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  1. #51
    Fat Man, Tiny Bike
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    I was looking at the Forte Titan and Forte Gemini on Performance, do any of you have experience with these wheels. The titan only has 20 spoke in the rear and 16 in the front. Being 256 I worry that might be too much for that to handle. The Gemini is 24/28 which I think would be better. It will be a few months before I purchase and I am hoping to drop about 20 lbs before then. Would I be alright with the titan if I lost 20, or would I need the gemini and would I be able to ride the gemini at my current weight?
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  2. #52
    Senior Member Sakae Custom's Avatar
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    I have two bikes,

    First, my Serotta Track is Velocity Deep V 32h laced 3x to campy low in the back, laced radialy in the front to a campy low, no problems so far, but this is on the track,

    My street bike conversion is phil highs laced 3x with 32 double buted spokes to Velocity Deep Vs

    Bomb Proof, over terrible chicago streets

  3. #53
    Senior Member Dubbayoo's Avatar
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    Rolf Vigor RS wheelset would rock. The thing is they make a set of Vigors for tandems that are still only 20f/24r. If that will support two 150 lb people and a 45 lb bike I would think the Rolf Vigor RS would support one 250 lb person.

  4. #54
    L-I-V-I-N dtrain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIGITAL39
    I was looking at the Forte Titan and Forte Gemini on Performance, do any of you have experience with these wheels. The titan only has 20 spoke in the rear and 16 in the front. Being 256 I worry that might be too much for that to handle. The Gemini is 24/28 which I think would be better. It will be a few months before I purchase and I am hoping to drop about 20 lbs before then. Would I be alright with the titan if I lost 20, or would I need the gemini and would I be able to ride the gemini at my current weight?
    I don't know that I'd recommend either of those Performance wheelsets for a Clydesdale. If you want something on the cheap, what about OP/Ultegra? If you had the money to spend today, I'd point you towards the silver Mavic Cosmos or Alta Comps on Nasbar that are 30% off (and the available 20% coupon).
    Last edited by dtrain; 10-12-06 at 04:57 PM.
    "The older you do get, the more rules they're gonna try to get you to follow. You just gotta keep livin', man, L-I-V-I-N." - Wooderson

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  5. #55
    Senior Member Dubbayoo's Avatar
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    A few known wheel weight limits

    Model - spokes - weight limit
    American Classic
    Carbon 58 - 18/24 - 225lbs
    420 Bladed - 18/24 - 225lbs

    Canecreek
    Aros 38 - 24/28 - 190lbs
    Aros 58 - 18/28 - 190lbs

    Reynolds
    DV46C - 20/24 - no limit
    MV32C - 20/24 - no limit

    Rolf
    Prima Vigor RS - 14/16 - none stated
    Prima Vigor Tandem - 20/24 - 350lbs
    * although Rolf himself has done tandem races where he and his partner totaled 440 lbs, this would make a good single Clyde wheel; 1875g set [820g/1035g].

    Campagnolo doesn't give limits, instead they state:

    The lifespan of Campagnolo® components depends on many factors, such as rider size and riding conditions. Impacts, falls, improper use or harsh use in general may compromise the structural integrity of the components and significantly reduce their lifespan. Some components are also subject to wear over time. Please have your bicycle regularly inspected by a qualified mechanic for any cracks, deformation, signs of fatigue or wear (use of penetrating fluid or other visual enhancers to locate cracks on aluminum parts is recommended). If the inspection reveals any deformation, cracks, impact marks or stress marks, no matter how slight, immediately replace the component; components that have experienced excessive wear also need immediate replacement. The frequency of inspection depends on many factors; check with your authorized Campagnolo® representative to select a schedule that is best for you. If you weigh 82 kg/180 lbs or more, you must be especially vigilant and have your bicycle inspected more frequently (than someone weighting less than 82 kg/180 lbs) for any evidence of cracks, deformation, or other signs of fatigue or stress. Check with your mechanic to discuss whether the components you selected are suitable for your use, and to determine the frequency of inspections.

  6. #56
    SLJ 6/8/65-5/2/07 Walter's Avatar
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    A few thoughts from experience. I let my weight get as high as 260+ not too long ago. At that time I was riding Open Pros (32 spoke) on Chorus hubs (NOS 8 speed). No problems. Switched to Ksyrium SSCs b/c I could get a set used from a source I trusted. They have been great. Don't know if they're much lighter but do spin up faster. They held up when I was at 260 and now that I'm at 234 and dropping I figure they must be singing with joy every mile.

