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Clydesdales/Athenas (200+ lb / 91+ kg) Looking to lose that spare tire? Ideal weight 200+? Frustrated being a large cyclist in a sport geared for the ultra-light? Learn about the bikes and parts that can take the abuse of a heavier cyclist, how to keep your body going while losing the weight, and get support from others who've been successful.

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Old 09-10-08, 11:55 AM   #1
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Ride 39 - Cadence

Well the Bee bought a computer for the bike. My old one did not have cadence. So I had to go to the bike shop to have them look at my flat tire. I wanted them to help see the cause of the flat (A ton of small specks of glass). So they gave me a new tire and tube....changed the flat - and then the new tube blew. So they put another tube on. Meanwhile - I talked to the shop guys about a computer and ended up with a VDO Z2 with the cadence accessory. So it measures darn near everything. I also had a bike fitting - ended up changing the stem out to one that has adjustable angles as my lower back hurts after a ride. He adjusted the handlebar angle and about 3/4 inch higher. We moved my seat much more forward as well - and he repositioned my cleats to relieve the pressure on my foot. So quite a fun day at the bike store (day before yesterday).

Ok so today is my first ride with the adjusted bike and spiffy computer. I rode the Silver Comet - our flat trail (2% grade max). My goal was to go ride at 90-110 Cadence and 75 if I found a hill.

I warmed up a bit for 10 minutes and then tried to stay above 90. Some time at 100, and others between 90-100. WOW!! What a different ride. I had been riding for mileage and at times for speed. Now it is all about turning the pedals. I am riding in the middle gears (i have 3 rings). So spinning away - and it's a ton of work. I know because my Heart rate was about 150-164... I think my max is about 180 so that was a pretty good range I figure.


Anyway - truly feel like my training is just beginning! I normally work away form home Mon - Thursday so it's tough to train like this - but hey I will work these training rides in when I can - and hopefully improve for the longer rides and group rides. Oh and in the middle of the ride I remembered I forgot to fill up tires with air and borrowed a pump. Blew the tire! So that was the end of the ride - and went back to bike shop. They replaced tube and tire - as they were not happy it did that twice...so my new tire should hold n0ow! But I cut the ride short - and luckily got a ride back to the bike shop with a very nice fellow rider.


So today's stats:
Can't tell you official AVG HR cause somehow I zeroed it out...
But here's the rest of the nifty info:
Mileage: 18.95
Ride Time 1:16:34
Avg Speed 14.8
Max Speed 21.6
Cadence Avg 86 (Includes warm up)
Cadence Max 135
Weather Mid 70s

And at one point I checked calories - which I think I cleared out by mistake when I cleared the stop watch and lost the Heart Rate info and it said 500. So I guess I burned about 700 IF YOU BELIEVE THE BIKE COMPUTER (i have my doubts)

Ok off to do my exercise video - a fun day off! I am going to go tot the bike sites and satrt recording this stuff - so maybe y'all won't have to read all the details all the time! But this is fascinating - ok maybe just to me!

Next Up: Tomorrow Morning Buckhead ride - supposed to be hilly. I will not be striving necessarly for cadence - or maybe I will - i think i see it more as survival though I will be with an experienced rider/friend - so it's my call how fast - etc. Maybe I should keep my cadence even on the hilly ride? What do y'all think?

OKAY - Happy riding!
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Old 09-10-08, 05:43 PM   #2
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..........I warmed up a bit for 10 minutes and then tried to stay above 90. Some time at 100, and others between 90-100. WOW!! What a different ride. I had been riding for mileage and at times for speed. Now it is all about turning the pedals. I am riding in the middle gears (i have 3 rings). So spinning away - and it's a ton of work. I know because my Heart rate was about 150-164... I think my max is about 180 so that was a pretty good range I figure.


Anyway - truly feel like my training is just beginning! I normally work away form home Mon - Thursday so it's tough to train like this - but hey I will work these training rides in when I can - and hopefully improve for the longer rides and group rides. Oh and in the middle of the ride I remembered I forgot to fill up tires with air and borrowed a pump. Blew the tire! So that was the end of the ride - and went back to bike shop. They replaced tube and tire - as they were not happy it did that twice...so my new tire should hold n0ow! But I cut the ride short - and luckily got a ride back to the bike shop with a very nice fellow rider.


