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  1. #26
    Travelling hopefully chasm54's Avatar
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    Here's the Garmin stats for what was probably my hilliest day, from Kilkenny to Dublin through the Wicklow mountains in Southern Ireland. Just over 10000 feet of climbing in just short of 130 miles. As you can see, I didn't exactly break the land speed record but as this was the final day of a four-day, 500 mile tour I feel I have an excuse. LOL

    Oh, and ignore the calorie count. The Garmin 305 overstated calorie consumption by a factor of about two.
    There have been many days when I haven't felt like riding, but there has never been a day when I was sorry I rode.

  2. #27
    Gears? CliftonGK1's Avatar
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    The ride I'm prepping for this weekend is 300k, mostly forest service roads, and 12,000' of climbing.
    Pre-riders' report just posted:

    1. There were far more Elk than cars on the road from Packwood in the morning … they can dart out in front of you suddenly, so keep an eye out and the hands on the brakes. There were a few on the way back into town too!

    2. Food & Water – Other than Randle, which is right by the start/finish, there are very few spots for food (Trout Lake & Northwoods) and only a few spots for water. Pay attention to how much water you’ve got and make sure you’re filled up – you may want three bottles. Slim pickings at Northwoods … and no ice cream.

    3. Huckleberry Shake at Trout Lake- worth the ride by itself!

    4. Time – This is not a fast route. The average time is 2005 was 16 hours (we took just under 17 hours); by comparison this spring’s 300K average times were under 14 and ˝ hours. If you are a slower rider, you’ll need to minimize your stop times!

    5. Rough Roads. While much of the ride is on nice, quiet roads, the descent on NF-25 and a few patches on NF-88 & 90 can be dangerous. You need to be focused on the road and be ready to brake or adjust your path.

    6. Dirt/Gravel Section. There is a long stretch of NF-23 that is dirt/gravel (about 20K, both ascending & descending). I rode on 28’s and wished I had had something bigger. It is NOT a ride for narrow tires. It was difficult to stand on the way up, as it often meant the back wheel would spin.

    - The vibrations were so strong that one of Vinnie’s taillights bounced off, Mike’s brakes adjusted shut, and my Garmin came unplugged.
    - Vinnie is petitioning RUSA for extra distance credit for all the zig-zagging involved
    - Just like the other freeway lane being faster, the other side of the road always had the smoother, more solid stretch of dirt … at least until you got there.
    - There is at least an extra 1,000 feet of climbing on the route if you count all of the extra up & downs from the vibrations... an inch at a time.
    - Robin noted I had a huge grin on my face at the end of this stretch
    … and
    I noted that it was because it was the end of the stretch!

    7. Self-support. There is no cell coverage on most of this route, and as it is generally through the mountains, there are no pay phones or corner convenience stores to get support at (aside from Randle, Trout Lake, & Northwoods) … make sure you have spare tubes, tire, pump, tools, etc. Otherwise it could be a long wait or walk …

    8. You may want to bring a camera … there are some great views of Mt. Adams & Mt. St Helens, as well as rivers & forest scenes along the way.

    Plan for a great time
    "I feel like my world was classier before I found cyclocross."
    - Mandi M.

  3. #28
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jr59 View Post
    Thankfully I live in New Orleans. We don't even have overpasses to ride over. We are flatter than Fl. Yay for me.

    You guys can have all those hills.

    2500-3500==
    3501==5000==
    anything over 5001== YOU HAVE LOST YOUR MIND!
    LOL!
    It's not as bad as you think. It's just a matter of getting used to it. A local fun ride is 2300ft in 8 miles. A decent workout is nearly 5000 ft in 21 miles. Most riders shy away from a climb after the intial "it hurt" ride. But it gets better the more you do it. Riders that actually give it a chance end up really liking the climbs. It's a whole nudder aspect of enjoyment as far as cycling

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by TomD77 View Post
    I live in Florida and hope to never see anything like that on a bike.
    Quote Originally Posted by jr59 View Post
    Thankfully I live in New Orleans. We don't even have overpasses to ride over. We are flatter than Fl. Yay for me.

    You guys can have all those hills.

    2500-3500==
    3501==5000==
    anything over 5001== YOU HAVE LOST YOUR MIND!
    LOL!
    I don't really understand this attitude. For many people, bicycling is a form of exercise. Doing climbs is a great way to get exercise.

    Doing hills is hard but it allows you to ride in places that are not flat (and there are a lot of great places to ride that are not flat).

    (Of course, if you don't live in a hilly area, it's hard to get good at doing hills!)