    New SSCs are not in your range but my experience is that modern low spoke wheels that have earned a reputation for toughness are legit. Btw those words are coming from a rider who is at least a bit of a retrogrouch as well, but the modern wheels do seem to be durable.

    Those Ventos do look way cool. I haven't ordered from Total in awhile, that may change soon, real soon. .

    Good luck



    “Life is not one damned thing after another. Life is one damned thing over and over.”
    Edna St. Vincent Millay

  7. #57
    Amateur stunt driver D0ugB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BikeWise1
    In my opinion the Open Pro is nowhere near as strong as the Deep V. The Deep V has got triangulation on it's side along with about 40g of metal. I don't like to spec Open Pro for riders over 200lb.

    Totally agree. The RR1.1 is a great rim, but in this case I'd probably spec the deeper RR1.2....and that leaves, what, $180 for hubs, spokes and labor? Remember folks, the hub is the heart of the wheel. Whatever you do, don't cheap out on the hubs. When the hub dies, so does the wheel.

    Just to add to the experience base. I like many of you have never had a major problem with a front rim. The following comments apply to rear only.

    My first bad experience is with the Bontrager Select I pulled the spokes out of the rim somewhere between 1500 and 2000 miles. Went to Ultegra hubs/OP rims laced 36 at the rear. Just found a spoke pulled out of the rim. Not sure on the mileage would guess between 4000 and 5000 miles though. I'm 6'6" and have ranged between 250 and 270 most of the time. I now considering lacing a Swiss DT 1.1 (or 1.2 ) or the velocity aerohead to my existing hub. other experiences or recomendations out there?
    1990 Schwinn Sierra MOS
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  8. #58
    Wildman in the Sky voileauciel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DavisClydesdale
    I have Alex X2100 rims. I broke 2 spokes in the first 1500 miles. I recently had the rear relaced with new spokes, and I just broke another one. Argh.
    Oddly enough, I too just had this problem as well. Seems as if AlexRims and Bianchi are in cahoots with the LBS's again...lol.

    Now, however, with proper Wheelsmith Spokes, the wheels are finally true, both laterally and vertically. If anyone needs wheels rebuilt in New Brunswick area NJ, definitely hit up Bob at All Brunswick Cyclery as he does a remarkable job. (Sorry for the shameless plug...)


    C

  9. #59
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    I have an uber-clyde wheelset on my fixed gear.

    Velocity Fusion rims
    IRO hubs (basically Formula hubs)
    DT Swiss spokes
    36-hole, 3-cross.

    I beat the heck out of those wheels, and nary a broken spoke. I'm 255 or so, and it's mostly urban riding on fairly rough roads.

  10. #60
    I like turtles mascher's Avatar
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    I don't hang around the road forum, but I lurk in the Clyde thread (this seems to be mostly road discussion), but fwiw:

    I've only had one hand built wheel even come out of true, mountain biking, commuting, and longer rides, cheap stuff, expensive stuff, midrange stuff. And the one that came untrue was after a summer messengering on it followed by two full years of all season commuting. (wheel was a late 80s heavily used 36h lx to the cheapest, widest sun rim I've ever seen)

    Every machine-laced "hand finished" wheel I've ever owned I've broken spokes on in less than a couple hundred miles.

    A few times when I had a spoke replaced on the fly with non SS spokes, the new spokes broke almost immediately (of course, that has too many factors to really consider, but I thought I'd throw it in there). I've heard these spokes called "zinc" and "galvanized" spokes, and I no longer frequent shops that even have them, but at least 6-10 years ago, they were about 10 cents a spoke vs 50 to >a buck for various SS spokes.

    I don't think there's any voodoo about building wheels (though I'm not careful or patient enough to do it), and maybe I've just been lucky, but I'm between 220 and 240 pounds and am mostly carrying a bag with a lock, clothes and a clyde-sized lunch, plus my bike is my primary transportation, so that means e.g. 25 pounds of veggies from the farmers market on my back. Great luck with:

    rears:
    deore 32 and 36h with tiogas and rhynos
    totally cheap generic Formula hubs and generic alloy rims
    32h Kogswell hub with Mavic MA3
    32h Miche with Velocity Deep V

    I've only ridden fixed gear road bikes, and I mostly commute, so maybe training is a lot harder, but I remember very clearly my last wheel bum out - my front formula/mavic cxp wheel was coming unlaced on a long ride about 20 kms from home. This was the last time I bothered buying prebuilt wheels - the $ I saved (120 bucks for a nice set of wheel hardware) was lost in the 70 bucks I paid to have them rebuilt.