So today's stats:
Can't tell you official AVG HR cause somehow I zeroed it out...
But here's the rest of the nifty info:
Mileage: 18.95
Ride Time 1:16:34
Avg Speed 14.8
Max Speed 21.6
Cadence Avg 86 (Includes warm up)
Cadence Max 135
Weather Mid 70s

And at one point I checked calories - which I think I cleared out by mistake when I cleared the stop watch and lost the Heart Rate info and it said 500. So I guess I burned about 700 IF YOU BELIEVE THE BIKE COMPUTER (i have my doubts)

Ok off to do my exercise video - a fun day off! I am going to go tot the bike sites and satrt recording this stuff - so maybe y'all won't have to read all the details all the time! But this is fascinating - ok maybe just to me! ..........
1st .....I always enjoy your posts ! Inspiring, motivating and enthusiastic!!!

2nd ....You may want to check out www.bikejournal.com for data tracking.

3rd ... You're an animal!! I mean that in the nicest sense. Let's compare notes....on my last 17 mi ride ave cadence was 73 w/ a max of 94......at 85+ my legs felt as if they were just flailing!! Your ave cadence was 86 and a max of 135 !!!......YIKES!! Lookout Lance !!

Just a note regarding HR and weight loss from Sally Edwards' book: "The Heartrate Monitor Guide Book"

Pg 83 ".......The Z2 Temperate zone .............approximately 70%-85% of all calories that are burned in the Z2 zone are from fat. ..............As you continue to train into the higher zones, you will burn more calories, but you will also burn proprtionationately less fat as a percentage of you total calories."

Pg 84 ""Z2 Zone is 60-70% of max HR and the fuels burned:
10% Carbs, 50-80% fat, 5% Protein. Calories burned: approx 10 cal/min"
One method to calculate VO2max (max HR): http://walking.about.com/library/cal/ucrockport.htm

Bottomline --- depending on your goal, working harder may not be the most effective route--especially for weightloss.

You're doing great, I'm impressed with your enthusiam and energy!!! Thanks!! Keep Riding & Keep Posting !!
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Old 09-10-08, 06:54 PM   #3
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max of 135 !!!......YIKES!! Lookout Lance !!

Hey Bone Head - Thank you for your post! I think the 135 is just the bike computer hiccuping,. I mean really

I am not sure I believe the 60% HR stories... Just not sure. I mean my goals are two fold: 1) lose weight - which i trhink will happen - ie Eat less- I am gonna lose. and 2) I want to become a better/faster rider. I want to have power and not lose the group on the hills. So what ih ave been told is the 90-110 will get me to improve.

I also think -if i had time a few days a week riding at say 70% (+ about 126 if my max is 180) may be a good idea. It certainly is a pleasure cruise... but I do not really have that time. My normal operation is I will fly to a hotel on Monday -work late each nigth and fly back in to ATL on Thursday evening. So that leaves Fri-Sun for riding. And mostly I am on group rides Sat/Sun. So I think on the road I will be hitting the gym alot....

ANd when I do get a chance (like this week I have been off) I will try and practice keeping my cadence in the zone- 90-110. Hopefully my HR will improve and my normal cadence will go up as well. I think I was usually spinning around 70 or even less. So The Computer is really gonna kick my butt.
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Old 09-10-08, 07:52 PM   #4
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Hey Bone Head - Thank you for your post! I think the 135 is just the bike computer hiccuping,. I mean really

I am not sure I believe the 60% HR stories... Just not sure. I mean my goals are two fold: 1) lose weight - which i trhink will happen - ie Eat less- I am gonna lose. and 2) I want to become a better/faster rider. I want to have power and not lose the group on the hills. So what ih ave been told is the 90-110 will get me to improve.

I also think -if i had time a few days a week riding at say 70% (+ about 126 if my max is 180) may be a good idea. It certainly is a pleasure cruise... but I do not really have that time. My normal operation is I will fly to a hotel on Monday -work late each nigth and fly back in to ATL on Thursday evening. So that leaves Fri-Sun for riding. And mostly I am on group rides Sat/Sun. So I think on the road I will be hitting the gym alot....

