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Unsuccesful Century Attempt Lessons learned, ride report, questions

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Unsuccesful Century Attempt Lessons learned, ride report, questions

Old 10-04-11, 10:10 PM
  #76  
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Originally Posted by goldfinch
Sayre Kulp is young.
No reason to hold that against him. He'll grow out of it. :-)
 
Old 10-04-11, 11:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Mithrandir
First off, I have not planned another century yet, so I have no idea what you're talking about. But thanks for insulting me for absolutely no reason.

If you had payed any attention to me whatsoever, then you would have realised that my next non-commute ride will have more climbing in it than I've ever done, and I'm alternating going distance then height. It is working for me, thank you very much. Every month I do more and more climbing and I'm getting clearly better at it.

Secondly I challenge you to try some of your oh-so-magnificent climbing skills whilst carrying an extra 100+ pounds. Seriously I dare you to try doing a 'tiny' 4000 ft climb at 356 pounds, and come back and report how amazingly easy it was. You are the only person on the planet who has criticized me for the hills I do. Every other roadie I meet in real life has told me that they are in awe of me that I'm even attempting them. So go get some dumbells, put them on your bike, and climb. Until then, I don't want to hear another criticism from you.
i dont think this was aimed at you and while it is a bit "brutal" it is a very honest assessment of the training that one needs to achieve certain goals, I.E. your not going to get into the Mr Olympia without picking up some weights.......so the assessment and advice is spot on and well put
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Old 10-04-11, 11:13 PM
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You can never fail if you learn something from the ordeal..................
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Old 10-05-11, 04:03 AM
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Originally Posted by paisan
We went from Sherando Lakes up to Reed's Gap then to Fork Mountain Overlook on that trip.
You won't find anything even remotely like climbing up Reeds Gap on Skyline Drive, believe me

On the first section from the northern entrance, the only notable "climbs" are the first six miles from the entrance, and then the climb up Hogback before rolling down into Elk Wallow. Neither goes above 6%, so they're just longish. Hogback is about 3 miles.

From where 211 crosses at Thornton Gap there's a pretty good climb up to The Pinnacles, and then a bit more up to Skyland (the highest point.) But Big Meadows is almost the same elevation, so it's uphill to there. If you want more of a challenge you can roll down into Sperryville on Rt 211 and then climb back up. That takes you from about 700 feet to 3700 at Skyland. Thornton Gap is about 2280 feet.

Seriously, if you've done anything on the BRP, there's nothing on Skyline that is any harder. Have a great trip!

BTW, they had snow at Big Meadows on Sunday

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Old 10-05-11, 05:24 AM
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Mr. B: Thank you. I am hitting the gym more since the weather is changing and days are getting shorter (and I have to work). Is there anything in the gym I can do to help me climb better?
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Old 10-05-11, 05:42 AM
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Originally Posted by JimF22003
You won't find anything even remotely like climbing up Reeds Gap on Skyline Drive, believe me

On the first section from the northern entrance, the only notable "climbs" are the first six miles from the entrance, and then the climb up Hogback before rolling down into Elk Wallow. Neither goes above 6%, so they're just longish. Hogback is about 3 miles.

From where 211 crosses at Thornton Gap there's a pretty good climb up to The Pinnacles, and then a bit more up to Skyland (the highest point.) But Big Meadows is almost the same elevation, so it's uphill to there. If you want more of a challenge you can roll down into Sperryville on Rt 211 and then climb back up. That takes you from about 700 feet to 3700 at Skyland. Thornton Gap is about 2280 feet.

Seriously, if you've done anything on the BRP, there's nothing on Skyline that is any harder. Have a great trip!

BTW, they had snow at Big Meadows on Sunday
Thanks for the insight!!

Not sure what your plans are for the weekend but if you don't mind watching a bunch of flatlanders suffer their way up you are more than welcome to join us. We get into town late friday but don't plan on riding the northern leg until around noon Saturday. Shoot me a PM if you're interested.
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Old 10-05-11, 05:50 AM
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Originally Posted by chefisaac
Mr. B: Thank you. I am hitting the gym more since the weather is changing and days are getting shorter (and I have to work). Is there anything in the gym I can do to help me climb better?
In the absence of Mr B, I'd say not much that is climbing specific. Anything you do to get fitter will help, of course, and working on your core will certainly be of benefit.

One candidate is a stepping machine, like stairmaster or its equivalent. It only approximates the experience of climbing out of the saddle, but that can be helpful because one of the techniques for recovering on the bike while climbing is to shift up one or two gears, stand up out of the saddle, and proceed at a lower cadence than you were employing while seated. If you can slow the cadence down to the sort of rhythm you'd use on the stepping machine, you can use your bodyweight to give your quads a break and get your HR down a bit before resuming a seated position and shifting down again.

