First "B" shop ride of the year (yikes!)
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First "B" shop ride of the year (yikes!)
Last night I went on my first group ride of the season from the LBS. Those around here last year may remember my season was spent working to get from the "C" flight "fun and fitness" group to the slowest of the three "B" groups, the so-called Bumble Bs (the next fastest group is the Honey Bs and the fastest is the Killer Bs; the As are simply called the "racer dudes and dudettes"). Well, I thought this year I'd start with the Bumbles and see how it goes.
Well, it was an interesting experience. We left the shop and headed north into a stiff 15-17 mph wind out of the northeast. For some reason the group never formed echelons, but a double pace line instead, which was probably just as well, since we only had half the road to work with. They kept a consistent pace of about 19.5 into this wind, and I sat at the back, dodging the half-dozen or so who got shelled off during the northerly stretch, but I finally lost the leaders in the wind at about 12.5 miles.
Fortunately they stopped to regroup at mile 13, the half-way point. I thought the leader talked about splitting into two, with each group trying to stay intact and work together, so when we started off again I didn't make any effort to stay with the front bunch, and kind of sat up waiting for the 6 or 8 behind to catch me, but after a mile or so I looked back and they were nowhere to be found. I guess rather than complete the loop they decided to turn around and go straight home.
So now I'm out there all by myself trying to bridge a gap of about a half mile to reach a group I couldn't stay with in the first place. Over the next 12 miles I did manage to reel in 4 or 5 stragglers, and finished within a few minutes of the lead group, but I was exhausted. 26 miles at 17.7 mph average (for me - I don't know how fast the leaders came in).
It's kind of demoralizing to be going 18.5 to 19 mph and feel like you're the slowpoke in the bunch. But that's OK. I'll be back and I'll keep getting better/faster. But all that time chasing by myself gave me time to wonder which is the better metaphor when considering a group ride that you can't quite keep up with - is it a mother devouring its young, or simply Darwinism in action?
Well, it was an interesting experience. We left the shop and headed north into a stiff 15-17 mph wind out of the northeast. For some reason the group never formed echelons, but a double pace line instead, which was probably just as well, since we only had half the road to work with. They kept a consistent pace of about 19.5 into this wind, and I sat at the back, dodging the half-dozen or so who got shelled off during the northerly stretch, but I finally lost the leaders in the wind at about 12.5 miles.
Fortunately they stopped to regroup at mile 13, the half-way point. I thought the leader talked about splitting into two, with each group trying to stay intact and work together, so when we started off again I didn't make any effort to stay with the front bunch, and kind of sat up waiting for the 6 or 8 behind to catch me, but after a mile or so I looked back and they were nowhere to be found. I guess rather than complete the loop they decided to turn around and go straight home.
So now I'm out there all by myself trying to bridge a gap of about a half mile to reach a group I couldn't stay with in the first place. Over the next 12 miles I did manage to reel in 4 or 5 stragglers, and finished within a few minutes of the lead group, but I was exhausted. 26 miles at 17.7 mph average (for me - I don't know how fast the leaders came in).
It's kind of demoralizing to be going 18.5 to 19 mph and feel like you're the slowpoke in the bunch. But that's OK. I'll be back and I'll keep getting better/faster. But all that time chasing by myself gave me time to wonder which is the better metaphor when considering a group ride that you can't quite keep up with - is it a mother devouring its young, or simply Darwinism in action?
#2
SuperGimp
Oops. Misheard that one!
You say you were demoralized trying to keep up but then you spent the majority of the ride solo into the wind. Don't let it get you down. One of these days you'll be feeling great and pulling hard and everybody else will be wheezing to keep up, you'll see. At least you didn't abandon!
Maybe you need something like this:
https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...peed........#3
You say you were demoralized trying to keep up but then you spent the majority of the ride solo into the wind. Don't let it get you down. One of these days you'll be feeling great and pulling hard and everybody else will be wheezing to keep up, you'll see. At least you didn't abandon!
Maybe you need something like this:
https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...peed........#3
#3
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Not that I know a darn thing but how can a 20 mph double pace line group be the lowest of the b rides?
Our b group here states 14-16 mph average
Our b group here states 14-16 mph average
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The shop's classifications are (roughly):
C: 13+ mph no-drop
Bumble B: 17-18 mph
Honey B: 19-21 mph
Killer B: 22-23 mph
A: 24+ mph
Those are total ride averages, including traffic stops, so typical speed on the flats is a little higher than those numbers. In fact, on our ride last night the leader suggested that anyone who wanted to take a pull at the front should plan on keeping it at or above 19 to keep the average in line. I guess it's a fast bunch. The official shop-sponsored team each year tries to complete a century on the Speedway track during TdC in as much under 4 hours as they can. That is one scary paceline.