ANd when I do get a chance (like this week I have been off) I will try and practice keeping my cadence in the zone- 90-110. Hopefully my HR will improve and my normal cadence will go up as well. I think I was usually spinning around 70 or even less. So The Computer is really gonna kick my butt.
The working harder defeating the purpose for weight loss has been around a while now. Here is what happens, the body uses several fuel sources, first is glucose stored in muscles, used for high bursts of short term energy, like when you stand and stomp the pedals to get past the clueless soccer mom on the cell phone driving the SUV, not watching out for the cyclist, and get past before being splattered. Second is glycogen stored in the liver, while not as high octane, it's good for moderately high effort, but is some what short term. You can run on this for around 1˝ - 2 hours, running out is called The Bonk, runners call it hitting the wall. In either case at such efforts your not burning fat, your burning glycogen.

One thing is, technically the bonk is like a car battery, it never gets drained completely, because it would be impossible to recharge if it did. It means that your low on glycogen, not that you have run out completely, and that tired worn out, feeling is the body switching into conservation mode, while it starts rebuilding the supply.

Third fuel supply is fat, the fat store is huge, even on a very thin person, however it takes the body time to convert fat into glucose, so fat burning takes place at lower levels of effort, where the body can convert fat into glucose as fast as your using it, and then use that as fuel. Because fat is burned in a glycogen flame, your using some of your glycogen, but not nearly as quickly as at high levels of effort, so it may last all day, rather then just a couple of hours.
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Old 09-10-08, 08:18 PM   #5
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I get really frustrated trying to get my head around fat burning levels and stuff. I do know that if I ride at the "optimal fat burning HR" I don't get a workout. I won't get stronger (or it'll take a long time), nor will I appreciatively increase my endurance. I also don't think it'll improve my metabolism much. I do take a ride or two at this rate each week to loosen up and help my legs recover from harder effort rides, but it's not my norm.

I've found that I lose weight better when I do harder rides or intervals.

Way to go on improving your fitness! I like to pedal a 105-110 cadence. 90 just feels slow. That said, I mash my way up hills at around 70. I don't have any good hill gears on my bike. That will be remedied when I can afford to replace my cassette (12-23 right now, going to get a 13-26). My knees don't hurt when I pedal high cadences, so that's good. I think I spun up to 130 on my ride last Sunday.
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Old 09-10-08, 08:25 PM   #6
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Way to go on improving your fitness! I like to pedal a 105-110 cadence. 90 just feels slow. That said, I mash my way up hills at around 70. I don't have any good hill gears on my bike. That will be remedied when I can afford to replace my cassette (12-23 right now, going to get a 13-26). My knees don't hurt when I pedal high cadences, so that's good. I think I spun up to 130 on my ride last Sunday.
13/26 is a strange cassette or at least it sounds strange to me. Is this a 9 speed or something? You could look at a 12/27 or 11/28 but those may only be 10 speed cassette options. Not sure
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Old 09-10-08, 08:46 PM   #7
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13/26 is a strange cassette or at least it sounds strange to me. Is this a 9 speed or something? You could look at a 12/27 or 11/28 but those may only be 10 speed cassette options. Not sure
Yup, 9 speed Campy Chorus.
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Old 09-11-08, 02:01 AM   #8
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Here is what happens....
What a brilliant description, thanks Wogsterca
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Old 09-11-08, 02:19 AM   #9
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hey, why am I all red?
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Old 09-11-08, 05:31 AM   #10
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The working harder defeating the purpose for weight loss has been around a while now. Here is what happens, the body uses several fuel sources, first is glucose stored in muscles, used for high bursts of short term energy, like when you stand and stomp the pedals to get past the clueless soccer mom on the cell phone driving the SUV, not watching out for the cyclist, and get past before being splattered. Second is glycogen stored in the liver, while not as high octane, it's good for moderately high effort, but is some what short term. You can run on this for around 1˝ - 2 hours, running out is called The Bonk, runners call it hitting the wall. In either case at such efforts your not burning fat, your burning glycogen.

One thing is, technically the bonk is like a car battery, it never gets drained completely, because it would be impossible to recharge if it did. It means that your low on glycogen, not that you have run out completely, and that tired worn out, feeling is the body switching into conservation mode, while it starts rebuilding the supply.

Third fuel supply is fat, the fat store is huge, even on a very thin person, however it takes the body time to convert fat into glucose, so fat burning takes place at lower levels of effort, where the body can convert fat into glucose as fast as your using it, and then use that as fuel. Because fat is burned in a glycogen flame, your using some of your glycogen, but not nearly as quickly as at high levels of effort, so it may last all day, rather then just a couple of hours.

