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  1. #26
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    I am with your original point.

    When you are ready, you will have a pool of high quality bicycles to choose from at very low prices to upgrade to when the trend ends.

    It's all good.
    Old steel makes me squeal!

  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Telly View Post
    If that's what you got out of my post then I'm sorry but you didn't catch the spirit of my post. Unfortunately its difficult to convey thoughts over forums.
    Well it's hard not to take it that way considering you had this gem bragging about your skills vs the "posers" just a few weeks ago.

    Why do you get to decide what is/isn't a poser? What's ruining this sport is not people who have the income to buy a nice bike but decide to only ride it a few miles, it's the elitist attitudes that some people get because they feel they own the copyright to the term "real cyclist".

    Worry less about how other people ride their bikes and just ride your own more.

  3. #28
    Senior Member tergal's Avatar
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    I think i understand where telly is coming from, it is hard to convey a point across a written medium.

    I see his point as being against people who , treat other riders as second class just because we can't afford ( or dont want to spend) the carbon or don't want to wear the Skin tights. Yet they ride because it is fashionable and hip.

    To those rallying against the OP, Chill .

    I don't share telly goals, i have my own i set my own and follow my own. Does that make me a poseur hmmm i doubt it, is he calling me a poser i don't think so .

    Anyway chill all , we are all friends and riders.
    Tact is for people who arenít witty enough to use sarcasm.

    Early helplessness is the price we pay for later brilliance. Or, at least our later capacity for non-idiocy

  4. #29
    What, me worry? Telly's Avatar
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    You really came away with the link as bragging about my skills vs the posers? Seriously?
    And do you really think I have an "elitist attitude", or ANY of my posts sound like I even consider myself being close to a "real cyclist"???

    I worry about my community, and the effects others seemingly participating in this activity have on the whole, especially now when there's a chance for something good to come out of the current situation. Of course I could shut-up and cycle not care about anything but my fat ass... but then again if everyone did this, this forum wouldn't exist, would it?

    I'm not trying to force my views or opinions on you, just voicing my concerns about something that I deeply care about... so please don't try to pin labels like the above on me since I believe that I've never acted in a way to deserve them.


    Edit: Sorry Tergal, I was writing my post when yours came up... it's an answer to Paisan's post

  5. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by paisan View Post
    Well it's hard not to take it that way considering you had this gem bragging about your skills vs the "posers" just a few weeks ago.

    Why do you get to decide what is/isn't a poser? What's ruining this sport is not people who have the income to buy a nice bike but decide to only ride it a few miles, it's the elitist attitudes that some people get because they feel they own the copyright to the term "real cyclist".

    Worry less about how other people ride their bikes and just ride your own more.

    Chill out! He doesn't get to decide anything. He simply is stating his opinion. You can start a thread against elitists if you like and folks get to agree or disagree with you but they should never attack you in such fashion.

  6. #31
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    I understand Telly's point completely.

    I too would label someone who has an expensive carbon bike, dresses up in full regalia only to ride for 30 minutes on a promenade as a poser. But then again, I'm a 55 year old fat guy who would not dare be seen in anything skin tight and who rides the roads where I live for 30 minutes and is exhausted - so what do I know? Maybe some day if I ever lose enough weight to look decent in something other than the over sized t-shirts and shorts I ride in I'll think differently.

  7. #32
    Senior Member goldfinch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tergal View Post
    I see his point as being against people who , treat other riders as second class just because we can't afford ( or dont want to spend) the carbon or don't want to wear the Skin tights. Yet they ride because it is fashionable and hip.

    To those rallying against the OP, Chill .

    I don't share telly goals, i have my own i set my own and follow my own. Does that make me a poseur hmmm i doubt it, is he calling me a poser i don't think so .

    Anyway chill all , we are all friends and riders.

    Well said.

    We aren't all friends though. I am sure there are a number of posters here who have no desire to be my friend, like those who take side bets behind the scenes on what kind of responses I might make to a post.

  8. #33
    Senior Member tergal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paisan View Post
    Well it's hard not to take it that way considering you had this gem bragging about your skills vs the "posers" just a few weeks ago.
    <sigh> I told my self i wouldn't get in to this, hell i dont even know telly just some bloke riding a bike, but nope i just have to go and post don't i.


    Before reading this let it be know, i am not tellys friend, i am just posting this becuase i think how you worded your last post could have been a bit less aggressive on a subject which really isn't that life threaten. Honestly i can't seem him going out and hurting the "posers" just because we didn't convince him they aren't

    In regards to his "gem" i just reread that to make sure i wasn't defending a dropkick , and all i got out of it was. Fat guy (sorry not to judge) road a long distance ride and is dam proud (right fully) of what he achieved.