    =========================

    Quote Originally Posted by Homeyba View Post
    I just got over riding through the Appellations in WV, Maryland and PA in June and there you go giving me nightmares again...
    Cupertino effect? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cupertino_effect
    Last edited by njkayaker; 08-02-10 at 01:28 PM.

  5. #30
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by njkayaker View Post
    I don't really understand this attitude. For many people, bicycling is a form of exercise. Doing climbs is a great way to get exercise.

    Doing hills is hard but it allows you to ride in places that are not flat (and there are a lot of great places to ride that are not flat).
    Zactly! I know the fun rides (organized) out here are promoted as flat ride but there is always some sort of climb. It's funny to watch riders struggle up a 1/2 mile climb then after the ride complain that it was supposed to be a flat ride.

  6. #31
    Gears? CliftonGK1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by njkayaker View Post
    Obviously a spelling based on phonetics of not having lived in the Appalachians. I spent 9 years in the Appalachian foothills of SE Ohio, and (at least there,) the pronounciation is "Applatchin." (short "a" for both)
    "I feel like my world was classier before I found cyclocross."
    - Mandi M.

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Beanz View Post
    Zactly! I know the fun rides (organized) out here are promoted as flat ride but there is always some sort of climb. It's funny to watch riders struggle up a 1/2 mile climb then after the ride complain that it was supposed to be a flat ride.
    I'd give people who ride infrequently some slack about hills.

    I'm assuming most people here are not infrequent riders and are interested in being better riders. For these people, avoiding hills isn't a good idea (in my opinion). Of course, what's fun for some people (crazy hill climbing) might not be fun for everybody. But everybody should work on doing some climbing (even if it's not crazy) even if it's not their favorite thing to do.

    In norther NJ, liking hill work makes riding here much more practical (really)!

  8. #33
    Senior Member jr59's Avatar
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    You know ridding hills is great when you live in a place with hills. IMO; I would never like to suffer ridding a hill again. I don't have to so I don't. I lived in Atl. Ga. and dealt with those hills, I rode the Death ride in NoCal., and several rides like the hilly hundred, and the horrible hilly hundred. So I know how to do it, I don't want to.

    I can ride most into the ground in 100+ heat with 95% humidity. Come on down in the middle of the summer. I can do this because that is where I live. People who live with hills, learn to ride with hills. People who live in the mountains, learn to ride in the mountains.

    So I guess I am not a rider because I don't care for hills, because I would have to pack my bike in the car, or plane, to go find hills? I don't think so.

    I read ALOT of threads on here, with people saying "it's to hot" or how do you deal with the heat? I don't question those people, but some on here would question why I don't ride or like hills?

  9. #34
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jr59 View Post
    So I guess I am not a rider because I don't care for hills, because I would have to pack my bike in the car, or plane, to go find hills? I don't think so.
    Who are you fighting with, yourself? I don't recall anyone saying riders that a ride that doesn't like hills is less riders. I've read riders should ride hills since we are all here looking for fitness and my comments, riders should do hills cause there is always some kind of hill on fun rides.

    But for argument sake, I don't buy into your claim. There are a ton of clyde riders out here, including skinny riders with high end bikes, top of the line climbing wheels, and gear that won't touch any of the local climbs.
    Last edited by Mr. Beanz; 08-02-10 at 06:29 PM.

  10. #35
    Gears? CliftonGK1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jr59 View Post
    You know ridding hills is great when you live in a place with hills. IMO; I would never like to suffer ridding a hill again. I don't have to so I don't. I lived in Atl. Ga. and dealt with those hills, I rode the Death ride in NoCal., and several rides like the hilly hundred, and the horrible hilly hundred. So I know how to do it, I don't want to.

    I can ride most into the ground in 100+ heat with 95% humidity. Come on down in the middle of the summer. I can do this because that is where I live. People who live with hills, learn to ride with hills. People who live in the mountains, learn to ride in the mountains.

    So I guess I am not a rider because I don't care for hills, because I would have to pack my bike in the car, or plane, to go find hills? I don't think so.