Thank you for the description - this is very helpful!! A bit like Joel -it just seems especialy at the gym - when I am covered in sweat - I must lose more weigth than when I am doing a nice slow workout. But I think you are saying you lose more fat if it's long and slow.

What's interesting - is I think I am more into becoming a better cyclist than losing more weight fast. Very interesting shift in my personality! No doubt - I will do both! Watch out Lance and Watch out Rachel Ward/Meg ryan/Cameron Diaz...it's Sue.

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Old 09-11-08, 06:15 AM   #11
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hey, why am I all red?

Your all red because your in trouble mister.


j/k, I think it means that your logged in. I noticed the people in red are the folks who are currently logged on.
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Old 09-11-08, 06:18 AM   #12
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The working harder defeating the purpose for weight loss has been around a while now. Here is what happens, ...snip...
I've heard this several times now and am very interested in some reading materials on it. Would you happen to have any links to share? Seems like it would be a great thing to toss up the winter trainer rides.

Bau
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Old 09-11-08, 06:23 AM   #13
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Oh yes, cadence meter, the slave driver. I am currently metamorphosing from masher to spinner and it is very interesting experience.

I feel like gaining muscles on my legs and my wife says my butt is smaller - no complains here

But sometimes it is hard to keep in my interval (over 90). It made me change completely my shifting pattern and I find myself often cruising in bigger cog than I would be otherwise. I am clueless in biking techniques, just trying to keep the strength on pedals same all the time and the rpms on 92-94 range.

Riding my old neighborhood beater is a reward, no cadence meter there and I can just enjoy myself
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Old 09-11-08, 06:35 AM   #14
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Oh yes, cadence meter, the slave driver. I am currently metamorphosing from masher to spinner and it is very interesting experience.

I feel like gaining muscles on my legs and my wife says my butt is smaller - no complains here

But sometimes it is hard to keep in my interval (over 90). It made me change completely my shifting pattern and I find myself often cruising in bigger cog than I would be otherwise. I am clueless in biking techniques, just trying to keep the strength on pedals same all the time and the rpms on 92-94 range.

Riding my old neighborhood beater is a reward, no cadence meter there and I can just enjoy myself
Hey Scrap - Intersting to here about the transition and impact. It seems sooo much easier to shift into the big ring - and whoosh I am off - and much faster or so it seems. But I guess I am believeing the cyclists when they instruct me to ride at 90-110. I for one would love a smaller butt! My heritage is big butted...but alas I would love to spin the darn butt down a bit!
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Old 09-11-08, 08:59 AM   #15
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When you're spinning, remember to unweight the foot that's on the upstroke. No need to pull up on it (unless you're climbing), just unweight it. You'll have to think about it until it becomes automatic. But it really helps. Otherwise the foot on the downstroke has to push up your other leg as well as turn the back wheel.
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Old 09-11-08, 10:37 AM   #16
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I've heard this several times now and am very interested in some reading materials on it. Would you happen to have any links to share? Seems like it would be a great thing to toss up the winter trainer rides.

Bau
Google ' Heart Rate training zones ' you'll find tons of info on the various sites for weightloss, walking, running, etc.

Books:

1) Base Building for Cyclists: A New Foundation for Endurance and Performance By Thomas Chapple
IMHO an excellent training tool -- has training plans, excersises, etc. Sometimes a bit too technical for my needs, but a great tool none the less.

2) Heart Rate Monitor Guidebook by Sally Edwards
Generic HR Taining for all types of atheletes -- yes, 'clyde cyclists' are atheletes!!
Ch 14 -- The Max FATburning Plan