C: 13+ mph no-drop
Bumble B: 17-18 mph
Honey B: 19-21 mph
Killer B: 22-23 mph
A: 24+ mph
Those are total ride averages, including traffic stops, so typical speed on the flats is a little higher than those numbers. In fact, on our ride last night the leader suggested that anyone who wanted to take a pull at the front should plan on keeping it at or above 19 to keep the average in line. I guess it's a fast bunch. The official shop-sponsored team each year tries to complete a century on the Speedway track during TdC in as much under 4 hours as they can. That is one scary paceline.
Last edited by CraigB; 04-06-12 at 01:40 PM.
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Terrain was mostly flat in the first half, and *very* gently rolling in the last. I think my Garmin report showed something like less than 250 feet of climbing total in 26 miles.
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I'm just from Northern California and there isn't too much all flat around me.
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No one's going to mistake the terrain around here for "rugged," but at least it's not billiard-table flat like east central Illinois. I know, I lived in Champaign for 5 years.
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On the plus side, Garmin showed the ride burned over 1900 calories. Not that I believe them.
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Something's not working out right with the numbers.
If the ride out is into headwinds 15-17mph and you can almost hang with guys riding 19.5mph ... then you come back around the loop (15-17mph tailwind) and average 17.7mph for the whole ride. So you would have ridden about 16mph coming back.
15-17mph tailwind can give a nice push, I'm guessing 2mph "free" speed or only about 14mph actual effort.
The only way that makes sense to me is if you got totally crushed when you couldn't draft on the last 1/2 mile going out, then you were losing too much momentum on the rolling climbs or the winds died/shifted.
Or you figured your average based on elapsed time not moving time.
Getting dropped is just one of those things that lets you know where you are in your abilities and what you brought to the ride that day. It's not fun, but it's not good or bad. It just is. Could be that there were some "A" riders looking for a soft ride that got caught up in it and cut loose. Maybe it is a hazing ritual. Welcome to their group.
If the ride out is into headwinds 15-17mph and you can almost hang with guys riding 19.5mph ... then you come back around the loop (15-17mph tailwind) and average 17.7mph for the whole ride. So you would have ridden about 16mph coming back.
15-17mph tailwind can give a nice push, I'm guessing 2mph "free" speed or only about 14mph actual effort.
The only way that makes sense to me is if you got totally crushed when you couldn't draft on the last 1/2 mile going out, then you were losing too much momentum on the rolling climbs or the winds died/shifted.
Or you figured your average based on elapsed time not moving time.
Getting dropped is just one of those things that lets you know where you are in your abilities and what you brought to the ride that day. It's not fun, but it's not good or bad. It just is. Could be that there were some "A" riders looking for a soft ride that got caught up in it and cut loose. Maybe it is a hazing ritual. Welcome to their group.
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Last night I went on my first group ride of the season from the LBS. Those around here last year may remember my season was spent working to get from the "C" flight "fun and fitness" group to the slowest of the three "B" groups, the so-called Bumble Bs (the next fastest group is the Honey Bs and the fastest is the Killer Bs; the As are simply called the "racer dudes and dudettes"). Well, I thought this year I'd start with the Bumbles and see how it goes.
Well, it was an interesting experience. We left the shop and headed north into a stiff 15-17 mph wind out of the northeast. For some reason the group never formed echelons, but a double pace line instead, which was probably just as well, since we only had half the road to work with. They kept a consistent pace of about 19.5 into this wind, and I sat at the back, dodging the half-dozen or so who got shelled off during the northerly stretch, but I finally lost the leaders in the wind at about 12.5 miles.
Fortunately they stopped to regroup at mile 13, the half-way point. I thought the leader talked about splitting into two, with each group trying to stay intact and work together, so when we started off again I didn't make any effort to stay with the front bunch, and kind of sat up waiting for the 6 or 8 behind to catch me, but after a mile or so I looked back and they were nowhere to be found. I guess rather than complete the loop they decided to turn around and go straight home.
So now I'm out there all by myself trying to bridge a gap of about a half mile to reach a group I couldn't stay with in the first place. Over the next 12 miles I did manage to reel in 4 or 5 stragglers, and finished within a few minutes of the lead group, but I was exhausted. 26 miles at 17.7 mph average (for me - I don't know how fast the leaders came in).