    Lines like ,

    " There were plenty of entries, 850+ to be exact of all ages and everyone was in a great mood."

    and
    "this must sound mundane, but for myself, today was a major victory; for the hills which I managed to finally climb, and especially for persevering and not quitting"

    The only brag point i see straight up is
    "since I was too busy overtaking everyone!"
    And to be honest i brag when i overtake a bloody turtle let alone someone else on two wheels. Doesn't he have a right to be a little proud of going from a inactive to a active person ?

    I really can't see how you can take his"gem" post badly but each to thier own.

    In regards
    "elitist attitudes that some people get because they feel they own the copyright to the term "real cyclist". "

    That won't ruin Cycling, nethier will tellys lyric arch nemisis . Cycling as been around for a long time and will be around for a long time after we die. I am not a real Cyclist in the term that i have never competed, i always ride alone doesn't bother me in the least bit.

    As I said before we all need to chill a bit, you always seem to give good advice ( a lot of which I have taken on board) .


    Anyway why am i posting in her defending telly's on post , telly defend your own post I am going to read a book


    hmm hope this doesn't class and flaming and get me banned

    @ goldfinch , i will be your friend you are so tiny you would probably fit in my pocket
    Tact is for people who arenít witty enough to use sarcasm.

    Early helplessness is the price we pay for later brilliance. Or, at least our later capacity for non-idiocy

  9. #34
    Neil_B
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    So Telly, is it likely that after the elections the new government will renegotiate the "austerity" program agreed to as part of the bailout from the rest of Europe? (The austerity measures were agreed to in exchange for helping Greece avoid default, for those who weren't aware.)

    So while the Greek economy flatlines, there are riots in Athens over cuts in government services and benefits (public employees can retire at 58 and often work 3/4 days), people buy expensive bikes...... Do I under you correctly, is that your complaint? Will the bikes be sold because the owners got bored with them or because they need to put food and wine on the table?

  10. #35
    Neil_B
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    Quote Originally Posted by tergal View Post
    <sigh> I told my self i wouldn't get in to this, hell i dont even know telly just some bloke riding a bike, but nope i just have to go and post don't i.


    Before reading this let it be know, i am not tellys friend, i am just posting this becuase i think how you worded your last post could have been a bit less aggressive on a subject which really isn't that life threaten. Honestly i can't seem him going out and hurting the "posers" just because we didn't convince him they aren't

    In regards to his "gem" i just reread that to make sure i wasn't defending a dropkick , and all i got out of it was. Fat guy (sorry not to judge) road a long distance ride and is dam proud (right fully) of what he achieved.

    Lines like ,

    " There were plenty of entries, 850+ to be exact of all ages and everyone was in a great mood."

    and
    "this must sound mundane, but for myself, today was a major victory; for the hills which I managed to finally climb, and especially for persevering and not quitting"

    The only brag point i see straight up is
    "since I was too busy overtaking everyone!"
    And to be honest i brag when i overtake a bloody turtle let alone someone else on two wheels. Doesn't he have a right to be a little proud of going from a inactive to a active person ?

    I really can't see how you can take his"gem" post badly but each to thier own.

    In regards
    "elitist attitudes that some people get because they feel they own the copyright to the term "real cyclist". "

    That won't ruin Cycling, nethier will tellys lyric arch nemisis . Cycling as been around for a long time and will be around for a long time after we die. I am not a real Cyclist in the term that i have never competed, i always ride alone doesn't bother me in the least bit.

    As I said before we all need to chill a bit, you always seem to give good advice ( a lot of which I have taken on board) .


    Anyway why am i posting in her defending telly's on post , telly defend your own post I am going to read a book


    hmm hope this doesn't class and flaming and get me banned

    @ goldfinch , i will be your friend you are so tiny you would probably fit in my pocket
    If Paisan were an amplifier, he would go to eleven on a daily basis. :-)

  11. #36
    Neil_B
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    Quote Originally Posted by goldfinch View Post
    Well said.

    We aren't all friends though. I am sure there are a number of posters here who have no desire to be my friend, like those who take side bets behind the scenes on what kind of responses I might make to a post.
    Keep nursing those wounds.... you never know just what it might grow into.

  12. #37
    Senior Member tergal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neil_B View Post
    If Paisan were an amplifier, he would go to eleven on a daily basis. :-)
    no just no , dont get my started on audio product that are labelled with higher numbers "because they are louder" . that is not a rant we want to hear from me
    Tact is for people who arenít witty enough to use sarcasm.

    Early helplessness is the price we pay for later brilliance. Or, at least our later capacity for non-idiocy

  13. #38
    What, me worry? Telly's Avatar
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    I highly doubt any change will happen to the austerity program after the elections, the country's already committed to the EBU/IMF and except for a radical change in politics forcing it out of the EEC, things will continue as they are.