  11. #61
    nowheels
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    Quote Originally Posted by DIGITAL39
    I was looking at the Forte Titan and Forte Gemini on Performance, do any of you have experience with these wheels. The titan only has 20 spoke in the rear and 16 in the front. Being 256 I worry that might be too much for that to handle. The Gemini is 24/28 which I think would be better. It will be a few months before I purchase and I am hoping to drop about 20 lbs before then. Would I be alright with the titan if I lost 20, or would I need the gemini and would I be able to ride the gemini at my current weight?
    I ran a set of Titans for about 2 years. They are a good sturdy wheel.....a buddy of mine still uses them as his race day wheels.

  12. #62
    Dolce far niente bigbossman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigbossman
    When I consulted with Mike for my wheel set, his opinion was that the DT swiss RR1.1 rims were the "new" Open Pro's. He said they were like the OP, but with improvements.

    BTW, I weigh 230 lbs and he spec'ed 24/28 spoke counts for me, using the Niobium Aero rim he sells. They are on tha way as I speak, so I cannot review them for you yet. I fretted over the low spoke count, and called him 3 times to see if he was sure of the design. He is, and said that if I don't like them to send them back and he'll re-lace them to higher spoke count hubs/rims at no charge.
    Update - I posted the statement above on 02-24-06. Since then, i have 3,000+ miles and about 9 centuries on these wheels, and they are still perfect. I'm still 230lbs.
    "Love is not the dying moan of a distant violin, it’s the triumphant twang of a bedspring."

    S. J. Perelman

  13. #63
    Senior Curmudgeon
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    Quote Originally Posted by BikeWise1
    Just don't expect the rear wheel to be round. I was just at Interbike. Without exception, every rear Campy wheel with that spoke pattern was noticably out of true radially. Fronts seemed OK, but the rears.....yeesh.....
    Strange ... At 285#, I never had a problem with mine. The Vento rear eventually broke a spoke on me, but it didn't taco or go out of round. If I ever decide to get a road bike again, you can bet the Ventos will be my first choice.

  14. #64
    Eternal Cat3 Rookie branman1986's Avatar
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    what about aero wheel choices? I'm only 205, so I'm barely clydesdale, but I'm scared of dropping around 1k just to have the wheels go out of true after a few races.

    I've been looking at:

    Mavic Cosmic Carbone
    Hed Alps or Jet 50/60 with the extra spokes (24F/28R) - supposed to be for 190-225lbs
    Zipp 404 Clydesdale, though I probably were prefer not to spend that much money.

    I'm leaning towards the Hed Alps with the 24/28 since I think I can get it the cheapest.

    Anybody have any input?

  15. #65
    Senior Member Dubbayoo's Avatar
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  16. #66
    Senior Member
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    Just bought a '95 Klein Quantum on Ebay, which came with Gipiemme (is that pronounced gip me? just wondering....) T Tre wheels. Broke my first spoke a week ago, and another one this morning. I'm 6'3", 250 lbs., and I haven't hit any major bumps, up off the saddle over RR tracks. First one broke at the threads, this one broke at the nipple. I see Performance has a Dura Ace/ Mavic set for $299, but that puts the price of my used bike up around new bike price. One LBS suggested that rebuilding the wheels might solve the problem--what do you guys think?

  17. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigbossman
    Update - I posted the statement above on 02-24-06. Since then, i have 3,000+ miles and about 9 centuries on these wheels, and they are still perfect. I'm still 230lbs.
    Price?
    What is better than getting your heart rate up and saddle time?

  18. #68
    Old Fat Guy paul43's Avatar
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    Anbody have any experience with DT Swiss RR 1.2? They are a little heavy but so am I --280--
    I talked to Mike Garcia at Odds and Endos he said these would be heavy but strong with a 32 spoke count

  19. #69
    Senior Member formulaben's Avatar
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    ..."heavy" is a relative term, especially with today's technology.
    "Strong, light, cheap. Pick any two." — Keith Bontrager

  20. #70
    Eternal Cat3 Rookie branman1986's Avatar
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    Any of you guys use the Mavic Cosmic Carbones? My decision was made very easy for me since my gf bought me Carbones for Christmas. But she bought tubulars but the measly weight savings of only 50 grams wasn't enough for me to switch to tubulars. So the LBS said I could switch them out for clinchers, but I could also just use the credit towards something else. They carry Mavic, Zipps, Bontrager & Spinergy.