Oh, and outside the gym, always choosing the stairs rather than the lift isn't a bad idea either. Every little helps. But there's no doubt that the best training for hill-climbing is hill-climbing.
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Old 10-05-11, 12:18 PM
  #83  
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Originally Posted by longhaultrucker
i dont think this was aimed at you and while it is a bit "brutal" it is a very honest assessment of the training that one needs to achieve certain goals, I.E. your not going to get into the Mr Olympia without picking up some weights.......so the assessment and advice is spot on and well put
Exactly! I've been described as a drill sargeant by some ride partners on the bike and when I pumped iron with partners that asked me to train with them. I may be brutal at times but results don't come easy. ...and my point is, we all suffer to get there.
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Old 10-05-11, 12:22 PM
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Originally Posted by chefisaac
Mr. B: Thank you. I am hitting the gym more since the weather is changing and days are getting shorter (and I have to work). Is there anything in the gym I can do to help me climb better?
Honeslty, I can't be of much help in this dept. I have never used the gym approach to aid in climbing so I can not offer advice on something I have never done and know nothing about, unlike so many others.

I'd have to leave it to others to offer help and advice on your situation.
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Old 10-05-11, 02:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Neil_B
No reason to hold that against him. He'll grow out of it. :-)
Hey, I'm just jealous of his youth!
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Old 10-06-11, 03:47 AM
  #86  
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Originally Posted by paisan
Thanks for the insight!!

Not sure what your plans are for the weekend but if you don't mind watching a bunch of flatlanders suffer their way up you are more than welcome to join us. We get into town late friday but don't plan on riding the northern leg until around noon Saturday. Shoot me a PM if you're interested.
Thanks for the offer. I think I'm going to stay out of the park until after all the leaves fall off Have fun. Looks like it's going to be great weather for the weekend.
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Old 10-06-11, 02:05 PM
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Started adding in more hills today, took my normal route but added a leg that is 1.5 miles up hill @4% for the first 3/4 mile and 9% for the last. As long as I didnt look up it was OK Did just shy of 20 miles today with (per map my ride) 1300+- feet of climbing. I am going to keep pushing through for now without the compact and see how it goes.

On the chafing note, fitter is recommending a new saddle due to the change in positioning and weight distribution. He suggested a fizik antares versus which they have a 1 wk test saddle for. I have a real hard time mentally justifying a $179 saddle. Anyone have some other suggestions? Seems as though my sit bones are wider than my current saddle. When I was reaching for the bars weight was distributed to my hands so my rear didnt chaf. Now it is an issue.
Thank you, I am truly shocked and grateful at all of the positive responses.
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Old 10-06-11, 02:17 PM
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Originally Posted by ahultin
Started adding in more hills today, took my normal route but added a leg that is 1.5 miles up hill @4% for the first 3/4 mile and 9% for the last. As long as I didnt look up it was OK Did just shy of 20 miles today with (per map my ride) 1300+- feet of climbing. I am going to keep pushing through for now without the compact and see how it goes.
Not looking up is not a bad idea. Until you gain confidence in your ability, seeing how far you have to go can be discouraging. Just keep plugging away. If you can manage without the compact, good for you. Personally I think they are a good idea, unless you are racing there is really very little advantage to a 53 chainring, and having the 34 does make a big difference.

On the chafing note, fitter is recommending a new saddle due to the change in positioning and weight distribution. He suggested a fizik antares versus which they have a 1 wk test saddle for. I have a real hard time mentally justifying a $179 saddle. Anyone have some other suggestions? Seems as though my sit bones are wider than my current saddle. When I was reaching for the bars weight was distributed to my hands so my rear didnt chaf. Now it is an issue.
Can't comment on the Antares, I haven't used one. It is certainly important to get one the right width for your sit bones, though. Take the one week test, there is no substitute for an extended trial.

A 20 mile ride with 1300ft of climbing is ideal, that is the sort of intensity you are going to get on moderately hilly centuries. Keep at it, you'll be amazed at how quickly the hills get less intimidating.
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Old 10-06-11, 02:41 PM
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Saddle = Brooks B17 -best $90 you will ever spend.
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Old 10-06-11, 03:00 PM
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I'm using a Serfas RX saddle. They come in three different widths, mine being the narrowest at 6.75".
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Old 10-06-11, 04:56 PM
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Brooks would be nice but we travel most summers and so the bike does 5-8000 miles on the roof rack through various weather (aka, I don't believe I could provide a leather saddle with the loving home it needs )
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Old 10-06-11, 07:55 PM
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Originally Posted by ahultin
Started adding in more hills today, took my normal route but added a leg that is 1.5 miles up hill @4% for the first 3/4 mile and 9% for the last. As long as I didnt look up it was OK Did just shy of 20 miles today with (per map my ride) 1300+- feet of climbing. I am going to keep pushing through for now without the compact and see how it goes. .
Excellent! Keep at that same hills section for a while then that sucker will be too small for your bad self in no time!

