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  1. #1
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    The Great Deep V Debate

    I forgot to mention, the claims of poor quality was on new rims by Velocity, end of 2009, not on rims older than 1 year.

    http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...-up-on-a-wheel

    I just read a thread in the bike mechanics forum about the quality problems with Velocity Deep V's. Poster mentioned problems with the weld but I being a strong believer in the Deep V checked out the rim I just bought about a month or two ago. That and I was wondering if my wheel was junk.

    I believe Clifton wanted to post the thread claims here.


    So I did a little investigating and comparison myself being a quality control inspector.

    I took my calipers and gripped the weld/seam with th flat edges of the jaws, no gaps as claimed in the poor quality post. I checked the ends of the cuts along the extrusion, everything is perpendicular, no gap, no uneven cuts. I also checked the flatness at the weld/seam on a flat surface, no gaps as claimed. I even looked at the seam/weld at teh braking surface in the bright sunlight to see if I could find any low points, voids, deformities etc. NOTHING!

    I looked at the seam along the braking surface and what I could see on the rim, no gaps, nice and smooth, very even. I looked at the inside of the rim at the weld, very nice and nothing out of the ordinary comapared to several other rims I've seen. Actually much better than the Mavic rim I inspected along with teh Deep V. You will see th pics below and agree the Velocity Deep V is much nicer at the seam than the Mavic rim. Imagine what the inside of the Mavic rim looks like compared to the V as at this point, the V look that much better on the inside also. IMO, the Mavic looks like junk compared to the Deep V and Mavic is/was the standard in rims atone point.


    First off, the MAVIC RIM so taht you get an idea of how good the Deep V really looks. This is the seam/weld, looks like poop! I tried to get eh pics inside of another rim , which also looks just as bad but the camera didn't pick it up well enough to show.


    The Deep V seam/weld on the rim I wore out after 20,000 miles. Nice even seam, no big ugly gaps like the Mavic. THis is after 20,000 miles.


    But claims are being made against new Deep V which I happen to have. Looking at the rim from the side (not good picture but) in the sunlight, you can see the seam on the braking surface is very nice and smooth, no high edges, raised edges, bumps gap or inconsistencies like made in the post claiming poor quality.

    I placed arrows so that you would know where the seam is otherwise, you wouln't have known it was there.



    I also took my calipers and placed the flat edges and saw none of the discrepancies the other poster mentioned. I also placed it on a flat surface, nothing! If the pic looks a little crooked, there were no gaps, maybe cause I was trying to hold the rim and calipers with my left and shooting the pic with my right, hehe!

    Believe me, the cuts were straight/ perpendicular and even, no long sides or edges on the extrusion as claimed. Nothing more than a couple little weld beads ground down which is evident on most rims.

    I wish I could have gotten a clear pic of the Mavic rim from the inside, clearly junk compared to the Deep V, just look at the outside picture of the Mavic above!


    My advice is to get a good look at the rim if you are buying anew V. I see no problems and never had any but like with an other rim, inspect it along the seam/weld. But that's any rim purchased or built.

    Otherwise, I'll keep my faith in the V till I see otherwise. Every company has problems at one point or another. It's how they handle their customers' issues that makes a difference. I haven't seen anything yet or had problems with Velocity. Asa matter of fac, I've emailed reps beofre asking for dealer locations and stock, They responded very quickly which leads me to believe me that if I do ever have aproblem, I'll be able to contact them on the issue.

    No, I don't work for Velocity, just had great results with their product while so many others have failed.

    Note: Remember, the durabilty of a rim alo has to do with the builder, I actually paid a builder $100 to build a wheel that failed after 40 miles. I rebuilt it myself "for free" and it's also got over 20,000 miles!
    Last edited by Mr. Beanz; 04-02-10 at 06:35 PM.

  2. #2
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    Other comment, pro or con welcomed . Pics and proof helpful!...BTW, the new rim in the pics was only $56, god deal. If any rim had problems, I'd expect it to be one that was on sale!

