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  1. #1
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    The basics about wheels/tires threads.... (ask and answer questions here!)

    Ok, so like every other Clyde, the biggest problem I have now that I have a frame I love is finding the right wheels. The wheels that came with my Fuji clearly do not measure up because they need to be trued every freaking week, particularly the rear where most of the weight rides. I am deathly afraid of tacoing it in the middle of a triathlon after a particularly good swim and wanting to throw my bike in the lake!

    So anyways, Here are my questions that I was too afraid to ask in the mechanics forum (I dont want to come off like a total noob, as I know a bit about quite a few other parts of the bike and post there occasionally) and I figured maybe we can have a general place to talk about wheels and merge all wheel questions into.

    1. My current wheels are 700 x 35c. My current rear cogs are: 14- 34 teeth, 7 speed. Is there anything special I need to look for in a wheel to move the rear cogs from one wheel to another? I mean as long as it is 700 x 35c am I good?

    2. does the 35c determine the maximum width of my tires?

    3. Speaking of tires, obviously they add into the mix of protecting the tube getting holes, but how much will a good tire protect the wheel from getting out of true while riding?

    4. Maybe we can put together a list of clyde, uber-clyde, and ultra-uber-clyde approved wheels (so, wheels good for guys (in the 200#, 300#, and 400# range)?

  2. #2
    The Site Administrator: Currently at home recovering from a couple of strokes,please contact my assistnt admins for forum issues Tom Stormcrowe's Avatar
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    Clyde Wheels: 700c: Velocity Deep V, 32+ spokes. You can get these rims drilled for up to 48 spokes, by the way.
    on light duty due to illness; please contact my assistants for forum issues. They are Siu Blue Wind, or CbadRider or the other 3 star folk. I am currently at home recovering from a couple of strokes. I am making good progress, happily.


    . “He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you.”- Fredrick Nietzsche

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  3. #3
    Senior Member jaxgtr's Avatar
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    1. My current wheels are 700 x 35c. My current rear cogs are: 14- 34 teeth, 7 speed. Is there anything special I need to look for in a wheel to move the rear cogs from one wheel to another? I mean as long as it is 700 x 35c am I good?

    Actually, your tires are 700c x 35. Your wheels have a different designation based on how wide the rims are. Yours are probably 20mm to 24mm wide, meaning you probably have a reference of 622x20 or something like that. Basically 622 = 700c and the 20 is the rim width. If you don't see a marking, measure the rim inside the rim walls. The width of the rims will give you a basic idea of the limits on tire size you can use. I narrower tire would be easier to use on a 622 x 19 than say a 622 x 24, and wider tires of 38mm would be harder to fit on a 17mm width. Even though you might be able to mount them, safety would be a concern.

    See this from Sheldon's site.





    If you want to stay with 7 speed, you will need to stay with a 7 speed hub and have it laced to the rim of your choice with good spokes. Then you can move your existing cassette over.

    2. does the 35c determine the maximum width of my tires?

    Yes, 35 is the width in mm.

    3. Speaking of tires, obviously they add into the mix of protecting the tube getting holes, but how much will a good tire protect the wheel from getting out of true while riding?

    Tires will not keep wheel true. Proper spoke tension keeps the wheel true.


    4. Maybe we can put together a list of clyde, uber-clyde, and ultra-uber-clyde approved wheels (so, wheels good for guys (in the 200#, 300#, and 400# range)?

    See this: Clydesdale/Athena Index Thread - read before posting and ALL the old Stickies linked

    And this for wheels only: Clydesdale/Athena Index Thread - read before posting and ALL the old Stickies linked
    Last edited by jaxgtr; 05-22-09 at 11:31 AM.
    Brian | 2015 Cannondale Synapse Carbon 3 | 2014 Trek CrossRip Comp | 2013 Cannondale SuperSix (for sale)
    Quote Originally Posted by AEO View Post
    you should learn to embrace change, and mock it's failings every step of the way.

  4. #4
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    jax - Thanks! I don't understand everything you said yet, but I get most of it, and that's a start.

    Found the Alex global technology site. You were right on with my wheels: 622X20mm

    Here's a crosscut diagram.



    Wheel/Tube question - How much does having a good rim strip protect the tube? I have had many a flat on the current rear tires/wheels (4 in less than 60 miles), and Im no daredevil. The tires need replaced Im quite sure, but Im wondering if upgrading the rim strip to cloth will help?
    Last edited by TechKnowGN; 05-22-09 at 11:57 AM.