    I read ALOT of threads on here, with people saying "it's to hot" or how do you deal with the heat? I don't question those people, but some on here would question why I don't ride or like hills?
    You can keep the heat, and I'll take all the hills.
    I'm riding that 300k with 12,000' of gain this weekend... if it's over 75 degrees I'm going to piss and moan about it being too hot. It was almost 80 when I was doing Stevens Pass over the weekend and I thought I was going to melt. Gimmie overcast and 65 degrees any day!
    "I feel like my world was classier before I found cyclocross."
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  11. #36
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    honestly my ride of 35 miles with 5000 ft of gain was not that hard. There is one stretch in palisades park that is somewhat brutal but quite frankly it lasts for about 20 minutes max. I put it in my super granny gear of 30/34 and just spun and spun and spun. It was slow going but i made it almost all the way with out stopping. the first time i did it I was on a bike less suited with a lowest gear of 30/28 and i had to stop a couple of times. Ultimately the only reason i did stop was that I had a ton of sweat dripping off of me and at the slow 6 or 7mph speed i was going, I didn't want to bother grabbing the water bottle and drinking while riding, it made more sense to just stop and drink. What i didn't realize was I was only a quarter mile from the end of the hilll (only my 2nd time doing this route so I'm not super familiar) had I known, I would have just gone the whole way. The reality about all of that alititude gain is that when it's in the form of rolling hills it isn't that hard. If Mr. Beanz is starting a ride that goes consistently for 8 miles uphill that is far more difficult than what i did which was probably about 1.5 continuous uphill miles max.

  12. #37
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigdaddy10028 View Post
    If Mr. Beanz is starting a ride that goes consistently for 8 miles uphill that is far more difficult than what i did which was probably about 1.5 continuous uphill miles max.
    As much as I share the some opinion, some would argue that rolling hills are tougher. I've had some posters swear that 50 miles of rollers is much harder than a straight 62 mile 10,000 ft climb. Some say a flat century is harder than a climbing century. I don't understand it but........

    Everyone has their opinions but my ride times:

    flat century solo:................................................................5:45
    rolling hills century...........................................................5:30
    straight climb century 62 up then 42 down loop..............7:40

    I'm guessing I worked harder on the climbing century

  13. #38
    Travelling hopefully chasm54's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Beanz View Post
    As much as I share the some opinion, some would argue that rolling hills are tougher. I've had some posters swear that 50 miles of rollers is much harder than a straight 62 mile 10,000 ft climb. Some say a flat century is harder than a climbing century. I don't understand it......
    Of course one is generally faster on the flat. but I'd take a hilly century over a flat one, even though it would take me longer. if it is pan-flat it is relentless, and monotonous, and there's no brief opportunity to recover on the (non-existent) downhills. And in a headwind you just have to grind on without relief.
    There have been many days when I haven't felt like riding, but there has never been a day when I was sorry I rode.

  14. #39
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chasm54 View Post
    Of course one is generally faster on the flat. but I'd take a hilly century over a flat one, even though it would take me longer. if it is pan-flat it is relentless, and monotonous, and there's no brief opportunity to recover on the (non-existent) downhills. And in a headwind you just have to grind on without relief.
    I'm the opposite I guess. I can ride a flat trail with headwinds and like it! I get the runner's high type thingy!

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    yeah, I can see how a flat century is brutal because it is just constant work. Flat ground in a headwind might as well be going up a frigging hill. Hills you at least know end SOMEWHERE, headwinds are forever!

  16. #41
    Senior Member jr59's Avatar
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    There are MANY ways to achieve fitness. Hills are one way, NOT the only way. Nor are the only fun rides the ones with hills. Those claims are simply foolish or your opinion only. There are MANY fun rides that have less than 1000 feet of climbing, take the southern route of RAGBRAI. What makes the ride fun is the people that you ride with. NOT hills!

    I'm not saying that hills are a bad thing, but what I am saying is that hills don't make a ride. You live in upland CA. Clifton lives in WA. For the people who live in and around hills that is great.

    For me, I'll take the flats and do interval work, speed work and L S D, to get in shape.

    As far as losing weight, my friend, who is a dr, put it as easy as these 2 things. Ride more and eat less, and if it really taste good, DON'T eat it, it can't be good for you.

    BTW; temp at 5:30am this morn, 93 with 87% hum. 30 miles in 1;45. Pretty good for me and my sore knee. Oh yes, it was flat. And down 20 lbs, in the last 45 days.

  17. #42
    Gears? CliftonGK1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jr59 View Post
    There are MANY ways to achieve fitness. Hills are one way, NOT the only way. Nor are the only fun rides the ones with hills. Those claims are simply foolish or your opinion only.
    No one ever said hills are the only way to get fit or to have fun. Settle down.

    The Seattle to Portland double is one of the most fun rides ever. There's less than 3000' of gain for the entire route. One of the SIR members just registered a new 100k Permanent route with under 750' of gain; that's an average of only 12' gain/mile.

    Quote Originally Posted by jr59 View Post
    As far as losing weight, my friend, who is a dr, put it as easy as these 2 things. Ride more and eat less, and if it really taste good, DON'T eat it, it can't be good for you.
    Not true. I love chard, zucchini, tomatoes, grapefruit, bananas, and pretty much any other fresh fruit and vegetables I get from my CSA but I think Big Macs are disgusting.
    Last edited by CliftonGK1; 08-03-10 at 08:43 AM. Reason: added more instead of a second post
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  18. #43
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jr59 View Post
    There are MANY ways to achieve fitness. Hills are one way, NOT the only way. Nor are the only fun rides the ones with hills. Those claims are simply foolish or your opinion only..
    What's foolish is your quoting me on something I didn't say, where did I say that hills are the only way and the only fun rides involve hills?