Hope that helps.
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Old 09-12-08, 05:14 AM   #17
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When you're spinning, remember to unweight the foot that's on the upstroke. No need to pull up on it (unless you're climbing), just unweight it. You'll have to think about it until it becomes automatic. But it really helps. Otherwise the foot on the downstroke has to push up your other leg as well as turn the back wheel.
Thank you, this is good to know. I think it was slowly coming to me by itself, but I am going to concentrate on it now.
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Old 09-12-08, 09:04 AM   #18
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<SNIP>
What's interesting - is I think I am more into becoming a better cyclist than losing more weight fast. Very interesting shift in my personality! No doubt - I will do both! Watch out Lance and Watch out Rachel Ward/Meg ryan/Cameron Diaz...it's Sue.
That is great! Why not enjoy the journey. I too have been trying keep track of my cadence. I don't have a cadence capable computer so every so often I just count it out to make sure I keep my legs moving at a nice pace somewhere around 85 to 90. By using my daily rides as sort of mini-spinning sessions and using the traffic light stops as a good excuse to do some sprints I've found that I have become a much stronger riders. A year and half ago I has huffing and puffing hard to average 12.5 MPH on a 5 mile ride to work. Now I can easily maintain 16 MPH on the same bike. On a good day I sometimes manage to average almost 19 MPH on the hybrid. One thing that I have gotten much better at over the year is getting to know my body and its limits. I now can tell pretty well what pace I can maintain and when I am pushing myself too hard. What is fun is when you start to realize that the pace you can maintain is starting to move up and that you are now riding regularly at the same cadence, but I am in one or two gears higher than before. The "engine" is getting stronger. It is such a good feeling knowing that you getting stronger. That has got to be doing my heart (and the rest of my body) a lot of good. My biggest weakness is that I need to make more time to work the core and the upper body more.

To break up the boredom of always riding the routes and not being pushed by anyone. I Recently joined the local bike club. The group is very friendly and there are riders of all levels of ability. I try to get our every Wednesday night as the ride starts close to home. So that way I get a nice 10 mile RT commute. A short 2 mile ride to the meeting place and then a 20 to 25 mile ride, and then 2 miles home. On the club ride days I definitely ride easier to and from work. After a few weeks I've found that I am hanging with the "reasonably" fast riders. I definitely can NOT hang with the fast group, but the 2nd fastest group appears to work well for me. I can now ride at 20 MPH for 20 to 25 miles (on the road bike). What is humbling is how many of these riders are 20 to 30 years my senior. Last week I was only just barely hanging on (I was also still getting rid of a cold so that never helps). This week was great. My body was feeling better and I ate a little earlier so that the food had some time to start digesting. We were all rotating through taking our turns as the front. I had the good luck of getting a streach with a little head wind and long slow uphill streach. I just dug in deep got into my drops and pumped hard for as long as I could. I ended up getting a complement from one of the more senior riders when I moved off the the side to let someone else take the lead. It is just wonderful to be able to see the progress in my ability to ride. I don't need or want to be a racer. It is however great fun to ride with others and in a no pressure environment and just see how far you can push yourself.

Enjoy the ride and enjoy becoming a stronger more confident rider.

André
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Old 09-12-08, 11:12 AM   #19
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I get really frustrated trying to get my head around fat burning levels and stuff. I do know that if I ride at the "optimal fat burning HR" I don't get a workout. I won't get stronger (or it'll take a long time), nor will I appreciatively increase my endurance. I also don't think it'll improve my metabolism much. I do take a ride or two at this rate each week to loosen up and help my legs recover from harder effort rides, but it's not my norm.

I've found that I lose weight better when I do harder rides or intervals.
Think of it like this:

1) At 65% of your max heart rate, you're in The Fat Burning Zone. Say, 90% of the calories you use come from fat and you're burning 250 calories an hour. After one hour of exercise, you've burned 225 calories from fat. Burn 3500 calories (15.5 hours) and, in theory, you'll have burned a pound of fat.

2) At 80% of your max heart rate, let's say you're much less efficient: maybe only 50% of the calories used come from fat. But you're burning 1000 calories per hour. After one hour of exercise, you've burned 500 calories from fat. After seven hours of exercise, in theory, you'll have burned a pound of fat.

Of course, there's also a time component involved. The longer you exercise, the more likely your body is to need to burn fat to fuel your activity. I find that rides of 2+ hours are a great way to burn fat!

In any event, you can guesstimate how many calories you're burning per hour and what percentage are from fat and use that to pick your exercise strategy. For myself, I simply don't have enough time available to burn as much fat as I want to lose by exercising in The Fat Burning Zone. As a result, I go fast and long (2-4hrs) on the weekends. This is what my body seems to need to shed the pounds. During the week, I go fast and short (~1 hr) to encourage my body to burn any excess carbohydrates I've consumed, rather than turning them into body fat.
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