    But my "complaint" isn't in why people are buying expensive bikes, or if they have enough money to put food on the table; that's each persons business... it's because of the current financial situation where people are finally turning to cycling since gasoline, as of this week has passed €2 per liter and cycling is steadily, but slowly gaining momentum with more and more people demanding infrastructure (bike paths, better planning, etc), and local municipalities promising the moon and stars before election time, and when all this is over and all the crowds begin thinning after the summer those same municipalities will turn around and state that cycling has dropped and there's no reason why they should invest in an infrastructure which isn't used.

    Also because of this sudden boom with people purchasing expensive equipment, most LBS have pushed their prices upwards taking advantage of the market and even servicing a bike now costs double compared to what it cost six months ago. Prices have skyrocketed because of demand, and unfortunately even free market competition isn't bringing them down. A good example: a couple of months ago I ordered a pair of Joe's No Flat tubes, and were quoted at €12 each. The order (locally) took two weeks to reach my LBS and in those two weeks, the price went from 12, to 14 and eventually I paid 16 euros each tube. When I looked into the currency exchange prices, I was surprised to find that the cost of the tubes should have gone down instead of up!

    Note: I hope the above all make sense since I'm having a splitting migraine headache.

  14. #39
    Senior Member mprelaw's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Beanz View Post
    I wonder just where one draws the line of "posers" status. Some will say if a rider has never done a century, then they are a poser. Some say if you have never climbed 5,000 ft. Others will say a century with 10,000 ft, others will say if you dont race, where does it end? Where does it begin?
    It ends when you don't give a bleep about what other people think and say about you, as long as you're enjoying yourself doing what you're doing.

  15. #40
    Watching and waiting. jethro56's Avatar
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    First of all let me say that this is not an attack on anyone. I'm talking about "real" thinking. "real cyclist","real americans" and so forth. I had this thought a couple weeks ago as I was riding through town on my roadbike.Being 85 degrees on a sunday there were more bikes out that I'd seen ever before. At first I was elated and then the thought crept in "I'm the only one on a roadbike. These aren't 'real' cyclists." Later I began thinking that the LBS's and Walmart don't stock roadbikes. They were just riding what was available. I'm the oddball and probably thought of by some as a "poseur" in my cycling apparel and therefore not a "real cyclist".

    So what is the result of this mindset? I think of it as Tribalism. So pick out an observation about someone and assume a whole bunch of stuff about them based on that observation. Sure makes life simpler. Every thing you need to know about someone can be learned in 1 second. How many of us has posted on other forums where we've let it be known that we weigh over 200 lbs and have been told to get down to 150 lbs? Only then will we be real cyclists. Until then shut up and let the real people talk about how great we are.

    So the next time you find yourself slipping into real thinking There's one finger pointing at someone else but three pointing at you.
    Last edited by jethro56; 04-14-12 at 10:29 AM.

  16. #41
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    Let'em evolve their cycling as it comes to them. Eventually, they'll squish a thumb loading or unloading the bikes onto the rack, or the wife will go early, by bike, or some such thing, or there won't be a parking spot at the marina, etc.

  17. #42
    Senior Member NCbiker's Avatar
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    Ride and let ride!

  18. #43
    Neil_B
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    Quote Originally Posted by Telly View Post
    Note: I hope the above all make sense since I'm having a splitting migraine headache.
    Really? What drugs are you taking? Let us know so we can tell you that you are managing your pain incorrectly..... oh, sorry, that's a different thread.

  19. #44
    Senior Member jr59's Avatar
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    Ride what you want/afford.
    Wear what you want/afford.
    Don't be so quick to judge other people,
    because they choose different stuff!

    I swear, this place sometimes gets as bad as the 41!
    Gravity hates us all, but it hates me more than thin people!

  20. #45
    Senior Member tony_merlino's Avatar
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    I think there's no ambiguity about what constitutes a "real" cyclist. Real cyclists ride bicycles. That's all there is to it. It's a beautiful Saturday here in good ol' Nutley, NJ, and I'm going out in a few minutes to be a real cyclist for a couple of hours. No kids today, no responsibilities. The road is calling...
    L'asino di Buridano...

  21. #46
    Banned. Mr. Beanz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Telly View Post
    even servicing a bike now costs double compared to what it cost six months ago. .
    There ya go! Only posers are affected by service costs and not us real cyclist that maintain and build our own bicycles and wheels.

    Not to say I don't understand your point in the OP but it's a little silly to label other riders as posers not knowing how they actually ride. I mean c'mon, you see 30% of the cars at the marina with bike racks and you know where they all live? We drive to a section of the trail where we ride. I'm sure because of where we park others think we do a short 25 miler. In reality, we head inland first, double back to the coast, then back to the truck. We do anywhere from 42 to 60 miles but those that don't know would have no idea of our distance.