It's kind of demoralizing to be going 18.5 to 19 mph and feel like you're the slowpoke in the bunch. But that's OK. I'll be back and I'll keep getting better/faster. But all that time chasing by myself gave me time to wonder which is the better metaphor when considering a group ride that you can't quite keep up with - is it a mother devouring its young, or simply Darwinism in action?
Well, it was an interesting experience. We left the shop and headed north into a stiff 15-17 mph wind out of the northeast. For some reason the group never formed echelons, but a double pace line instead, which was probably just as well, since we only had half the road to work with. They kept a consistent pace of about 19.5 into this wind, and I sat at the back, dodging the half-dozen or so who got shelled off during the northerly stretch, but I finally lost the leaders in the wind at about 12.5 miles.
Fortunately they stopped to regroup at mile 13, the half-way point. I thought the leader talked about splitting into two, with each group trying to stay intact and work together, so when we started off again I didn't make any effort to stay with the front bunch, and kind of sat up waiting for the 6 or 8 behind to catch me, but after a mile or so I looked back and they were nowhere to be found. I guess rather than complete the loop they decided to turn around and go straight home.
So now I'm out there all by myself trying to bridge a gap of about a half mile to reach a group I couldn't stay with in the first place. Over the next 12 miles I did manage to reel in 4 or 5 stragglers, and finished within a few minutes of the lead group, but I was exhausted. 26 miles at 17.7 mph average (for me - I don't know how fast the leaders came in).
It's kind of demoralizing to be going 18.5 to 19 mph and feel like you're the slowpoke in the bunch. But that's OK. I'll be back and I'll keep getting better/faster. But all that time chasing by myself gave me time to wonder which is the better metaphor when considering a group ride that you can't quite keep up with - is it a mother devouring its young, or simply Darwinism in action?
Good on you for wanting to continue and staying motivated under those circumstances. I'm not wired that way I guess.
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humans can be so....rude
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#14
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Some of the benefits of riding a group that is well disciplined is the gain you get in speed for output due to the rest time you get not pulling, learning to maintain a proper speed while pulling, and the safety of riding with such a (properly taught) group at speed/close.
It really burns my ass when you get out to a "no drop" group ride with some low (or high as perspective may have it) advertized average speed, and then it turns into a hammer-fest and leaves new riders to that group off in the weeds somewhere to catch up at some regroup point by themselves. The whole point of making a group ride IS to ride with others. Even if you have a rider who gets shelled, there should be some person sweeping the group and making sure these folks get back safely. Heck, folks can ride alone from home.
It really burns my ass when you get out to a "no drop" group ride with some low (or high as perspective may have it) advertized average speed, and then it turns into a hammer-fest and leaves new riders to that group off in the weeds somewhere to catch up at some regroup point by themselves. The whole point of making a group ride IS to ride with others. Even if you have a rider who gets shelled, there should be some person sweeping the group and making sure these folks get back safely. Heck, folks can ride alone from home.
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Something's not working out right with the numbers.
If the ride out is into headwinds 15-17mph and you can almost hang with guys riding 19.5mph ... then you come back around the loop (15-17mph tailwind) and average 17.7mph for the whole ride. So you would have ridden about 16mph coming back.
15-17mph tailwind can give a nice push, I'm guessing 2mph "free" speed or only about 14mph actual effort.
The only way that makes sense to me is if you got totally crushed when you couldn't draft on the last 1/2 mile going out, then you were losing too much momentum on the rolling climbs or the winds died/shifted.
Or you figured your average based on elapsed time not moving time.
Getting dropped is just one of those things that lets you know where you are in your abilities and what you brought to the ride that day. It's not fun, but it's not good or bad. It just is. Could be that there were some "A" riders looking for a soft ride that got caught up in it and cut loose. Maybe it is a hazing ritual. Welcome to their group.
If the ride out is into headwinds 15-17mph and you can almost hang with guys riding 19.5mph ... then you come back around the loop (15-17mph tailwind) and average 17.7mph for the whole ride. So you would have ridden about 16mph coming back.
15-17mph tailwind can give a nice push, I'm guessing 2mph "free" speed or only about 14mph actual effort.
The only way that makes sense to me is if you got totally crushed when you couldn't draft on the last 1/2 mile going out, then you were losing too much momentum on the rolling climbs or the winds died/shifted.
Or you figured your average based on elapsed time not moving time.
