of engagement that often occurs. Be aware that this modification is not permanent: the pawls bear against the flat spring and eventually erode through it, requiring replacement. But if you keep on top of it, it may be all you need.

JMONAY

Yeah, I've read what Sheldon Brown wrote about the springs but forgot I could try reversing the pawls. Maybe I should re-read. I guess the only way to determine a final solution will be to take it apart first, which might be soon, or maybe not. It hadn't occurred to me, but I can definitely imagine that the springs would make the AW harder to service (especially the fact that they're torsion springs, gosh darn). Regarding temperature, I can see why problems would surface in the cold. Ironically, my bike has plowed through the last two winters like a champ and the trouble began when the weather started to warm up.

Ed.

Does the problem still occur if the bike is inside and warm?

I would hazard a guess (and it's only a guess as I have no personal experience) that it's not a mechanical failure - I think that would manifest itself with shifting problems and/or 'noise' of some sort.

crank_addict

Great reply's but the majority of the time its simply a gunked up hub. I'll add, if sub-par lube is used, the over gunk will cause MORE wear on the pawls as their not fully catching.

~~~Lay the wheel / hub on its side, drain as much oil out as possible. Fully saturate the internals with WD40, run while on the stand, repeat with the WD40 flush until it drains nice and clean. Fill with just under a teaspoon of Tri-flow (1/2 t.spoon is fine), adjust cable accordingly. DO NOT OVERFILL, as it serves no purpose. I've experimented with all sorts of lubes including synthetics. The Tri-flow for whatever it does is outstanding and for all temps. The hub will sound completely different and kind of like a Hugi...lol. Park with oil port at 1200 and leaned opposite the drive side. The telltale of low oil is when you no longer notice weepage. Crude and low tech, but its like an antique car. Replenish with just a nominal amount and its good to go.

JMONAY

Yeah, it's been indoors for the last few days and is still sticky. And yes, there is a possibility it isn't actually broken but a spare parts hub will probably be nice to have down the road either way as I plan to keep this bike forever.

JMONAY

Nice explanation. I do understand that the wrong lube can cause more trouble. Pennzoil SAE 30 seemed like a good idea to me but I knew it was going to be a gamble. It is of course optimized to run at higher temperatures and pressures, after all. I will be taking a look once I have the hub apart and seeing how gunked up the parts are. I flushed it with WD40 last summer and it took like 3/4 of a can until it ran clean. If it's gunked up again, that means the oil I'm using isn't ideal. I'll take your advice on the tri-flow, I've used that at my bike share tech job and I love it. And I find the antique car analogy very easy to relate to, haha. I've been into them for my entire life, whereas my bike hobby started with this old Raleigh. Thanks for the info

JMONAY

I've been meaning to get back to this thread just to update all you helpful folks on my findings.

Details and photos are here

In short, I diassembled my hub and found that everything was extremely clean and not gunked up at all. Pawls were a little dented and one planet was chipped, but that was it. I think my sticking problem came from not tightening a bearing lock nut enough, leading to it tightening itself on the bearings (YIKES!!) because I was able to recreate that problem. Either that or it was that chip off the planet getting caught on something, but I couldn't tell.

@Salubrious, I took the pawls, planets, and clutch from your hub and measure the pawls the best I could to come up with two sets that were most matched in size. Your hub also looked to have a lot less mileage than mine. I can't thank you enough for your contribution.

So, my SW now runs better than ever. As expected, the right combination of shifting/engagement technique and the right parts makes these things happy. That being said, I enjoyed the SW for a couple weeks and I've just swapped the rear wheel back out for the AW one I'd been running in the meantime. I'll be keeping the SW safe for when my needs of the bike become less abusive and demanding (i.e. no longer banging around hilly Ann Arbor on a daily basis). It is easier to keep up with traffic when you're not chasing pawl engagement for half a revolution after a shift. My Sports seems to be happy with the AW, as I am. Now that I've had a chance to compare, I actually think the AW's ratio spread suits me better now that more of my current commute involves flat ground. Although I have a 48/20 tooth ratio, I find that this thing accelerates as if it weighs half as much as it does (this was the case with the old hub as well). It has always been such a delight to ride, whether sailing along with cars or plootering about in the park. Even when compared to my nicer, lighter, and more-geared bikes.

Again, thank you all so much for you help. Cheers!

Salubrious

I'm glad you were able to put it to use- good luck with it!