  5. #5
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    "If you want to stay with 7 speed, you will need to stay with a 7 speed hub and have it laced to the rim of your choice with good spokes. Then you can move your existing cassette over."

    The above is not entirely true and would limit your options. If you have a 7 speed cassette you can use it on an 8 speed hub by using a spacer. Alternatively you can use an 8 speed cassette and set your derailleur up so that it only shifts onto 7 of the gears, the gear spacing is the same. Good 7 speed hubs are hard to come by as 8/9 speed have been the standard for years. If you have a thread on 7 speed freewheel instead of a cassette just chuck it. Freewheels/cassettes are a one of the parts of a bike that is subject to the most wear and they should be changed frequently, do not buy a hub or wheelset for the express purpose of re-using a disposable part.

    Higher tire pressure will reduce flats in most cases. A good rim strip will only help if you can pin point that the hole in the tube is on the inside. All that is needed is something with no sharp edges that effectively covers the ends of the spokes.

  6. #6
    Senior Member jaxgtr's Avatar
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    Rim strips are very important, they need to be the proper size width as well. They make them in different width. The strips that came with your wheels are probably ok, but you might have some other issues. Are you getting pinch flats, meaning, are the tubes getting caught up between the rim and bead (edge) of the tire? or just flats from objects your hitting? If your getting pinch flats, make sure your tubes are not too big for your tire and you are putting in the proper pressure for your tires. For a 38 tire, I like the the 700C 28-35 size tubes. If you are getting flats from debris, it might be time to replace the tires.

    I ride the Bontrager Race Lite Hardcase on both my bikes and my hybrid has not had a flat in close to 2700 miles now and I probably still have 800-1200 miles left on the tires. I also use the Velocity Velo Plugs in place of the rim strips as both sets of my wheels can accept the 8mm plugs. Really make mounting the tires much easier for me. If the spoke wholes are not 8mm, you can't use the Velo Plugs.
    Last edited by jaxgtr; 05-22-09 at 12:32 PM.
    Brian | 2015 Cannondale Synapse Carbon 3 | 2014 Trek CrossRip Comp | 2013 Cannondale SuperSix (for sale)
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  7. #7
    Senior Member jaxgtr's Avatar
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    All very true. Did not even think about the spacer for he 8 speed option. Most of the newer hubs are 8/9/10 speed compatible, and very true on the tire pressure.
    Last edited by jaxgtr; 05-22-09 at 12:40 PM.
    Brian | 2015 Cannondale Synapse Carbon 3 | 2014 Trek CrossRip Comp | 2013 Cannondale SuperSix (for sale)
    Quote Originally Posted by AEO View Post
    you should learn to embrace change, and mock it's failings every step of the way.

  8. #8
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    The Rim strip protects the tube from the end of the spokes. If the spokes are poking through and popping your tires then you need a new rim because the spoke ends are not seating correctly (unless your spokes are just very loose. Either way, replace the rim strip when you upgrade.

  9. #9
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    Ok, another noob question. Spoke tension. I retrue the wheels on average every other week, and Ive had two experienced mechanics look at them and not mention the tension so I assume its fine. But other than them spinning loosely in the wheel, how would I know?

  10. #10
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    I'm not sure about pinch flats, but I did have one flat by an area of the tube that showed all sorts of strange wear. What might be related is that I had a flat problem from debris getting into the tire. I went through 2 tubes (not including the one above) until I brought it up at the co-op, and they told me to clean out the inside of the tire. Is it common to get junk inside the tire?

    700 x 35c Kenda K-830 are the tires it came with, and I've been buying 700 x 28 - 32 tubes I believe in all cases.


    I'd love to go out and buy some velocity deep v's and nice tires, but it just isnt in the budget, so makeshift workarounds and maintenance seem are the route for the time being.

  11. #11
    aka Tom Reingold noglider's Avatar
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    I think I see a business opportunity here. 36-hole and 48-hole rear wheels.

    Tom Stormcrowe, how can you redrill a 32h rim for 48h? The spoke holes won't be evenly spaced apart. Same for hub.
    You don't read my signature anyway, do you?

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  12. #12
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TechKnowGN View Post
    Ok, another noob question. Spoke tension. I retrue the wheels on average every other week, and Ive had two experienced mechanics look at them and not mention the tension so I assume its fine. But other than them spinning loosely in the wheel, how would I know?
    Trust me on this, THEY SUCK!...An experienced mechanic does not a good wheel guy make!