That's the spirit soldier!

BTW, when I make suggestions like those I made in this thread, along with a few others, I/we tend to take a lot of heat but when someone like you actually goes out there and says "Just Do It!" Nike fashion, that makes it all worth it......... Thanks, you made my day!

Last edited by Mr. Beanz; 10-06-11 at 07:59 PM.
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Old 10-06-11, 08:30 PM
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wow you guys have overthought this big time. He has the wrong equipment for the job. As others said, this was a joke of a century regarding elevation gain. The problem is the combo of incredible endurance AND hills. And sometimes a ride with lots of short steep climbs is more brutal than long gradual climbs because you can't help but have to go into "the red" a little more on a real short steep climb. People don't realize how much that really does burn you out early on. Do you ever see marathoners suddenly do a 50 yard dash in the middle of a marathon? If they did that just a few times they would Fry themselves and stand no chance of finishing in a good time.

In my opinion almost anyone over 200 lbs probably should have a compact. If you 200lbs on the button you might have an 11-21 casette but you would be hard pressed to tell me that your going to spin out of that all that often unless you have wide open downhills all over the place and even still a 50/11 will get you 35+mph before you spin out of it. IF your century is moderate than a compact with 11/28 should be good and if it's really hilly you may even want a 32 cog.

The other thing that is important is to always use your largest cog on every significant hill right from the beginning. Don't start out and say "I feel good so I'm gonna mash up this hill right away" keep it easy and conserve so that when you get late in the century you can increase your intensity if your still feeling strong.

OP, you psyched yourself out. nothing in your post tells me that there was any reason for you to stop, you chose to quit rather than press on. Chafing should have been a non issue, if you had done 70+ miles in the past you should have had that prepared. Clydes also make way too much out of nutrition. first of all, most of us have tons of excess body fat so as long as we take in a consistent supply of sugar we will be able to burn some of that fat as well but fat burns in carbohydrate flame. All you need to do on long rides is eat your normal meals and then set a target calorie mark to take in each hour. My target is 300 calories an hour. My organized centuries have had rest stops that worked out to be about 2 hours apart so I make sure I start out with 300 calories per bottle then at the first rest stop i eat 300 calories to cover the next hour and fill 1 bottle with 300 calories of HEED to cover the 2nd hour. The 2nd bottle than becomes strctly an electrolyte bottle with water and NUUN tablets. This has worked flawlessly for me for 4 rides of 75-112 miles.

do yourself a favor and get that compact crank. I've seen SRAM Force and Rival as well as Ultegra compacts for under 200 recently
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Old 10-08-11, 05:44 PM
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Did just over 40 miles today at just under 3000ft. Front loaded the worst of the climbing @1700ft in the first 15 miles. Slow and steady I am definately thinking the climbing takes more out of me (electrolytes/nutrition) as I started to cramp in the same back of leg spot about 38 miles in. Have to work on that.
Test saddle is not working out any better as the chafing is still there. Will have to try another.
Todays ride:
https://ridewithgps.com/trips/414403

Last edited by ahultin; 10-08-11 at 05:44 PM. Reason: cant spell :)
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Old 10-08-11, 06:45 PM
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Originally Posted by ahultin
Did just over 40 miles today at just under 3000ft. Front loaded the worst of the climbing @1700ft in the first 15 miles. Slow and steady I am definately thinking the climbing takes more out of me (electrolytes/nutrition) as I started to cramp in the same back of leg spot about 38 miles in. Have to work on that.
Test saddle is not working out any better as the chafing is still there. Will have to try another.
Todays ride:
https://ridewithgps.com/trips/414403
Darn dude, my hat is off to you! There are the doe-er and there are the, the , the, ...............oh nevermind!

Keep doing what you are doing you are on the right track. Somedays are good days and some days are bad days. You keep practicing then you find the good days outweigh the bad days by far. Do this course a few times, you will get stronger and more fit. Then build on that.