    I also checked rim height throughout the entire circumference, brake surface width, and hole position of the spoke holes, all seem to be consistent. No doubts in my mind that this..................... is a fine rim.
    Last edited by Mr. Beanz; 04-02-10 at 02:57 PM.

  3. #3
    Infamous Member chipcom's Avatar
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    Thanks for going to the trouble of doing your own investigation and posting it.
    I've been using Fusions on a couple of my bikes for three years or so and love them, but put a new set of Deep V's on my main commuter this past fall. I have had no issues so far.

    Last edited by chipcom; 04-02-10 at 03:03 PM.
    "Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey

  4. #4
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chipcom View Post
    Thanks for going to the trouble of doing your own investigation and posting it.
    I've been using Fusions on a couple of my bikes for three years or so and love them, but put a new set of Deep V's on my main commuter this past fall. I have had no issues so far.
    It's funny cause the poster rec's Mavic rims. I have never had a good experience with Mavic, OP's being the worst! I do have CXP33 on the front of one roadie but, that's the front and Idont rid eit as much. My buddy had a 36 CXP on his roadie, same weight as I, and his builder could never keep it true. Maybe the builder but.......

    I would give the Kinlins a try. Looks like a good wheel but looks like a Velocity Deep V to me, only 5 mm shallow and 50 gms lighter (I read the numbers but forgot exacts). But for the same price, lighter weight and shallow rim, I need all the help I can get a I'm pretty hard on wheels. I'd stay with the V myself after so many good experiences. I see Psimet built a set of Kilins for a 150 guy in the road forum. I'm 70,80 lbs heavier, I'l keep the extra 5 mm and few grams of weight on the V as reinforcement.

  5. #5
    SuperGimp TrojanHorse's Avatar
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    Beanz, those look like UFO pictures, the kind where if you squint just right you can sort of make out yeah, that's what he means, I see it too!

    ha!

    Your camera can't focus that close (note how the blinds are in focus) so just step back and resist the urge to get super close ups.

    I had mavic open pros for years and basically lived with the rear break opened up to allow for the slight wobbling. I never noticed any kind of quality problems like you mentioned, I think the bike mechanics just didn't do a great job is all.

    I just got a set of Easton EA90SL for my new project bike, we'll see how they hold up under my butt.

  6. #6
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TrojanHorse View Post
    I had mavic open pros for years and basically lived with the rear break opened up to allow for the slight wobbling. I never noticed any kind of quality problems like you mentioned, I think the bike mechanics just didn't do a great job is all.
    My post isn't actually to dis Mavic but to show that Deep V's aren' the junk that otehrs (not that this poster said they were junk) but a few others have stated Velocity has a poor QC product.

    Some say Kinlin is superior as far as quality, I ask why and none ever have any proof or data. I'm just trying to show Velocity isn't any less than the others and why I wil continue to use them while others suggest we don't.

    But as far as Mavic OP's, mine split on the braking surface and the front cracked around the spoke holes...That was back in 98'ish(?). Guy at the shop later told me Mavic had some heat treat problems. Who knows, people say things all the time without proof but my rims failed. My postings are my experience with pics, again like I said, they aren't junk!

  7. #7
    SuperGimp TrojanHorse's Avatar
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    Man, my spelling is atrocious... I meant BRAKE not break.

    I guess at least one take away here is that not all products are completely consistent across model lines and years regardless of the "name"

    Why do you always learn about things like "oh yeah, they had head treat problems" later.

  8. #8
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TrojanHorse View Post
    Man, my spelling is atrocious... I meant BRAKE not break.

    I guess at least one take away here is that not all products are completely consistent across model lines and years regardless of the "name"

    Why do you always learn about things like "oh yeah, they had head treat problems" later.
    Along with my typing!

    Yeah, nobody ever sends you a card saying, "btw, let us replace the rim you bought from us".

    One of the big reasons I avoid the latest and greatest in rims. Low spoke this and that, lighter faster climbing wheels, then a year later, "We had a design flaw" after you've spent your money and they're toast.

    I don't look cool but I do fine with my traditional spoke wheel set ups!