    I'm some stupid arse sitting behind a computer but if you had told me that you had to true the wheels weekly, first thing I would have did was explained tension to you, then pulled out a tensionmeter and checked it. BY truing every week, you prolly thru out the even tensioning of the wheel by now. More than likely needs to be losened then retrensioned evenly.

    I had one guy pull out a tensionmeter. The same guy that built a great set of wheel for me. Other high end shops built wheels for me that did not last over 10 months. I built my last set, they have over 18000 miles on them. I did retension them after the initial 300 mile breakin period. Experienced mechanics swore loctite, magic dust and other stupid carp would hold a wheel together. BULL! They suck. The dude that retenioned the wheels for me is the master! I built my last set with absolutely no spoke prep agent. Going by what Sheldon Brown says onhis wheelbuild site. Today's spokesare so precision made, they don't require that stuff. My wheels are proof of that! 18000 miles Baby

  13. #13
    The Site Administrator: Currently at home recovering from a couple of strokes,please contact my assistnt admins for forum issues Tom Stormcrowe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by noglider View Post
    I think I see a business opportunity here. 36-hole and 48-hole rear wheels.

    Tom Stormcrowe, how can you redrill a 32h rim for 48h? The spoke holes won't be evenly spaced apart. Same for hub.
    Easy, you order it from Velocity drilled to order. I didn't say redrill. Velocity offers the rims predrilled in various configurations from low spoke count all the way to 48 spokers.


    My Velocity Deep V's are 36 spoke, 2 cross on the front and 36 spoke 3 cross on the rear, hand built. They will stand up to riding the Paris-Roubaix on the cobblestones, or pretty much anything else I want to subject them to.
    on light duty due to illness; please contact my assistants for forum issues. They are Siu Blue Wind, or CbadRider or the other 3 star folk. I am currently at home recovering from a couple of strokes. I am making good progress, happily.


    . “He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you.”- Fredrick Nietzsche

    "We can judge the heart of a man by his treatment of animals." - Immanuel Kant

  14. #14
    aka Tom Reingold noglider's Avatar
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    Thanks, Tom. Of course, you need the right hub.

    TechKnowGN, the wheel size refers to the rim size. 700c is an arbitrary name for a rim that has a 622mm bead seat diameter. C doesn't stand for anything, and it's not 700 anything. As you gathered, 35 is the width of your tire in mm.

    This means that you have to buy a wheel with the same type of hub which can accept your cassette. And of course, you should get a 700c wheel.

    You ought to get a wheel with 36 or 48 spokes. 36 shouldn't be terribly hard to find. 48 spokes will be very expensive and some will call it overkill. It is, depending on your weight, but it will hold up best. As Tom Stormcrowe says, 36 spokes is strong and will probably do great.

    jaxgtr, the tire does have a role in protecting the rim. Not the biggest role, but a role. Bigger tires protect better, but of course, they slow you down, so there's a tradeoff.
    You don't read my signature anyway, do you?

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  15. #15
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    We have 48 hole DeepV's on our tandem. In order to find a 48 hub, you may have to go with a tandem hub. You don't need it. Besides the tandem hub we have is $250 for the rear alone. The rim was $70 at the shop, special order.

  16. #16
    Bicycle Repair Man !!! Sixty Fiver's Avatar
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    A note on cassette hubs... Shimano 7 speed free hubs do not accept 8 speed cassettes because they are narrower while a new 8/9/10 speed hub could be downgraded to a 7 with the proper spacers.

    There is one work around to this as if you use 9 speed cogs and spacers you can fit 8 speeds on a 7 speed freehub.

  17. #17
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    I am over my head now. I think you guys missed the word "basics" in the title. Literally drowning in information. I am going to get my brain around this though. I'm definitely not looking for overkill. I won't be getting 48 holes. I'm looking for the cheapest, easiest way of doing this, which I assume means I keep my cassette, find a compatible stronger wheel and put it/have it put on there.

  18. #18
    aka Tom Reingold noglider's Avatar
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    What terms have we used that confuse or confound you? We're here to help.

    Another thing you can do is rebuild your wheel with your existing hub. How many spokes are on your current wheel? You would buy new spokes and a rim and put it all together.
    You don't read my signature anyway, do you?