Don't push too hard. Sometimes you got to ease up but keep at it. The cramps go away when you develope and get stronger.
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Old 10-08-11, 06:50 PM
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In the spirit of this thread I did a harder than usual ride for me yesterday. I thought it was moderately hilly, though you hill guys probably wouldn't. Roughly 1200 feet in 32 miles. The hills would have been OK though first gear definitely was required . The killer was the wind. It was the windiest ride of my life, riding either cross wind to be tossed around or into the wind to slog along. My ears hurt from the wind. I had to pedal down many of the hills to keep going, it was so windy. The uphill stretches were a relief from the wind because they were sheltered a bit. Some flat and open areas were so windy that my cadence in first gear was less than 60. Got chased by a pit bull. Smelled manure on the fields. Then it turned out that the one decent restaurant in Keosauqua where I was meeting the spouse for lunch was closed permanently. It was the hardest ride of my life. Yet I had a great time!
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Old 10-08-11, 08:58 PM
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I haven't been on my bike since Perris ahultin, still recovering, almost went on GMR with Beanz but just couldn't sleep last night. Tomorrow has to be the day, feel guilty as hell but maybe I needed the break.
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Old 10-09-11, 06:28 AM
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Originally Posted by Mr. Beanz
Well, it's the training and gains in fitness that allow you to recover on a climb. You are strong enough and fit enough so that you can slow the pace and relax your breathing. You make these kinds of gains and improvements while training on the climbs. That's why I so strongly suggest Clydes attack the climbs. Not attack at high speeds but attack as in keep trying, come back next week and try again. Don't wuss out, it hurts but try it again attacks.

I can recover climbing because I've done the work. If I struggle, I slow my pace and concentrate on breathing. If I hit a short 30 yard flat section, I ease the pace to recover rather than sprint on the easy section. It makes a difference in the end.

Now if you are a weak climber, you won't understand what I am saying because all your effort will be trying to keep yourself upright. The only way to lose the weak in your climbing is to attack long climbs. You will get stronger, more fit and you will understand. If you live your life avoiding the hills you will never see that gain and believe me, its a BIG gain and advantage!

As an example I will use Gina. If we don't climb for some time she loses the advantage. She's struggling so I tell her to back of half a step and relax, control her breathing. She says she can't. Why? Because her fitness is down and if she slow the pedals, she comes to a stop.

Now after 3 or 4 times of making the climb/trying the climb/working at the climb...she does much better. Her pedal stroke is so much smoother, body is relaxed. If she starts to struggle I tell he to back off half a step and she does while still maintaining her forward movement. She';; be the first to tell you ,working on the climbs is a plus. When we are done, I always point out to her how much smoother her stroke is and how much more relaxed she is when we practice the climbs. She agrees then goes down to the flats and kicks butt.

Now I say above "climb/trying the climb/working at the climb" because not all of us always make the climb. It's the effort that builds the strength and fitness. If you do a mile then have to stop to rest, do so. But get back on and do some more. Go as far as you can because you will roll back down the hill when you are done. Once you get to the bottom, you will tell yourself you wussed out because you know that you could do more.

Once you build up to doing a 3 or 4 mile climb, then do a longer climb. You will gain the fitness I mention that allows you to recover on the climb. If you never do it, never have done it, then you will never know what I am talking about. Once you get to this point, you will tell others why they should invest in climbing. Gina used to hate the climbs (40 yard sections of the trail). Now when I talk about climbing to our buds, she sits there and shakes her head, Yup, yup, yup! Because it works. If a rider avoids this, then he only cheats himself to what he can really achieve as far as riding.
Beanz - question. Since I am starting to train for my first triathlon in July, I signed up for some shorter races to get me ready. One of the races is climbing 82 flights of stairs to raise money for the American Lung Association. I think of this race in February as a mental challenge. In your opinion, will stair climbing improve my fitness for hills? Of course, there is nothing like actual hill climbing, I know.
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Old 10-09-11, 08:23 AM
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Originally Posted by jeepseahawk
I haven't been on my bike since Perris ahultin, still recovering, almost went on GMR with Beanz but just couldn't sleep last night. Tomorrow has to be the day, feel guilty as hell but maybe I needed the break.
Go out and ride today but think of it as a recovery ride. Take it easy and just enjoy the scenery . I did that sunday after Perris and it helped (well it was also a "get back on the horse" thing so i didn't shoot it)
I took my kids with me which forces it as a recovery ride since my daughter has no problem making sure i go no faster than 10mph
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Old 10-09-11, 09:12 AM
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Originally Posted by zencalm
In your opinion, will stair climbing improve my fitness for hills? Of course, there is nothing like actual hill climbing, I know.
Heck yeah, as far as overall fitness and cardio. Like you say, mix it in with some climbing on the bike, you're good.

But IME, I've tried these types of approach to cycling fitness but once I start doing big climbs as training, I lose the stairs just because I'm concentrating on the bike and applying all energy there.
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