    If you watch any of my videos, you'd see that plenty of my fun rides are on totally flat ground with my wife and friends.

    Like I said, I am not sure from where you are quoting my statements and opinions.


    Is this the starment earlier in the thread from which you quote my opinions and statements?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Beanz View Post
    It's a whole nudder aspect of enjoyment as far as cycling
    Last edited by Mr. Beanz; 08-03-10 at 09:14 AM.

  19. #44
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigdaddy10028 View Post
    yeah, I can see how a flat century is brutal because it is just constant work. Flat ground in a headwind might as well be going up a frigging hill. Hills you at least know end SOMEWHERE, headwinds are forever!
    Well that's where I disgree with many riders. Maybe it's the ride. On a flat century, you can ride out 50 miles into the wind then return with a tailwind. One of the climbing rides I do is pretty much 62 miles straight climbing.

    It all depends on the indivdual ride. You'd have to do mine (generally speaking), then I'd have to experience yours to compare.

    I've had some riders tell me all my rides were sissy rides as I post mostly pics of riding with the wife. One guy said his rides were tougher, hills and big winds and no way did mine compare. We rode tegether, no way could he keep up. It's all relative.

  20. #45
    Senior Member Herbie53's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Beanz View Post
    Well that's where I disgree with many riders. Maybe it's the ride. On a flat century, you can ride out 50 miles into the wind then return with a tailwind. One of the climbing rides I do is pretty much 62 miles straight climbing.

    It all depends on the indivdual ride. You'd have to do mine (generally speaking), then I'd have to experience yours to compare.

    I've had some riders tell me all my rides were sissy rides as I post mostly pics of riding with the wife. One guy said his rides were tougher, hills and big winds and no way did mine compare. We rode tegether, no way could he keep up. It's all relative.
    Are you gettin' this place all wound up again? Good! It was getting way too quiet.

    PS - my vote is that hills aren't in the way, they are the way... maybe not the only way, but they work pretty dern good.
    "Today me will live in the moment, unless it's unpleasant, then me will eat cookie." -Cookie Monster

  21. #46
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Herbie53 View Post
    Are you gettin' this place all wound up again? Good! It was getting way too quiet..
    Not at all. My claim is that hills can be fun! I guess I'm a bad guy!

    I myself ride the hills for fitness and strength. But as far as who's ride is tougher, no way to compare unless you both do the same ride, same day, same time. I might think my hill is tougher but you may come down and kick my butt on my home turf after training on the flat ground, ya never know, it happens!

    But let me add, I ride mtns, hills, flats, and mtb. It's nice, fun, and beneficial to mix it up. NOTE: I did not say mixing it up is the only way!.. I really think I'm lucky cause we have it all here.

  22. #47
    Senior Member Herbie53's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Beanz View Post
    Not at all. My claim is that hills can be fun! I guess I'm a bad guy!
    They are!

    I know how you feel about powermeters, but I recently bought one and the first most obvious thing I learned was that it is really hard to have the discipline to go hard (keep the power up) on the flats and descents vs. when climbing... put another way, a hill is like a coach yelling in your ear saying don't let up you big wussy!!!
    "Today me will live in the moment, unless it's unpleasant, then me will eat cookie." -Cookie Monster

  23. #48
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Herbie53 View Post
    I know how you feel about powermeters,!!
    I have nothing against them ! I won't comment on the issue!

  24. #49
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    Me and hills have a love hate relationship. I love hating them and hate loving them. I try to throw in some hills on every ride. Even if they are just rolling hills. I am actually glad I do more climbing rides, because I am signing up for a Triathlon and the bike course hilly. There are some long hills and they are tough. I hold a group ride on Wednesday nights, and a couple of the riders did not like to ride anything that wasnt flat. I would choose some routes that were relatively flat one week and then the next week, we would climb some the next week. Now they are used to doing the climbing the smaller hills, so every once in a while I put in the option or riding some short steep hills. One we do is 400 feet of climbing. Not exactly sure how long of a climb it is, but it starts out at a 7% grade and about 1/2 ways up it goes to a 13% grade. That hill is always optional because its actually the turn around point of the ride. The group actually like to climb it now. Hills give us the satisfaction that we know we climbed that hill and we conquered it.
    It is not about the destination. It is about the journey getting there.
    Competitors work until they get it right, but champions work until they can't get it wrong.

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