    Tom Reingold, noglider@pobox.com
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  19. #19
    Senior Member jaxgtr's Avatar
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    Yea, re-lacing would be your cheapest route. Spokes are about $1 per, and probably $20 to $30 to rebuild the wheel.

    If you want new rims and were to get Deep V rims, they are about $55 per and then rebuild using your existing hub and new spokes. Post to the regional forums for some solid wheel builders in the Columbus area, I'm sure someone can point you to one.
    Brian | 2015 Cannondale Synapse Carbon 3 | 2014 Trek CrossRip Comp | 2013 Cannondale SuperSix (for sale)
    Quote Originally Posted by AEO View Post
    you should learn to embrace change, and mock it's failings every step of the way.

  20. #20
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    So it isnt as easy as just buying a wheel, and screwing my cassette onto i?

  21. #21
    Senior Member jaxgtr's Avatar
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    Not when your using 7 speed hub. What bike is this for? Not your Fuji is it?
    Brian | 2015 Cannondale Synapse Carbon 3 | 2014 Trek CrossRip Comp | 2013 Cannondale SuperSix (for sale)
    Quote Originally Posted by AEO View Post
    you should learn to embrace change, and mock it's failings every step of the way.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaxgtr View Post
    Not when your using 7 speed hub. What bike is this for? Not your Fuji is it?
    Yep, sure is.

    7 Speed 14-34 cogs

    THe 2008 had an MF-TZ37 Shimano 7 Speed "Megarange" cassette.

    Here's the specs I found.

    7-speed Multiple Freewheel (HG/UG sprockets)
    New affordable freewheel
    Close ratio gears with MEGARANGE 34T Gear for easy climbing
    Gearing: 14-16-18-20-22-24-34T

    Whats funny is i've never used the big gear yet, I guess I need to do that, although frankly Im mostly gear illiterate still.
    Last edited by TechKnowGN; 05-22-09 at 08:14 PM.

  23. #23
    Senior Member jaxgtr's Avatar
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    Your 2008 Fuji is 7 speed????? Wow, had no idea anyone still built a 7 spd setup. OK, looking up the components it looks like you are kind of limited in your options. You have a Freewheel and they screw onto the hub which means that you just can't buy a wheel to replace it unless it has a freewheel hub on it. Most wheel come with free hubs now.

    I think your most cost effective ave would be to keep the hub, laced to a new stronger rim with 14g double butted spokes. It looks like your wheels are 36 spokes, so this would be a good route to take. I would just leave the front wheel alone until it dies.
    Last edited by jaxgtr; 05-23-09 at 07:33 PM.
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  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by jaxgtr View Post
    Your 2008 Fuji is 7 speed????? Wow, had no idea anyone still built a 7 spd setup. OK, looking up the components it looks like you are kind of limited in your options. You have a Freewheel and they screw onto the hub which means that you just can't buy a wheel to replace it unless it has a freewheel hub on it. Most wheel come with free hubs now.

    I think your most cost effective ave would be to keep the hub, laced to a new stronger rim with 14g double butted spokes. It looks like your wheels are 36 spokes, so this would be a good route to take. I would just leave the front wheel alone until it dies.
    That sounds like it's where I am going to go. Eventually, once I can afford it. Although, I had the best wheel guy I know take a look tonight and he said my fears are mostly unfounded. The Z1000 is a cheap rim, but pretty reliable for a cheap one, and what I'm finding online kinda backs that up. He said to keep an eye on it, but not overreact every time I hit a bump. He said my flats are likely a combination of underinflating and cheap tires. He told me not to be as afraid of overinflating, I'm not going to break the tubes filling them unless I go nuts. He said to stop guessing and get a tire gauge if I'm worried.

    I bought a Kevlar reinforced tire tonight for the rear wheel, and that should help prevent the flats Ive been getting from debris inside the tire. And he made me throw out my old tire levers. They were cheap and had rough edges that might have been damaging the tubes, specifically the one I saw with the strange area of damage. He thinks I punctured that one putting it on.

    I will definitely have new wheels built after the wedding.

  25. #25
    Senior Member jaxgtr's Avatar
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    Good on the tire and good move on the tire levers. I had one like that before and I did not notice it until I poked a hole in a tube. You might want to just have the wheel re-tension to to make sure everything has the proper tension on it now and then worry about the new wheel as time goes by. This should help reduce the truing each week. Should not run that much to have everything loosened and re-tensioned.
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    Quote Originally Posted by AEO View Post
    you should learn to embrace change, and mock it's failings every step of the way.

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