  9. #9
    Senior Member Redskin8006's Avatar
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    I just checked mine. Purchased about a year ago. The seam on the outside breaking surface is fine, but I didn't feel like taking the tire off to check the inside. I can just barely feel the seam when I run my finger across it. Mainly at the edge of the rim next to the tire. I compared the Deep Vs to a set of Shimano wheels that came with my new bike, and the stock Kore wheels that came with my old bike. The seam on the Kore's is the most prominent of the three. Then the Shimano's. Best by far is the Deep V.

    When the Deep Vs were new, the seam on the inside was sticking up a little and it wore holes in my tubes after about 300 miles (twice). That problem seems to have worked itself out (if not I was going to get some rim tape).

    The only problem I've had with my Deep V wheels is the Velocity hub. Had to get it swapped out 'cause the axle was bent or something.

  10. #10
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redskin8006 View Post
    When the Deep Vs were new, the seam on the inside was sticking up a little and it wore holes in my tubes after about 300 miles (twice). That problem seems to have worked itself out (if not I was going to get some rim tape). .
    ...no rim strip at all? Or the stock plastic sucker? Not sure what you meant but I'd never go rim stripless.

    Quote Originally Posted by Redskin8006 View Post
    The only problem I've had with my Deep V wheels is the Velocity hub. Had to get it swapped out 'cause the axle was bent or something.
    I've never used their hubs so I'd be lost on that one!

  11. #11
    Senior Member socalrider's Avatar
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    I use my deep v's on my cyclocross bike and take it up into the hills off road all the time and still no issues.. I have 36h rear / 32h front.. Just had a V.Aerohead built up a few months back and is still rock solid on my road bike..

    The quality of Mavic rims has gone down over the years.. This is why I try to get people to look at DT Swiss or Velocity rims.. The quality of the DT Swiss is a little better than Velocity but you pay a premium for the better rims.

    I do still use Mavic rims but they are from several generations ago, mostly Mavic Open 4cd's and open pro's from 10 years ago, when the quality was much better..

  12. #12
    Senior Member Redskin8006's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Beanz View Post
    ...no rim strip at all? Or the stock plastic sucker? Not sure what you meant but I'd never go rim stripless.
    Nope, my LBS built the wheels with velo plugs. Supposedly lighter than rim tape, like I care about a few grams at 226 lbs. Actually, the LBS did a great job with the wheels. I'm loving them (as long as the hubs don't become a problem).

  13. #13
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by socalrider View Post
    The quality of Mavic rims has gone down over the years..
    I'm not willing to spend $20-$30 per rim to confirm my suspicions. I rarely see Mavics on sale or at a decent price. Not willing to take the financial risk to find out you are correct!



    Quote Originally Posted by socalrider View Post
    This is why I try to get people to look at DT Swiss or Velocity rims.. The quality of the DT Swiss is a little better than Velocity but you pay a premium for the better rims.
    Again, I hear people say "better quality" but what does that mean, how do you know? I've never gotten an answer on this question. Do you have them, did you compare the seam, welds what makes you claim the DT Swiss are better quality?

    Either way, I'd might try the more affordable Kinlins if I ever had problems with Velocity which I haven't. But the DT logos are just too bold for me, I like the plain look.

    I question the DT claims of better quality and other more expensive products at times, so I'm curios. I looked at some DT hubs online about 2 months ago. Holy bejeepers $250!! But then a week later, read a post about some dudes DT hubs falling apart!

  14. #14
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redskin8006 View Post
    Nope, my LBS built the wheels with velo plugs. Supposedly lighter than rim tape, like I care about a few grams at 226 lbs. Actually, the LBS did a great job with the wheels. I'm loving them (as long as the hubs don't become a problem).
    Ah! I've always used rim tape and prolly always will. One reason is that I've had the Mavic rims damage my tubes where the weld bead inside near the seam. I had to file it down and sand it to keep from cutting the tubes.

    I know some rims are designed to go without (Mavic SL) but too rich for my blood!