    I've been called a poser. I remember a few years back a female rider called me a poser on the forums because I liked to wear a tank top on my rides. She said real cyclist wear a jersey. Funny, I did 7300 miles that year, 23 centuries, 4 centuries with 10,000 ft 4 years in a row while she rode her trainer in the comfort of her living room watching soap operas. But she wore a jersey so that made me the poser!

    Unless you have a chance to speak with the riders, then one should not assume how and where they ride, cause you just may be wrong. Not to mention you say the couple had brand spanking new bikes. I dunno about you but my first few rides were not centuries.


    Quote Originally Posted by mprelaw View Post
    It ends when you don't give a bleep about what other people think and say about you, as long as you're enjoying yourself doing what you're doing.
    So true! That's why I can sit back, laugh and enjoy this thread. After 70,000+ miles, other riders still call me a poser!
    Last edited by Mr. Beanz; 04-14-12 at 10:51 AM.

  22. #47
    Senior Member goldfinch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neil_B View Post
    Really? What drugs are you taking? Let us know so we can tell you that you are managing your pain incorrectly..... oh, sorry, that's a different thread.

    You and others were talking about it so I did not realize my thoughts were not welcome. A friend recently switched pain drugs with much better results so her experience was in my mind.

  23. #48
    2 Fat 2 Furious contango's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aggst1 View Post
    I am puzzled how easily the OPs comment/observation/frustration was received differently by some people. I don't see where some posters see that he is jealous because the other people have nicer bikes, or have more money (or more debt...), or the one that pretty much defends his right to spend his money anyway he likes!!! Who said the opposite? And what makes that only understood by an American audience only? The way I read it is that a couple of lazy people (ok yuppies) bought expensive bikes to ride around at very slow speeds at the marina where lots of people walk etc and they are so lazy that they won't ride their bikes there even though it is a little over a mile away. I see folks that do things to be seen and not to enjoy/exercise all the time too. Hummer drivers come to mind...
    I must admit I read it with the same kind of "huh?" mindset as I feel when people drive the mile to the gym, complain bitterly about the lack of parking, when all they do at the gym is walk on the treadmill for half an hour and then drive home again. In my worldview it would save them the drive, the parking hassle, and the gym membership fees to just walk to the gym, walk around the block and then walk home again.
    "For a list of ways technology has failed to improve quality of life, press three"

  24. #49
    Travelling hopefully chasm54's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by contango View Post
    I must admit I read it with the same kind of "huh?" mindset as I feel when people drive the mile to the gym, complain bitterly about the lack of parking, when all they do at the gym is walk on the treadmill for half an hour and then drive home again. In my worldview it would save them the drive, the parking hassle, and the gym membership fees to just walk to the gym, walk around the block and then walk home again.
    This. I'm with the OP. I don't give a damn how much money people spend on their bikes, how they dress, how much they weigh, how fast they can ride. But to put your road bikes on an SUV for a 2km trip to the marina, then unload them and ride around for a half-hour before driving them home, is indicative of pretension. There's no envy or intolerance involved in pointing that out.
    There have been many days when I haven't felt like riding, but there has never been a day when I was sorry I rode.

  25. #50
    2 Fat 2 Furious contango's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluegoatwoods View Post
    And don't forget that they are often the rudest riders on the road, giving the rest of us a bad name.

    So, to Telly; Right on! Rave on and Rant on!

    I'm with ya, brother.
    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Beanz View Post
    I wonder just where one draws the line of "posers" status. Some will say if a rider has never done a century, then they are a poser. Some say if you have never climbed 5,000 ft. Others will say a century with 10,000 ft, others will say if you dont race, where does it end? Where does it begin?
    I figure if someone wants to drop a vast sum of cash on a bike and clothing that makes them look like they're training for the Tour they have the absolute right to do it, whether they are serious contenders for the TdF's yellow jersey or so heavy the bike can only just hold them and so slow the bike is on the verge of tipping over.

    When people appear to think the rules of the road don't apply to them because they bought something expensive (whether that's a bike, a car, whatever) that's when they start to cross the line into "poseur" in my book. If someone is faster than me, slower than me, richer than me, poorer than me, that's just the way things are. But when someone figures they are better than me purely because of what they spent on their bike/car/whatever, or thinks they won't be able to match me because they spent less, something is wrong.

    The OP referred to the people loading their carbon bikes onto the X5 in terms of how he "received a indifferent look from the guy who went on looking over my bike with a sarcastic expression". That pretty much qualifies a degree of snobbishness, which would push them into poseur territory even if they were fast enough to drop a world class sprinter.
    "For a list of ways technology has failed to improve quality of life, press three"

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