  21. #71
    bobsut
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    I'm 6'2", and down from 250 to 225 and still dropping. Commuting the last seven months, 16 miles each way, every day, helps a lot.

    After 7-8K miles in seven years my front wheel remains the original equipment: Mavic CXP21 rim on an Ultegra hub.

    At about 4.5K shortly after I started daily commuting on this bike, my rear nipples pulled through the rim - that's the attached photo. So that I could get home from work I replaced the rear wheel at a nearby Performance shop with 32H Open Pro and Ultegra. It was total crap, built by Taiwanese factory robots, with horribly low and uneven spoke tensions. I trued it every morning (before going to work) and every afternoon (before riding home again). It lasted two weeks before pulling a nipple through. The Performance shop replaced it under warranty.

    I rode my new wheel directly to another shop on the way home, where the master wheelbuilder evened up the tensions for me as best he could. Unfortunately with poor initial build techniques the spokes' steel had already taken a set, and there was only so much he could do. That wheel lasted about 1500 miles with only occasional truing touch-ups, and just yesterday morning I pulled a nipple through.

    I no longer have any confidence in factory robot built wheels, and I want to start with a modern strong rim this time too. Alas, I have no mad wheel building skillz yo, so I must pay someone else to do it for me.

    I took my original Ultegra hub, along with a brand new Velocity Deep V rim, to the good shop for a fresh build. Their wheelbuilder used to work at Wheelsmith, and is considered one of the top two or three wheelbuilders in northern California. Hopefully I'll have my new wheel in hand tomorrow, don't want to wait till Tuesday!
    Attached Images Attached Images

  22. #72
    acciaio is real Wurm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BikingMD


    ME: 6' 1"+ and 200lbs. in full riding gear.

    I NEED: a Strong, light, and cheap wheelset. I know, I know, but there MUST be an acceptable compromise for wheels among the three categories.
    Instead of wracking your brain about spoke counts/rim types, etc. - just buy most any Campy wheel and you'll be fine.

    I go between low-190's and 205 lbs., and I've owned the Shamals, Nucleons, Zondas, and Boras and never once had to true any of them or broken a spoke or had a hub or rim problem. Many of them are not quite as light as a custom-built can be, but they've been much stronger in the long run than any custom's I've had.

  23. #73
    Old Fat Guy paul43's Avatar
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    Cane Creek Wheels

    I talked to the people at Cane Creek Wheels in NC. The fellow there assured me their Volos XL wheelset would carry my weight (295#).

    They have a unique hub and a different way of lacing the spokes with the nipples being at the hub end instead of the rim end with radial lacing on both wheels.

    Anyone using these wheels or have any experience/opinion on them?

    Thanks
    Paul

  24. #74
    acciaio is real Wurm's Avatar
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    I had a pair of CC Aeroheat's or whatever they were called some years ago. 24/28 spokes, and nips at the hubs too I think. But they felt too soft laterally. I'd get lots of brake rubbing on hard turns.

    Maybe the Volos XL are better now in that regard, I don't know. I'm tellin' ya though - just buy a set of Campy Vento's or Scirocco's and you'll probably never want a lesser wheelset. They can be had with a Shimano-type freewheel, so that's not a problem. Good prices can be had if you search around some.

  25. #75
    acciaio is real Wurm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paul43
    I talked to the people at Cane Creek Wheels in NC. The fellow there assured me their Volos XL wheelset would carry my weight (295#).
    Paul -

    I had a pair of CC Aeroheat's or whatever they were called some years ago. 24/28 spokes, and nips at the hubs too I think. But they felt too soft laterally. I'd get lots of brake rubbing on hard turns.

    Maybe the Volos XL are better now in that regard, I don't know. I'm tellin' ya though - just buy a set of Campy Vento's or Scirocco's and you'll probably never want a lesser wheelset. They can be had with a Shimano-type freewheel, so that's not a problem. Good prices can be had if you search around some.

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