Getting dropped is just one of those things that lets you know where you are in your abilities and what you brought to the ride that day. It's not fun, but it's not good or bad. It just is. Could be that there were some "A" riders looking for a soft ride that got caught up in it and cut loose. Maybe it is a hazing ritual. Welcome to their group.
Here's the graph:
#16
Senior Member
Something's not working out right with the numbers.
If the ride out is into headwinds 15-17mph and you can almost hang with guys riding 19.5mph ... then you come back around the loop (15-17mph tailwind) and average 17.7mph for the whole ride. So you would have ridden about 16mph coming back.
15-17mph tailwind can give a nice push, I'm guessing 2mph "free" speed or only about 14mph actual effort.
The only way that makes sense to me is if you got totally crushed when you couldn't draft on the last 1/2 mile going out, then you were losing too much momentum on the rolling climbs or the winds died/shifted.
Or you figured your average based on elapsed time not moving time.
If the ride out is into headwinds 15-17mph and you can almost hang with guys riding 19.5mph ... then you come back around the loop (15-17mph tailwind) and average 17.7mph for the whole ride. So you would have ridden about 16mph coming back.
15-17mph tailwind can give a nice push, I'm guessing 2mph "free" speed or only about 14mph actual effort.
The only way that makes sense to me is if you got totally crushed when you couldn't draft on the last 1/2 mile going out, then you were losing too much momentum on the rolling climbs or the winds died/shifted.
Or you figured your average based on elapsed time not moving time.
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Some of the benefits of riding a group that is well disciplined is the gain you get in speed for output due to the rest time you get not pulling, learning to maintain a proper speed while pulling, and the safety of riding with such a (properly taught) group at speed/close.
It really burns my ass when you get out to a "no drop" group ride with some low (or high as perspective may have it) advertized average speed, and then it turns into a hammer-fest and leaves new riders to that group off in the weeds somewhere to catch up at some regroup point by themselves. The whole point of making a group ride IS to ride with others. Even if you have a rider who gets shelled, there should be some person sweeping the group and making sure these folks get back safely. Heck, folks can ride alone from home.
It really burns my ass when you get out to a "no drop" group ride with some low (or high as perspective may have it) advertized average speed, and then it turns into a hammer-fest and leaves new riders to that group off in the weeds somewhere to catch up at some regroup point by themselves. The whole point of making a group ride IS to ride with others. Even if you have a rider who gets shelled, there should be some person sweeping the group and making sure these folks get back safely. Heck, folks can ride alone from home.
#18
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And if I hit a Hill like that it would put a serious dent in my average speed, I'm sure.
Hey, are we gonna do a ride in your neck of the woods sometime before the corn is so tall you can't see the pickups barreling down on you from the right and left at the road intersections?
Hey, are we gonna do a ride in your neck of the woods sometime before the corn is so tall you can't see the pickups barreling down on you from the right and left at the road intersections?
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Fred "The Real Fred"
#20
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You need one of their kits to keep up with them.
https://i256.photobucket.com/albums/h...rDeCure034.jpg
https://i256.photobucket.com/albums/h...rDeCure034.jpg
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Good ride report
Its early in the season yet up in the north, lots of fair weather riders just coming out.
Thats sounds like the right way to go. It can get discouraging riding with a bunch of faster people but you do learn what it takes to get better and there is a satisfaction with that of course. One thing I have learned is to get an early start on building some miles. Way to hang in there CraigB.
I'll be back and I'll keep getting better/faster.
#22
Senior Member
Kudos to you for trying the B ride, not quitting and riding hard the entire time.
Last edited by lenny866; 04-08-12 at 03:25 PM.
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Craig,
I think you might want to look at this in another way. In my view this was a very successful first B ride. You were right there or thereabouts with the lead group for the first half of the ride. For the second half the group split in two and you clearly outpaced the second group. In chasing the lead group you reeled in several more riders so in my estimation you finished in the top third of all the riders that started the ride. A success for sure a few more rides and you will get into the rhythm of the group which I think is critical.
Well done!
I think you might want to look at this in another way. In my view this was a very successful first B ride. You were right there or thereabouts with the lead group for the first half of the ride. For the second half the group split in two and you clearly outpaced the second group. In chasing the lead group you reeled in several more riders so in my estimation you finished in the top third of all the riders that started the ride. A success for sure a few more rides and you will get into the rhythm of the group which I think is critical.
Well done!
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Well, assuming I can get out of work on time tonight, I'm going to try this again. I think they usually stick to pretty much the same routes most of the time, so it should be easy to compare. I guess the wind is the unknown variable. Anyway, we'll see how it goes.