  15. #15
    Embracing the fredness herbm's Avatar
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    Hey Mr B....
    I have both Velocity Fusions and Kinlin 27mms...Love them both....Was very glad to get rid of my OP's
    Next time I might do a deep V for the rear ....
    BTW..I have been using the veloplugs....really nice...no tape to wear and they can give that extra room for mounting tires on a tight rim!
    Wheel Sucker Extraordinaire

  16. #16
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    Whoah! Herb in the Clyde forum? I read that pugs, extra room and tight tires but never had the problem with my combos.

    Out of Curiosity, why would you use a V next time since you have the Kinlins & Fusions when they look about the sameas the V?

    Quote Originally Posted by herbm View Post
    Hey Mr B....
    I have both Velocity Fusions and Kinlin 27mms...Love them both....Was very glad to get rid of my OP's
    Next time I might do a deep V for the rear ....
    BTW..I have been using the veloplugs....really nice...no tape to wear and they can give that extra room for mounting tires on a tight rim!

  17. #17
    Senior Member Herbie53's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Beanz View Post
    Whoah! Herb in the Clyde forum? I read that pugs, extra room and tight tires but never had the problem with my combos.

    Out of Curiosity, why would you use a V next time since you have the Kinlins & Fusions when they look about the sameas the V?
    I'm noodling doing a wheel with a Kinlin rim from the PSIMET guy.... sure looks similar to the Velocity. Will be good to hear what the differences might be.
    "Today me will live in the moment, unless it's unpleasant, then me will eat cookie." -Cookie Monster

  18. #18
    SERENITY NOW!!! jyossarian's Avatar
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    I have 4 year old Deep V's on my fixed gear commuter. They crush pot holes, not the other way around.
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  19. #19
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jyossarian View Post
    I have 4 year old Deep V's on my fixed gear commuter. They crush pot holes, not the other way around.
    I guess I should have been more clear. The guy that said here was a problem said it was on recently produced rims, end of 2009 rims.

    4 y/o rims would be exempt from the problem.

  20. #20
    SERENITY NOW!!! jyossarian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Beanz View Post
    I guess I should have been more clear. The guy that said here was a problem said it was on recently produced rims, end of 2009 rims.

    4 y/o rims would be exempt from the problem.
    You were clear. I was just bragging.
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  21. #21
    Fresh Garbage hairnet's Avatar
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    My rim is from around that time and it's going well. The only ding to the rim was my fault for not topping off my tire. I had the rim for while I was a clyde, I'm still borderline. No issues here with bunny hops, curb hops, skip stops, and a few crashes.

    Last edited by hairnet; 04-03-10 at 01:32 AM.
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  22. #22
    Senior Member mr.smith.pdx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Beanz View Post
    Ah! I've always used rim tape and prolly always will.
    Speaking of rim tape:

    I bought some wheels or my wife from a guy off of craigslist. He had a buddy that had 'discovered' that fiber reinforced scotch tape was "great as a rim strip!"

    He did it on one of the wheels I bought from him. Has anyone ever heard of this?

    It's the wife's wheel. I figured I'd leave it and see what happened. I fix all her tubes anyway.

    My only concern is if water gets in there and dissolves the glue and goops up the rim.

    (Look Mr. Beanz, I am on the Clyde forum!) ::

  23. #23
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jyossarian View Post
    You were clear. I was just bragging.
    Nothing wrong with that!

  24. #24
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mr.smith.pdx View Post
    Speaking of rim tape:

    I bought some wheels or my wife from a guy off of craigslist. He had a buddy that had 'discovered' that fiber reinforced scotch tape was "great as a rim strip!"

    He did it on one of the wheels I bought from him. Has anyone ever heard of this?

    It's the wife's wheel. I figured I'd leave it and see what happened. I fix all her tubes anyway.

    My only concern is if water gets in there and dissolves the glue and goops up the rim.

    (Look Mr. Beanz, I am on the Clyde forum!) ::


    I did a century on a rather new set of wheels (that's when I learned it's not wise to use new equipment before it's tested and proved) the stock cheap rim strip moved to the side exposing the spoke holes about 70 miles into the ride. I flatted but made it to the rest stop where a support dude suggested electrical tape as an on the road fix. It worked fine but I did get a new rim strip. I carried a small roll of tape for a month or so till the rimstrip proved reliable!

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